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Author
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Topic: My first hand loads - shotgun
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted October 16, 2016 05:55 AM
Yes, I agree with that! For the first hand loaded shot shells, I think they look beautiful. I have seen reloads before and they sometimes look gnarly. Crimp needs glue or pellets fall out the hole in the middle, stuff like that. In other words, they "look" reloaded, but Dave's look fine, to me.
If somebody would send me that Lee Loader, I'd be willing to try it myself. By the way, where do you get those wads or the plastic shot holder, or don't they use one, unless it's birdshot? I'm especially stupid about shotshells.
Good hunting. El Bee
PS Man, the Dodgers really got their ass kicked last night. Pray for them, today!
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31465 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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DAA
Utah/Promoted WESTERN REGIONAL Hunt Director
Member # 11
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posted October 16, 2016 07:52 AM
Leonard, so far I've gotten all the components that didn't come in the package deal I got from Bob from BPI. Another source is Precision Reloading.
Well, now that I think about it, I got the Hevi-shot BB from Natchez, too.
Most of the stuff is available from all the usual sources. But loading buckshot or large size heavier than lead shot is a little bit specialized. The two sources above cater to more specialized shot shell hand loading.
Main thing, is have a recipe or two in mind before ordering anything, so you only order the stuff you know you are going to use.
In the package I bought from Bob, he included at least some of every single component I'd need to load 3" 1-1/2 oz. heavier than lead stuff. Along with detailed instructions and pictures to help me get started. So I oould really get my head around not just what I needed, but how it actually all fit together and why I needed so many different components to load one recipe. And, it was a tad bit more complicated than that, even. For instance, I have to trim the wads by hand and trim mylar wraps by hand - you can't even buy components right off the shelf that are "just right" for that particular load.
It's a super versatile, killer load though, good for just about any 1-1/2 oz. payload of heavyweight shot up to 15gr./cc.
I got my Mec cheap enough, it's not a big deal and I can get my money back selling it easy enough.
But having started actually doing it, and realizing that truly I only use if for crimps and nothing else, I might have tried to go even cheaper. But look around at your local used market, online classifieds or whatever. I was seeing used Mec 600's going for about $50 and they have the exact same crimper as my Mec Steelmaster (which I paid $80 for). I've heard that Lee tool does nicer crimps though?
So far, the most expensive shells I've loaded are the HS BB at about $1.50 each, and even those, are super bargain priced for what they are. Similar factory waterfowl loads go for Dead Coyote prices. And, those are only "similar". There aren't any factory loads with the 1-1/2 oz payload in a 3" shell that I'm loading.
The lead T's at $0.60 per shell or the NP F's at $0.90, I'm just not going to feel bad about cutting loose with. The few times I was using that Dead Coyote stuff, I was acutely aware that I was shooting $5 bills at coyotes!
Which, BTW... You could load HW13 T shot, which should be a bit better than the Hevi-shot T in Dead Coyote, for a little under $3 a copy. Still quite expensive, but a lot less so than DC, and it should be a better shell with more penetration as the HW13 is more dense than Hevi-shot.
I might spring for a ten pound bag of HW13 T shot next year. Maybe. Not anytime soon though.
All that money talk aside though, you generally have to buy components in batches large enough that you/I may never actually use them all up. The total outlay to get started, even scrounging deals like I have, I'll have to shoot an awful lot of shotgun shells at coyotes before I break even. Honestly don't ever expect to. So, in reality, I'm not saving any money. But I'm having fun! And I'm going to have ammo I couldn't get any other way and it's going to out perform factory offerings in certain aspects. That might not be as true for a waterfowl guy, tons of factory stuff to choose from there. But hardly any factory choices for coyote. And to repeat myself, I'm having fun! ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
- DAA
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"Oh yeah, they're gonna talk to you, and talk to you, and talk to you about individual freedom, but they see a free individual, it's gonna scare 'em." -- George Hanson, Easy Rider, 1969.
Rocky Mountain Varmint Hunter
Posts: 2676 | From: Salt Lake City, UT | Registered: Jan 2003
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DAA
Utah/Promoted WESTERN REGIONAL Hunt Director
Member # 11
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posted October 16, 2016 08:04 AM
A money driven decision/event you might appreciate...
Tim was running my 870, with of course my ammo. It was full of Dead Coyote at $5 per copy.
