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Author
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Topic: Fur's Savage build - 22-250
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted April 04, 2015 07:59 AM
Warning. I have found dry lube to be particularly bad for dies. Can cause scoring.
Good hunting. El Bee
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31462 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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Fur_n_Dirt
So. Ariz. Zone Tech. Expert
Member # 4467
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posted April 04, 2015 03:38 PM
Oh shit
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Fur_n_Dirt
So. Ariz. Zone Tech. Expert
Member # 4467
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posted April 21, 2015 03:53 PM
Oh shit.. The store that I bought my suppresor from closed it's doors! They said on their website that they will still deliver class 3 by appointment..
There is no way to leave a message or contact them.
I am very nervous about this situation!!
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted April 21, 2015 05:27 PM
Yes, you have a right to be nervous. The few times I have seen a business go under when I had something on order, I lost. They have bigger problems than honoring their obligations.
But, after throwing that wet blanket...good luck!
Good hunting. El Bee
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
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Fur_n_Dirt
So. Ariz. Zone Tech. Expert
Member # 4467
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posted April 21, 2015 07:08 PM
I have some hope since the ATF is involved in the transaction. We'll see
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CrossJ
SECOND PLACE: PAUL RYAN Look-a-like contest
Member # 884
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posted April 22, 2015 04:41 AM
quote:
I have some hope since the ATF is involved in the transaction
Yep.....that would settle my concerns also! Ha!
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A friend will help you move. A good friend will help you move a body.
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted April 22, 2015 07:18 AM
ditto ha
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
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Fur_n_Dirt
So. Ariz. Zone Tech. Expert
Member # 4467
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posted May 06, 2015 04:40 PM
I got a call from a FFL last night.. Just picked up my silencer!
They wouldn't tell me what happened, but ATF did not allow the original seller to complete the transaction..
Glad it worked out.. Next step, get the stock bedded, and continue to work up some loads..
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Fur_n_Dirt
So. Ariz. Zone Tech. Expert
Member # 4467
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posted May 08, 2015 11:14 AM
Things are coming together..
Last session, I tried some 60 grains using H414 at 43 grains.. I got 3650 fps..
This morning I tried the suppressor for the first time using the same loads.. After barrel warmup, I shot a .46" group which is not a bad start..
The suppressor really brings down the dB's!! Its amazing how it sounds versus the energy going down range. It works perfect w no issues. Very happy I got the titanium version, minimizes the weight. It does feel more front heavy than I'm used to..
Since the 60's look promising, I might do load development on these. I might tailor back the bedding job to only the recoil lug area and make sure the rear tang is not touching..
At this point, I can go out and knock some critters.. I just might do that..
PS. The can is worth every freakin penny.
[ May 08, 2015, 11:17 AM: Message edited by: Fur_n_Dirt ]
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted May 08, 2015 12:07 PM
3650fps with that length barrel-60grain bullet sounds like what I would expect? You can try other powders but with that bullet weight, H414 is what I'd use, and the accuracy seems very adequate.
So, how much did that fancy can wind up costing, for every penny?
Good hunting. El Bee
edit: to me for the red tape and the cost, I feel it's kind of a rip off.
[ May 08, 2015, 12:09 PM: Message edited by: Leonard ]
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31462 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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CrossJ
SECOND PLACE: PAUL RYAN Look-a-like contest
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posted May 08, 2015 03:14 PM
You will probably see an increase in velocity with the can. I would recommend watching for signs of pressure when adding the suppressor.
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A friend will help you move. A good friend will help you move a body.
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Fur_n_Dirt
So. Ariz. Zone Tech. Expert
Member # 4467
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posted May 08, 2015 06:40 PM
Thanks for the heads up..I believe I am seeing signs of pressure because the bolt extraction is tight.. I was playing around with the empty brass and I found it difficult to close the bolt.. However, the primers are not moving out of the pockets , but it seems to be cratering just a bit..
What I don't understand , is that I used the redding body die and the bolt still closes hard . A new piece of lapua brass and it goes in very easy.. Trying to figure out the dimension that is making the bolt close hard..
I think it's time to drop down by one grain and see how it goes.. You agree?
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Fur_n_Dirt
So. Ariz. Zone Tech. Expert
Member # 4467
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posted May 08, 2015 06:44 PM
LB,
That can was $1100 plus a $200 tax stamp to Uncle Sam ..
Ridiculously over priced? Yes.. Worth every penny? Yes!
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted May 08, 2015 07:11 PM
Geezus, that's roughly 433 half gallons of the best orange juice money can buy!
Good hunting. El Bee
edit: or 162 gallons of Costco's organic orange juice. I'm just putting it in terms that anyone can understand. LB
edit: for the time being, I would use a full length sizing die, why are you using the body die, anyway?
edit: when you get a minute, would you please justify the cost. That should be easy for an assessory worth every penny. For that price, you should get a "twofer" every time you pull the trigger!
[ May 08, 2015, 07:21 PM: Message edited by: Leonard ]
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
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jimanaz
2nd Place RICHARD FARNSWORTH LOOK-A-LIKE CONTEST
Member # 3689
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posted May 08, 2015 07:42 PM
Remember when you could hear, Leonard? Yeah, me neither. And the scary part is I still hear better than a lot of people in my age group. We didn't wear helmets or knee and elbow pads when riding our bikes. If shooting suppressed gives him an edge when he reaches codger status, and he can afford it, more power to him. Guys like you and me don't see the cost/result thing cuz weez already fukt. I still don't agree with the 20" barrel though.
