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Author
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Topic: My first hand loads - shotgun
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted November 13, 2016 02:44 PM
You guys really know how to tempt me. I never seriously, (for a minute) thought I would ever be interested in loading for shotgun.
But $200 worth of Hevi shot is a serious commitment, at MY level of commitment....which is not high. But, I'm usually a plunger, so I'm worried. Thanks a lot!
Good hunting. El Bee
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31465 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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DAA
Utah/Promoted WESTERN REGIONAL Hunt Director
Member # 11
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posted November 14, 2016 05:37 AM
$200 is only 40 rounds of factory Hevi ammo. 20 lbs is 200 rounds worth of 1-1/2 oz. loads. Almost $800 worth of shot at normal prices.
It's crazy stupid cheap for Hevi. Seriously doubt you'll ever find it for less than $35 - $40 a pound anywhere else, ever again.
- DAA
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"Oh yeah, they're gonna talk to you, and talk to you, and talk to you about individual freedom, but they see a free individual, it's gonna scare 'em." -- George Hanson, Easy Rider, 1969.
Rocky Mountain Varmint Hunter
Posts: 2676 | From: Salt Lake City, UT | Registered: Jan 2003
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UTcaller
NEVADA NIGHT FIGHTER
Member # 8
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posted November 14, 2016 07:09 AM
Dave I would make sure that it is the heavier than lead shot. They do make 2 different types. One is 10.5 g/cc(Hevishot Duck) and the other is the 12 g/cc(Hevishot Goose).Since Lead is 11.34 g/cc one is heavier than lead the other is not.
I looked at the Natchez website and it doesnt say which one it is.
Good Hunting Chad
Posts: 1612 | From: Utah | Registered: Jan 2003
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted November 14, 2016 07:25 AM
For what reason should the price go up?
I know that I should buy three pickups because in another 20 years they will cost $100,000 instead of $57,000. That would save serious money. But I'm 74?
Forty shells would last me well into next season, I should think? I'm an incremental guy.
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31465 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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DAA
Utah/Promoted WESTERN REGIONAL Hunt Director
Member # 11
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posted November 14, 2016 07:55 AM
Chad, this is the old discontinued Rem. HD stuff. It's 12g/cc. If you look at the charts I've posted, you'll notice there is only 71 pellets in a 1-1/2 oz. load compared to 77 pellets in the Hornady lead 1-1/2 oz. load.
Plier test tells me it's harder than lead too.
Not pretty though! Looks like welding slag. Not very uniform, not very round. Seems to pattern well though and really ought to kill awfully good at under 50 yards.
Have not actually tried it on coyote yet myself. Will soon, hopefully. Have heard lots of good things about the discontinued Rem. HD BB factory loads on coyote though. This is that same shot.
I did kill a few coyotes with some of the discontinued Fed. HW #2's. Which are quite a bit heavier still at 15g/cc. With 90 pellets in a 1-1/2 oz. load they pattern super good. The few coyotes I shot with them were all dead before they hit the ground too. That's some awesome stuff. Almost impossible to find and very expensive when you do though. I found some 3-1/2" loads of it still in stock somewhere, but at $40 a box (for 10), that's $40 a pound for the shot and at that price, I'll pay a bit more and get TSS at 18g/cc.
- DAA
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"Oh yeah, they're gonna talk to you, and talk to you, and talk to you about individual freedom, but they see a free individual, it's gonna scare 'em." -- George Hanson, Easy Rider, 1969.
Rocky Mountain Varmint Hunter
Posts: 2676 | From: Salt Lake City, UT | Registered: Jan 2003
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UTcaller
NEVADA NIGHT FIGHTER
Member # 8
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posted November 14, 2016 08:13 AM
Good to hear Dave. I just remember alot of the duck hunting guys bitching about the hevishot duck and how it wasn't as good as the hevishot goose and the Remington HD. Good to hear it is the good stuff. Might be worth buying a bag or two.
Posts: 1612 | From: Utah | Registered: Jan 2003
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted November 14, 2016 09:35 AM
Note: $40 for ten is still better than Dead Coyote! All I have to go by is last year, well, not "last year" but earlier this year. At BassProShops, I saw Dead Coyote, not sure but probably T shot, and it was $54.95 a box for 3 1/2". I've shot a few of those and they damned near knock your fillings loose. I don't want to kill coyotes that bad when I can finesse with #4Buck, if I can just get them inside 40 yards. But then, they are moving too fast! I'm still wondering what's so bad about lead, anyway?