He had already made two bad hits on a coyote. It hadn't really gone anywhere yet, lot of spinning and what not. But it was still looking way lively.
I'm sitting 40 yards away with my .17 watching all this go down and when that coyote was still spinning and buck jumping after the second (poor) hit, and I heard that 870 racking another one... I panicked a bit, realizing Tim had already spent $10 worth of ammo on that coyote and was about to be into it another $5! I jumped up and shouldered my .17 on it and finished it before he could get that last round off. Purely motivated by the cost of Dead Coyote shells!
Kind of cool shot though. Coyote was literally in midair doing a full somersault. Spinning ball of fur in midair. Tim said from where he sat it was just about the coolest looking hit on a coyote he ever saw. And he's seen a few!
- DAA
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"Oh yeah, they're gonna talk to you, and talk to you, and talk to you about individual freedom, but they see a free individual, it's gonna scare 'em." -- George Hanson, Easy Rider, 1969.
Rocky Mountain Varmint Hunter
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DAA
Utah/Promoted WESTERN REGIONAL Hunt Director
Member # 11
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posted October 16, 2016 08:06 AM
Oh, and you know I ain't the praying type... But yeah, even though I turned my back on baseball long ago, still have a soft spot for the Dodgers. Will think my best thoughts for them .
- DAA
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"Oh yeah, they're gonna talk to you, and talk to you, and talk to you about individual freedom, but they see a free individual, it's gonna scare 'em." -- George Hanson, Easy Rider, 1969.
Rocky Mountain Varmint Hunter
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted October 16, 2016 11:26 AM
I get what you are saying. I pissed away $150 on Hold em, a couple weeks ago, big deal.
But, I am completely tuned in to the thought of Tim blasting ten dollars worth of YOUR Dead Coyote, and the reality kicks in, never mind that you get a bounty. It's a ridiculous thing, five bucks a shot, but when he is using your shotgun and your shells, suddenly you see that on a certain level, IT IS HARD TO JUSTIFY.
I have a similar situation with my son. He cannot afford to hunt, truth be known, so I subsidize, food, drink, gas and other stuff. Hell, I load his cartridges because I can't get him to do it! I say, you really need to do some loading for this trip. He says, how many do I have? I say 7 or 8. He ponders it and says (shrug); that's enough. He wears camo that must be at least twenty years old, and looks it! But, he's a good partner, and we all know how much that is worth.
When I hunted with Pat, money and splitting expenses was automatic, never talked about it, just never a problem, not an issue. But, when I hunt with my son, I pay for everything. He buys beer, and drinks it. Then, by the time I get thirsty, mid afternoon, too bad, it's all gone! That's when I regret not drowning him, as a pup. (I'm just kidding)
Back on subject, how do they possibly justify $54 for a box of 10 Dead Coyote shells? Then, there's 8% sales tax....$4.32 more. Eek!
Another rant, sorry folks
Good hunting. El Bee
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31465 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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UTcaller
NEVADA NIGHT FIGHTER
Member # 8
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posted October 16, 2016 12:05 PM
Its a tough deal for me. I truly love the Dodgers but I find myself pulling for the Cubs due to the longevity of there World Series drought. 1908 is a damn long time and if they have a shot at it this is probably the year. But like I said I love the Dodgers .
Posts: 1612 | From: Utah | Registered: Jan 2003
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted October 16, 2016 02:13 PM
I'm a little conflicted, as well. All I can say is, if they beat my team, I will root for them, enthusiastically. When all is said and done, the National League plays REAL baseball, and I always want them to win. Designated hitter? WTF? The way it simplifies what should be MAJOR strategic decisions is mind boggling!
Good hunting. El Bee
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31465 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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UTcaller
NEVADA NIGHT FIGHTER
Member # 8
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posted October 16, 2016 02:40 PM
Very true Leonard in that situation it is truly opposite strategy. Best hitter vs Worst hitter senerio.
Posts: 1612 | From: Utah | Registered: Jan 2003
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UTcaller
NEVADA NIGHT FIGHTER
Member # 8
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posted October 16, 2016 07:18 PM
Well the Dodgers pulled it out. Man Kershaw pitched well.