Posts: 940 | From: AZ | Registered: Oct 2010
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Fur_n_Dirt
So. Ariz. Zone Tech. Expert
Member # 4467
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posted May 08, 2015 08:13 PM
I'm hung a little more.. 22". :-)
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CrossJ
SECOND PLACE: PAUL RYAN Look-a-like contest
Member # 884
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posted May 08, 2015 08:15 PM
Fur, the problem you describe sounds like a sizing problem, not a pressure problem. Can't say as to your cratering primers....have had rifles that get a little primer flow regardless of powder charge. I look for things like flattened primers and stiff bolt lift when looking for pressure problems.
What can did you get Fur?
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A friend will help you move. A good friend will help you move a body.
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted May 08, 2015 08:24 PM
I already suggested that, Geordie. But, he seldom pays attention to what I have to say so, good of you to chime in.
Jimanez, yeah, you have a point, hell, my hearing was shot before I was discharged from the military.
But, part of my bitch is the exorbitant cost. You realize, you can buy a very nice rifle for $1100, and that $200 tax is just wrong.
Good hunting. El Bee
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31462 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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Kokopelli
SENIOR DISCOUNT & Dispenser of Sage Advice
Member # 633
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posted May 08, 2015 08:40 PM
How's this for justifying an unneeded purchase ?
"I've wanted one all of my life and now I got one while I still got some life left !!!"
I may be too practical to buy a suppressor but I'm driving the coolest street legal dune buggy you ever saw !!!!!
Why ?? ................ Just because !!
![[Cool]](cool.gif)
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DAA
Utah/Promoted WESTERN REGIONAL Hunt Director
Member # 11
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posted May 09, 2015 04:12 AM
He did say bolt lift is tight. So, sounds like he's as far as he needs to go. And maybe backing off isn't a bad idea.
Tight after sizing, they are either too long in the shoulder or too fat in the web.
Cam that sucker over hard, no daylight between the die and the shell holder. Don't typically have to do that, but do it. If they are still tight, you won the "bad fit between die and chamber" lottery. It happens...
- DAA
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"Oh yeah, they're gonna talk to you, and talk to you, and talk to you about individual freedom, but they see a free individual, it's gonna scare 'em." -- George Hanson, Easy Rider, 1969.
Rocky Mountain Varmint Hunter
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Fur_n_Dirt
So. Ariz. Zone Tech. Expert
Member # 4467
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posted May 09, 2015 06:09 AM
Appreciate the feedback! Still absorbing everyone's comments..
This is what I've been doing..
I have a redding S type neck die set. Contains a neck die, body die, and competition seater.
I've been popping out the primer and using the bushing neck die to reduce the neck diameter. Finally, bullet is seated ..
I don't have a full length die! Doesn't seem the body die bumps shoulder? Is that correct?
This is my situation..
Edit: I think about everyone's comments here. Too much experience not too..
[ May 09, 2015, 06:10 AM: Message edited by: Fur_n_Dirt ]
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted May 09, 2015 06:32 AM
quote:
I think it's time to drop down by one grain and see how it goes.. You agree?
By all means. If you "think" so?
Especially since we have no data as to how he came up with the specific load, in the first place.
What I do is increase the charge in increments until I see pressure signs; then back off about 1.5 grains; plus ambient temperature could be a factor? If loading a 223 or a seventeen, there is a different number, but for a case in the range of 22-250, something like 1 to1.5 grain, puts me in a safe range where I never have to worry about blown primers or short case life including split necks. I do not load hot. Max, but not hot. I might tempt fate in other ways, but I do not push my luck with ultra hot loads.
Arguably, there are several signs to look for, you can measure the web area with calipers before and after firing. you can check over all length, look for scuff marks on the head, etc.
In spite of all the folks that tell us not to worry about primers, I pay attention to primers. Maybe there is some useful indications and maybe not, but just disregarding primer condition after 47 years of reading those particular "tea leaves" is something I choose not to do. I'm old school.
Anyway, establish your baseline max load in conjunction with the chronograph and bolt lift and the visual factors. The speed can show you your "yield", when a certain charge increment results in benefit and when it's not doing a whole lot, or the reverse, if it jumps into freaky velocity. In other words, you need to analyze and evaluate as best you can. There are several things besides accuracy that helps you to establish a safe and accurate "max" load. Pay attention, and be careful.
Good hunting. El Bee
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
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knockemdown
Our staff photo editing Guru, par excellence
Member # 3588
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posted May 09, 2015 07:45 AM
Use the body die, FIRST.
Then, neck size.
Yes, the Redding body die can be set to ' bump' the shoulder back...
[ May 09, 2015, 07:45 AM: Message edited by: knockemdown ]
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Fur_n_Dirt
So. Ariz. Zone Tech. Expert
Member # 4467
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posted May 09, 2015 09:29 AM
With your feedback, I figured it out.. The shoulder needed to be bumped by .001"..
At first, I didn't think the body die bumped the shoulder because I set it to where the shell holder touched the die.. It needed to be turned an additional 1/8 or 1/4 turn for the bump (cam over) just like DAA sated..
Now, the bolt goes down nice and firm and not too tight.. And after body and neck die, run out is still good ..
Thanks! Everyone! :-)
[ May 09, 2015, 09:45 AM: Message edited by: Fur_n_Dirt ]
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Fur_n_Dirt
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posted May 09, 2015 09:36 AM
Cross, I got the Gemtech Sandstorm.. It's the titanium version.. This can supports up to a .308.
I wanted another that support up to 300 mag, but wasn't in stock. The best plan for these cans is to buy ONE and interchange with your rifles. You can literally buy one and go from 22lr to 300 mag.
http://www.gem-tech.com/store/pc/SANDSTORM-10p48.htm
[ May 09, 2015, 09:46 AM: Message edited by: Fur_n_Dirt ]
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