We let these zealots micro manage and pass regulatory laws that sound good and nobody has the time to object, but next thing you know, they have made perfectly good shotshells illegal and they are laughing at us. That's what we are dealing with: Liberals exhibiting their foul mental illness on the rest of us!
Good hunting. El Bee
edit: about all the hue and cry concerning LEAD. This all started many seasons ago when they noticed poisoned ducks in the Mississippi flyway. But, the main thing is that all the ponds back there have mud bottoms that trap lead shot and the divers injest it and the say something like a 5% die as a result. Then, so they say, the introduction of steel caused an increase of 3%-5% in cripples that set their wings and are unrecoverable. So much for the gain, but they don't stop there. One size fits all.
It seems that the western flyway all the ponds and such have sand and gravel bottoms and the lead shifts to the bottom, kinda like gold does until it hits bedrock. So, here we are with regulations against lead when it's unjustified. Add that to the idiots that can't tell the difference between diver ducks and upland game! In California you can't hardly buy any shotshell in lead. Lead is inert, babies aren't going to eat the stuff in their breakfast Cherrios. It's all a sham! Never mind the trend to much larger shot sizes that really sink fast.
And, don't get me started on poisoning California Condors! That trend is completely bogus. More condors die from being electrocuted between conductors on power poles than drinking antifreeze or being potted from their roost. Suddenly we have to use very inferior solid copper bullets that don't conform in the bore like a copper jacket does. Anyway, why do we lose freedom to such stupid and unsupportable regulations? It's all antigun, has nothing to do with environmentalism. SAVE US!
[ November 14, 2016, 09:52 AM: Message edited by: Leonard ]
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31465 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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Kokopelli
SENIOR DISCOUNT & Dispenser of Sage Advice
Member # 633
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posted November 17, 2016 01:07 AM
The goal of the do-gooders had nothing to do with ducks. Ducks were just the feel good cause.
What they wanted was to add enough restrictions that a number of hunters would stop hunting ducks.
In turn, the hunters would not be taking along / teaching their sons & grandsons to hunt. Over a period of decades, hunters become extinct.
In the meantime, if you could be counted on for a donation $$ to the worthy cause (insert sad duck footage) please send your checks to .........
Lead.
Coyote contests.
Trapping.
Baiting.
Dogs.
Same goal ............different feel good cause.
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And lo, the Light of the Trump shown upon the Darkness and the Darkness could not comprehend it.
Posts: 7583 | From: Under a wandering star | Registered: Apr 2005
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted November 17, 2016 06:13 AM
koko, you know too much to be just a casually informed citizen. You sit in on these meetings?
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31465 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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Kokopelli
SENIOR DISCOUNT & Dispenser of Sage Advice
Member # 633
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posted November 17, 2016 06:20 AM
Actually, I'm the Seventh Son of a Seventh Son.
I have insight from the Other Side.
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And lo, the Light of the Trump shown upon the Darkness and the Darkness could not comprehend it.
Posts: 7583 | From: Under a wandering star | Registered: Apr 2005
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted November 17, 2016 09:58 AM
Meaning; The Far Side?
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31465 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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Kokopelli
SENIOR DISCOUNT & Dispenser of Sage Advice
Member # 633
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posted November 17, 2016 03:04 PM
This is where I would normally reply with a pithy comment but I just saw Nancy Pelosi on the tube.
I swear she babbled for two minutes and said nothing. The woman frightens me. She is not right.
Probably an alien............a friggen' SPACE ALIEN !!!!!!!!
I can't think straight right now. ![[Eek!]](eek.gif)
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And lo, the Light of the Trump shown upon the Darkness and the Darkness could not comprehend it.
Posts: 7583 | From: Under a wandering star | Registered: Apr 2005
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted November 17, 2016 05:42 PM
I don't understand how she does it? Every time she opens her mouth, I hear idiocy. Who could continually vote for that woman? Says something about democrats, donut?
Good hunting. El Bee
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31465 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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DAA
Utah/Promoted WESTERN REGIONAL Hunt Director
Member # 11
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posted November 28, 2016 04:12 AM
Shotgunned a few more over the weekend. Using the Hevi-shot BB load this time. Over all, pretty good, but not without some disappointment.