Posts: 1612 | From: Utah | Registered: Jan 2003
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Kokopelli
SENIOR DISCOUNT & Dispenser of Sage Advice
Member # 633
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posted October 16, 2016 10:32 PM
Does Tommy Lasorda still wear that uniform that's two sizes too small ???
I don't watch much sports.
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And lo, the Light of the Trump shown upon the Darkness and the Darkness could not comprehend it.
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted October 17, 2016 05:19 AM
Yes, and he still bleeds Dodger Blue! Lasorda is a treasure.
Kershaw pitching, he shuts them out. The night before, it's the whole bullpen and the Cubs score 8 runs off them. Anybody still think the game isn't about pitching? (he also got a base hit)
Baseball, a legit game. Fuck the NFL!
Good hunting. El Bee
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31465 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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booger
TOO BIG TO FAIL
Member # 3602
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posted October 17, 2016 07:27 AM
Koko and LB,
Don't want to hi-jack the shotshell thread, but since Lasorda was brought up, though I would share a story.
Mitch Webster is a local Central Kansas boy that played for a number of MLB teams, and ended up spending the last 5 or 6 years of his career as an outfielder for the Dodgers. He lived 2 houses down from me in the off-season.
His father in law is a banker friend of mine, and also a neighbor.
Mitch is now a scout for the Dodgers, and had 2 of the cutest little girls I have seen. Their grandpa, my friend, told his granddaughters they needed to give 'Uncle Tommy' a hug everytime they saw him, because he was 'daddy's boss'.
Well, I guess they did, and I heard Tommy loved it! Guess he is a true gentleman and a great guy!
Thought I would share...now back to shotshells...
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If we ever forget we are one Nation Under God, then we will be a nation gone under--Ronald Reagan
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted October 17, 2016 10:53 AM
Thanks for that, Booger, but we don't recognize the term, "hi-jack" around here. Any thread that goes to a second page will have several off topic posts and nobody apologizes for it.
Okay, anybody got a good Dodger shot shell story?
Good hunting. El Bee
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
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Brent Parker
Knows what it's all about
Member # 4354
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posted October 19, 2016 06:55 AM
I have heard the thoughts on Heavi shot being to expensive but till I see something that kills as well or better to 50 or so yards I am going to stick with it. I bought two more boxes of Dead Coyote T and want to try the Dead Coyote #4 Buck. Those two boxes of Dead Coyote produced 18 dead coyotes at 100.00 a piece. Not a bad return. I am planning to buy a mec reloader after this fur season. I am interested on how the nickel shot F works out for DAA. I think it might be the ticket.
Brent
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted October 19, 2016 07:28 AM
They make Dead Coyote #4Buck? I didn't know that? I bet it takes a real He Man to touch those off?
I just can't imagine needing more than the Winchester DoubleXX 3" #4Buck? I don't know how to explain it but how much more dead is dead? At 40 yards, anyway? If they get to fifty and beyond, I'm frustrated, but defeated, but I'm not wasting a shell on what I fully expect will be a cripple. That's why, in a contest, I pack a rifle and a shottie. Works for me.
Getting $100 for coyotes? That's pretty dang good incentive. You got a good deal going there, Brent!
Good hunting. El Bee
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31465 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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UTcaller
NEVADA NIGHT FIGHTER
Member # 8
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posted October 19, 2016 08:43 AM
Yes they do. I still have a box of the 4 buck dead coyote. I used to put a couple of the 4 buck dead coyote shells in the magazine first followed by a T shot shell. Then a T shot shell in the barrel,so the first couple shots were T shot then if I needed the 4 buck for a longer shot they were there. Worked great unless your first shot was a far shot.lol
And as far as the cost of the dead coyote goes, I used to justify it by thinking a double on coyotes here in Utah would buy me 2 boxes of dead coyote shotshells. With the bounty money that is.
[ October 19, 2016, 08:47 AM: Message edited by: UTcaller ]
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DAA
Utah/Promoted WESTERN REGIONAL Hunt Director
Member # 11
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posted October 19, 2016 08:55 AM
I'd never ask anyone to justify any expense related to this stuff. If it works, you have fun with it, make money off it, just sleep better at night knowing you have Dead Coyote on the shelf, it's all good as far as I'm concerned.
As I've mentioned, there's no way I can justify the cost of getting into hand loading, not really. But I'm doing it and glad of it.
I have some stuff in mind I'm going to try eventually that will cost more to hand load, than Dead Coyote shells cost off the shelf. Got too may irons in the budget fire already though. Saving my pennies for a new shotgun, for one thing, and going to need to get quite a few barrels threaded for suppressors one of these days too. So the e$pen$ive exotic hand loaded shot shells are just going to have to wait, probably a full year. Ought to be fun and interesting when I finally get in a position to play with them though.
- DAA
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"Oh yeah, they're gonna talk to you, and talk to you, and talk to you about individual freedom, but they see a free individual, it's gonna scare 'em." -- George Hanson, Easy Rider, 1969.
Rocky Mountain Varmint Hunter
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DAA
Utah/Promoted WESTERN REGIONAL Hunt Director
Member # 11
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posted October 19, 2016 09:14 AM
This might be interesting for some.
So what you are looking at is a little table I put together using data from the KYP shotgun ballistics program I bought. The loads listed are the hand loads I've assembled so far and some of the factory ammo I have used.
The "3.7" Gel Yards" column needs explaining. The program calculates penetration in ballistic gel. Bob M., based on his experiences with many types of factory ammo on coyotes and looking at the penetration data, came up with that 3.7" number. He feels it's the minimum needed for killing penetration on coyote. I'm just running with it.
A couple of caveats need to be considered when looking at those penetration yardages though. For one, just because a load has killing penetration at 80 yards doesn't mean you have any pattern left at all, or should be shooting that far or have any hope of doing any good. So, for me, I figure anything 60 yards or better, should be plenty and any more than that is not necessarily going to be useful.
Another thing, it does not take into account how much better Hevi-shot and the like is at breaking bones and breaking down coyote. My own limited experience and what I hear from many others, Hevi-shot breaks down coyote a good bit better than lead. So, for instance, my Hevi-shot BB load, is only good for 63 yards of penetration, compared to 72 yards for the lead T. But, I'm betting the Hevi-shot BB breaks down coyote within reasonable shotgun distances at least as well and most likely better than the lead T does.
Anyway... There is some interesting bench racing you can do, looking at this kind of data. Good for conversation. How it actually patterns and most importantly actually kills in the field is what really matters and some of this data, while interesting, might prove not very relevant? In the real world?
Still, I think it's interesting.
Posted it mainly in response to Brent mentioning the nickel plated F. Take a look at the 1-3/4 oz load, compared to Dead Coyote T. And while I said I don't expect anyone to justify what they spend, and I mean that, still, do keep in mind I can load that NP F for just under $1 per shell and that includes the one time use of a brand new hull. Only 2 fewer pellets, same penetration distance. The Hevi will in reality out penetrate the NP F, no doubt. But, with an 80 yard potential, I'm thinking the NP F is going to penetrate PLENTY good enough, at normal distances.
Compare that 1-3/4 oz. F to the Fed. Prem. #4 buck, too. Not as much penetration, but again, it should be plenty just the same. but 8 more pellets, should mean a denser more lethal, easier to hit with pattern than the #4 buck.
I'm anxious to do some pattern testing and coyote killing with that load!
It interests me too, that had I not done this kind of research, I'd have probably sallied forth to try a 1-1/2 oz. load. But after running the numbers, I see no potential advantage for it vs. good old Fed. #4 buck.
Look at that Hevi-shot BB load, too. Those run me $1.50 each. Other than the fact I got my lead T shot for under market price and can load that 1-1/2 oz. load for $.0.60 each, I really see no reason to even mess with the lead T, when I have 20 pounds of the Hevi-shot BB on the shelf. Presuming that 63 yard penetration is all I can hope to utilize, and that the load patterns well, having 71 pellets vs. 51 for the lead T 1-1/2 oz. load, the Hevi BB is the clear winner on paper. And the 1-3/4 oz. lead T is a non-starter.
- DAA
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"Oh yeah, they're gonna talk to you, and talk to you, and talk to you about individual freedom, but they see a free individual, it's gonna scare 'em." -- George Hanson, Easy Rider, 1969.
Rocky Mountain Varmint Hunter
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted October 19, 2016 12:25 PM
Makes my head spin, is what it does! That's a very interesting chart.
There are probably a bunch of variations we could dick around with, but that #4Buck still looks good to me. You have the pellet diameter which means the pellet count will be smaller but look at who has the best GEL penetration!