Shot nine coyotes with them. Two got on. Of the seven that carried back to the Jeep, two needed to be shot twice. But five were dead in their tracks.
Both that got away and both that needed shot twice were over 40 yards. Inside that, deadly, outside, not so much maybe.
Had one run smack dab right into me at full speed yesterday morning too. Never saw or heard it coming, no warning. Just minding my own business and BLAM! Coyote runs into my right side at full speed. Somehow managed to kill it, too.
Good fun!
Some of the weekend activity. All of these I'm posing with were shotgunned but we killed a bunch with the rifles too.
This is the one that ran into me.
Coyotes were really turned on in the morning with the new snow. I had the one run into me, then shotgunned pairs on the next two stands in a row.
- DAA
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"Oh yeah, they're gonna talk to you, and talk to you, and talk to you about individual freedom, but they see a free individual, it's gonna scare 'em." -- George Hanson, Easy Rider, 1969.
Rocky Mountain Varmint Hunter
Posts: 2676 | From: Salt Lake City, UT | Registered: Jan 2003
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted November 28, 2016 06:55 AM
God, I am so jealous! And, you get $50 no questions asked? wink?
Good hunting. El Bee
PS holy cow! the barrel on that shottie looks 30 inches?
PPS I've had a few hop over me and a fox walk on my leg but never been crashed into?
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31465 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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DAA
Utah/Promoted WESTERN REGIONAL Hunt Director
Member # 11
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posted November 28, 2016 07:11 AM
Yeah I've had plenty I could almost reached out and touched, but this was a first.
Backtracked it in the snow. I was sitting next to a sage brush. It had come running from my 4 o'clock and leaped a big sage just to the right of me and landed/crashed square into my right side. Knocked me sideways a bit. Jumped up, yelling HOLY FUCKING SHIT!!! Coyote was scrambling to get away too, using me for traction. Left red marks on my skin where his toenails dug in trying to launch himself in a new direction.
More than just a little bit surprised I was able to regain enough composure to kill him as he tried to flee.
- DAA
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"Oh yeah, they're gonna talk to you, and talk to you, and talk to you about individual freedom, but they see a free individual, it's gonna scare 'em." -- George Hanson, Easy Rider, 1969.
Rocky Mountain Varmint Hunter
Posts: 2676 | From: Salt Lake City, UT | Registered: Jan 2003
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DAA
Utah/Promoted WESTERN REGIONAL Hunt Director
Member # 11
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posted November 28, 2016 07:17 AM
BTW... Leonard, this bothers me, so forgive me saying anything.
But. Spare me the "wink". If it's implying I'd turn in coyotes for Utah bounty, taken in another state?
I'm disappointed you would even consider that a possibility of me. Bounty fraud is a total fucking douche bag move. It ain't my move.
- DAA
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"Oh yeah, they're gonna talk to you, and talk to you, and talk to you about individual freedom, but they see a free individual, it's gonna scare 'em." -- George Hanson, Easy Rider, 1969.
Rocky Mountain Varmint Hunter
Posts: 2676 | From: Salt Lake City, UT | Registered: Jan 2003
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted November 28, 2016 07:24 AM
Accept my apology. Main thing is, with that many coyotes, I was actually supposing that this trip occurred mostly in Nevada?
Thanks for sharing.
Good hunting. El Bee
PS aside from all the suspicions, when a bounty is involved, it will be abused.
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31465 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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UTcaller
NEVADA NIGHT FIGHTER
Member # 8
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posted November 28, 2016 08:23 AM
Sounds like a great weekend.with some great action Dave.
I agree about the bounty too. Of all the coyote I've killed in Nevada over the last few years never even crossed my mind to turn them in for the bounty here in Utah.Dick heads that do are scumbags.
Good Hunting Chad
Posts: 1612 | From: Utah | Registered: Jan 2003
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted November 28, 2016 09:57 AM
Let's not kid ourselves, this stuff happens everywhere there is a bounty on anything. I have actually done some extensive reading and research on the subject going all the way back to the Sweetwater County bounty in Wyoming, in the early 70's. Sweetwater County paid a lot of bounty on coyotes from all over the state, and nobody knew or cared where the boundary line was. Of course, it was just five bucks but they still ran out of money.