I don't guess it matters that much on head shots anyway? Maybe the velocity means/indicates that there is "drop" to consider, as in holdover.
But what exactly is the magic behind Dead Coyote? I need to check, but the couple boxes I have, I assumed they are T shot?
Also, where is there a handy chart that compares the diameter of all those alphabet loads with the numerical stuff? I think #4 is 25 caliber?
Seems like I heard a while back that supposed innovation with the 3 1/2" 12 gauge shells has pretty much made 10 gauge not worthwhile? Yes? No?
Good hunting. El Bee
edit: as far as this question of justifying the cost, as mentioned by DAA. I guess I have been squawking as much as anybody, and like I'm not one to talk anyway. I'm an idiot where the rubber hits the road, no rational at all. When it comes to guns and hunting and all that crap, I could hardly be called a tightwad.
[ October 19, 2016, 12:32 PM: Message edited by: Leonard ]
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
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DAA
Utah/Promoted WESTERN REGIONAL Hunt Director
Member # 11
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posted October 19, 2016 04:59 PM
Leonard, the shot sizes are:
BB - .18
T - .20
F - .22
#4B - .24
Variations in batches are common though. So what you actually get, might be a bit off, one way or the other. The lead T shot I have, for example. I have not actually measured it. But the fact I'm only getting 51 pellets out of 1-1/2 oz. indicates the batch I have is a bit oversize. Being less dense than the Hevi-shot T in Dead Coyote, there should actually be more pellets for the same payload, but there isn't. From what I hear, such variations are not uncommon.
The magic in Dead Coyote is that it's Hevi-shot, not lead. Denser, so it carries more energy downrange than lead. Harder, so it maintains it's roundness instead of flattening out like lead and penetrates deeper and breaks bones better. From what little I've seen firsthand and all I hear, it breaks bone quite a bit better. Also, being harder and not suffering flattening from setback on ignition, it patterns better too.
In tests several guys have done, shooting catalogs and plywood and such, even the Hevi-shot BB, penetrates better than lead #4 buck. That's why I say, you have to apply some caveats to the gel penetration distances. Quite useful for comparing Hevi to Hevi, or lead to lead, but not so useful for comparing Hevi to lead.
The really expensive TSS shot, I mentioned earlier, but which isn't in the chart above, is significantly denser and harder than Hevi-shot. A full 50% more dense than Hevi-shot. It carries energy and penetrates like crazy.
When I eventually get around to ponying up the cash to play with some, I'll be loading #2 and #4 shot (not #4 Buck, but little itty bitty #4 shot!). Here's a chart that includes the TSS (and HW13, a less expensive exotic also superior to Hevi-shot, compare the HW13 T load to the DC load).
These loads will cost about $5.50 each to hand load. But will out perform Dead Coyote by a considerable margin - depending, of course, on what your performance criteria are. But to put it in the perspective of the chart above, the #2's will have 80 pellets in a 1-1/2 oz. load and a gel penetration distance of 115 yards. Almost 30 more pellets than Dead Coyote and way more penetration. The #4's will have a whopping 124 pellets and an 80 yard penetration. Same penetration as DC, but 124 vs. 51 pellets. Out of an improved or modified choke, they ought to be just a cloud of death on coyote under 50 yards.
I just won't be in a position to play with TSS for quite awhile. And it will be more of a "just because I have to try it", than expecting to make it a staple. But, for a fella that is paying DC money now, it offers a slightly more expensive but potentially even more effective alternative.
- DAA
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"Oh yeah, they're gonna talk to you, and talk to you, and talk to you about individual freedom, but they see a free individual, it's gonna scare 'em." -- George Hanson, Easy Rider, 1969.
Rocky Mountain Varmint Hunter
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Moe
Knows what it's all about
Member # 4494
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posted October 19, 2016 08:20 PM
One thing to consider when reloading for a pump or semi auto shotgun is the brass at the base. I reloaded dove, duck and goose loads for my old Rem 1100 and never had a problem but I only reloaded shells shot in my tight chambered Perazzi MX8 or from my 1100.
Because of my health I've stopped hunting birds but for the past 20 years I've ordered waterfowl loads by the case from Macs Prairie Wings. For coyote stuff I've ordered the Winchester 1 1/2" #4 buckshot loads from the Sportsman's Guide. I get some grief for shooting the 3 1/2" shells rather than the 3". They kick like an SOB but with 54 pellets they're solid killers. And they're not expensive like the Dead Coyote stuff. Back when it was legal I killed a lot of honkers with #4 buck. Great for pass shooting.
I've been a Dodgers fan as long as I can remember but this time I'm rooting for the Cubs. When I lived in Alaska the weather was awful. Snow on the ground, cold, freezing rain. We'd just gotten satellite TV and part of the package was WGN and they showed the Cubs games with guys in the bleachers with no shirts drinking beer and they played on green grass. I owe then for that.
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I snatch kisses. And vice versa.
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted October 20, 2016 05:42 AM
I don't know? Just as soon as we settle down and accept five bucks a pop for Dead Coyote, the sales pitch on TSS is: only fifty cents more but look at the performance at 80 yards!
I still say, what about a miss on a runner @ 80 yards, I have no idea what kind of patterns I would get at that distance, and patterning with shells that cost $5.60 if I hand load them, DAMN!
If I'm going to sit somewhere that I can roll a coyote at 80 yards, what the hell am I doing with a shotgun?
I'm sure I am missing something, and higher velocity, denser shot, more pellet count, all those things appeal to the bean counter in me, but FUCK!
I just might decide to economize and buy the cheaper stuff....which is Dead Coyote factories! Than bother with custom shit? This is what happens when you get acclimatized to five dollar shot shells.
I still think, yes all the above charts are really amazing, it's like driving my Ferrari to the Walmart for a 12 pack. It's a nice ride, and all that, but the Kia gets the job done, as well.
Ground Sluicing coyotes @ $5.60X2, (allowing for a little more leade) is eventually going to break the bank for those of us that don't be compensated $50 or $100 per each.
I'm thinking I might just lay down for a while, until my motivation goes away?
But, it sure sounds good! Might as well go all in and order the Perazzi?
Good hunting. El Bee
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31465 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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Moe
Knows what it's all about
Member # 4494
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posted October 20, 2016 07:48 AM
When Susan and I were first married my mother in law bought me a few boxes of Dead Coyote shells for a birthday gift so I took them to eastern Oregon and did some calling. In most GMUs during the deer and elk season you can only use a shotgun, no rifle.
I had a decent day with 5 coyotes but I lost at least 3 more that ran off into the heavy sage after being hit solid with the Dead Coyote. Oh, I'm sure they died but I never found them. One coyote was only about 35 yards and when the shot hit him he was tossed head over ass and hit the ground. He then got to his feet and ran off.
I have a problem with the super hard shot since it penetrates and doesn't transfer its energy by expanding. Best you can hope for is to hit a vital organ and drop them where they stand or they're going to run off and bleed to death in the bushes.
When I shoot a coyote I automatically shoot a second time. With the Dead Coyote stuff it doubles the price of a kill.
As for me I don't care what an advertisement says. I won't shoot at a coyote at 80 yards with a shotgun.
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I snatch kisses. And vice versa.
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Kokopelli
SENIOR DISCOUNT & Dispenser of Sage Advice
Member # 633
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posted October 20, 2016 08:10 AM
I dunno ................ thinking out loud, here.
Most of my coyotes are shot between 20 and 40 yards.
At those yardages, plain old 3" copper plated lead BB seems to kill them dead enough if I keep my head on the stock and out of my ass.
So the only advantage to the mega- $$$ ammo is the occasional shot out around > 50 yards ??
Anything closer with the high dollar ammo is just wasted coin and horsepower.
For me, it's just not worth the extra expense for something that is usually not needed.
YMMV
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And lo, the Light of the Trump shown upon the Darkness and the Darkness could not comprehend it.
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted October 20, 2016 08:20 AM
Well, apparently, we are peeling back the various components of the issue.
What I had not considered, before reading the above post, is that I always assumed I had an option. But, if there is only one way, then I guess I would have to go all in, the best damned custom load I could assemble.
But since we have a choice, until Hillary starts with her Executive Orders, I think the rifle is a bit more versatile. (yes, I'm starting to get very depressed)
Really now, would God allow this Bitch to become president? It's hard to believe?
Sudden thought, executive action banning Heavy shot, TSS shot, any diameter over/above BB? Or, am I being silly? Don't put anything past this evil bitch.
Good hunting. El Bee
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31465 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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