The thing that puzzles me is; Utah doesn't need an incentive? I understand the pressure from the big game people but (sorry) Utah just doesn't have a coyote problem. I've been there.
Good hunting. El Bee
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31465 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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UTcaller
NEVADA NIGHT FIGHTER
Member # 8
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posted November 28, 2016 10:20 AM
There are definitely not huge problems with coyotes in the State but there are pockets of problems especially for some of the livestock guys in the springtime. But generally I don't think the bounty has any effect on managing the coyote population one way or another. But as long as they offer it I will take advantage of it. Pays for gas and then some. It can really pay too. In the spring I will get some phone calls of sheep men having some coyote problems and if I can go in and kill a couple coyotes in a morning the rancher will give me $100 for each coyote I kill, then the $50.00 bounty. I can come home with $300.00 for a few hours of calling. Doesn't happen like that every time but more often than not.
Good Hunting Chad
[ November 28, 2016, 10:22 AM: Message edited by: UTcaller ]
Posts: 1612 | From: Utah | Registered: Jan 2003
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DAA
Utah/Promoted WESTERN REGIONAL Hunt Director
Member # 11
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posted November 29, 2016 06:43 AM
The Utah bounty is just good old fashioned pork barrel politics.
It got put in by the Big Game lobby, which, here in Utah, is surprisingly powerful. Maybe not so surprising, really, since Big Game = BIG MONEY all over the West, anymore.
The publicly stated goals/rationale are improved fawn recruitment.
Anyone with two functioning brain cells to rub together and access to a public library or a dial up internet connection knows that a bounty program is literally the lest efficient, most expensive, non effective, totally fucking moronic way of controlling coyotes at specific places and specific times (fawn recruitment) that has ever been invented.
Plainly put, it does not work. Not even slightly.
And also plainly put, all coyote bounty programs have been plagued by fraud and I know for a fact that the Utah one has been. I knew guys with contacts inside the Big Money Big Game outfit that got the program enacted, that knew it was coming a full year in advance, who were putting ears and jaws in the freezer just waiting for it to go into effect.
But, it's popular. It plays well with the rural folks. Most coyote hunters I have ever talked to about it, think I'm on glue to even imagine that a bounty doesn't reduce coyote numbers.
So, what the hell. It's free money. I take it when I'm entitled. Between bounty and a fur check, I'm expecting to pay for a new Benelli out of this years coyote take.
- DAA
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"Oh yeah, they're gonna talk to you, and talk to you, and talk to you about individual freedom, but they see a free individual, it's gonna scare 'em." -- George Hanson, Easy Rider, 1969.
Rocky Mountain Varmint Hunter
Posts: 2676 | From: Salt Lake City, UT | Registered: Jan 2003
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DAA
Utah/Promoted WESTERN REGIONAL Hunt Director
Member # 11
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posted November 29, 2016 06:47 AM
Might add, in the interest of being "fair and balanced"...
The state did add a contractor component to the bounty program, which at least has the potential to actually be effective. I got the letter inviting me to join. Basically offered $10K, to spend x number of hours in x area at x time of year hunting coyotes. A pretty good deal for all involved. I did not try to join as I simply don' have the time to fulfill the contract.
But, for the guys that did, if they live up to it, they'll actually be removing coyotes from the places they need to be at the times they need to be, in order to actually have some impact on improved fawn recruitment.
- DAA
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"Oh yeah, they're gonna talk to you, and talk to you, and talk to you about individual freedom, but they see a free individual, it's gonna scare 'em." -- George Hanson, Easy Rider, 1969.
Rocky Mountain Varmint Hunter
Posts: 2676 | From: Salt Lake City, UT | Registered: Jan 2003
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UTcaller
NEVADA NIGHT FIGHTER
Member # 8
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posted November 29, 2016 07:52 AM
Yeah I got the same letter. You had to have turned in so many Coyotes on the bounty to be eligible, and had to put in like 200 hours in a specific area from December until June. And you were given $5000.00 up front, and the other $5000 after you finished the 200 hours.I turned it down too because of not having the time to put in to it.
Good Hunting Chad
Posts: 1612 | From: Utah | Registered: Jan 2003
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Lone Howl
Free Trial Platinum Member & part-time language police
Member # 29
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posted November 29, 2016 09:02 AM
How are they going to verify the hours?
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When tyranny becomes law, rebellion becomes duty.
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