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Author
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Topic: Back after them
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted January 30, 2024 08:35 AM
That was the Pachacho Summit campout, the one that Higgins picked the location....Thanks Rich! Always want to have a campout in the middle of some dense bushes!
Good hunting. El Bee
edit: And remember, there was a lot of wide open space, driving in to the bushes!
[ January 30, 2024, 08:36 AM: Message edited by: Leonard ]
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31449 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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UTcaller
NEVADA NIGHT FIGHTER
Member # 8
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posted February 08, 2024 07:25 PM
Boy I sure wish I would have gone to those campouts. Life just got to busy. I also regret not getting to go out to Nevada with You, Dave, and Scott. I was all ready to go and then a Family thing came up last minute. Scott called me when he got to Utah and we had a nice chat on the phone. But now that I’m older I wish I had put some of that stuff aside and enjoyed your guys company.
Good Hunting Chad
[ February 08, 2024, 07:26 PM: Message edited by: UTcaller ]
Posts: 1612 | From: Utah | Registered: Jan 2003
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TA17Rem
Hello, I'm the legendary Tim Anderson, Field Marshall, Southern Minneesota Sector
Member # 794
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posted February 08, 2024 10:59 PM
I think the first two was the best. Had Steve Craig talk too few about snaring and calling big cats, but he kind of held back little on cats since he usually gave instruction classes on them. Paul was real hoot he reminded me of that big game hunter in Africa that went around shot elephants and wore a wide brim hat. The Maj. from Colorado talked about Rem. 550 22 l.r. and calling fox. Tim B. was a real hoot to hang with along with Vic, Tim B. was pretty good campfire cook and Vic was good at scrambling eggs with the pistol.
Higgins was a blast as well just wish he didn't stutter so bad when he chose his words, lot of knowledge there on AZ. coyotes.
Hunting with Shaw and Higgins was pretty good also, more laid-back type of southern calling and good info on stand selections for that type of calling. Saw my first southern bobcat I think Danny the fire jumper shot it and I helped him get it skinned. Think it was Tim B. that cooked up the backstraps and a snake was also brought in to try as well. Names slip me here but two guys from AZ trappers' ass. was a wealth of knowledge as far as trapping goes plus, they nice enough to let me use their truck for few hours.
Had whats his name from Cali. with his night rigg that invited me to go calling but then in morning turned me down cause I didn't have a shot gun. So I hunted with Higgens and Shaw and shot one coyote at 3-5 yards with a scoped rifle and Higgens did a heck of a job keeping that coyote in my face till I could find hair in the scope. Higgins was pumping that mist bottle like he was shooting a AR and it worked. LOL
Also remember when Danny passed away they brought some of his calls and other odd stuff to camp out for anyone that wanted some of it. I got a few calls and some call parts.
Bill was a pretty good guy and he worked at one of the mines by town doing same thing I did up in Mn. so we had things to talk about there.
Leonard's partner Pat was heck of a nice guy, enjoyed his company as well.
I think I met Koko on my last campout up by Pauls place. It was something to be gathered there in camp with callers from all over and many had their own way or style of doing it.
And R. Shaw was a hell of a snake whisper as well.
[ February 08, 2024, 11:03 PM: Message edited by: TA17Rem ]
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What if I told you, the left wing and right wing both belong to same bird!
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Kokopelli
SENIOR DISCOUNT & Dispenser of Sage Advice
Member # 633
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posted February 09, 2024 08:34 AM
Yeah, I think that the campout that I met Tim was the one that I ran into Gerry Blair at a gas station in Seligman. He was on his way to an elk hunt. Neat guy that 'never met a stranger'.
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And lo, the Light of the Trump shown upon the Darkness and the Darkness could not comprehend it.
Posts: 7576 | From: Under a wandering star | Registered: Apr 2005
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted February 09, 2024 10:18 AM
Yeah, old times. We probably should have documented those campouts a lot better? The "night rig" guy you mention is ? drawing a blank, I'll get back to you....
that didn't take long, Gary Clevenger, a complete asshole. He considered that Pichacho Peak campout to be exactly like a hunt contest, which is complete bullshit. Personally, I didn't care if I killed anything, I've been there done that. But Gary asked me to take photos of him with his kill, which was 5 animals, and he "confided in me" that he thought he was, well, he didn't say first place, but he surmised that he had already killed more coyotes than anybody in camp. What a warped asshole. The coyote will get real close, and not much fear and he uses an overunder and blasts them, usually within 10 feet. He has no plan B. That must be why he turned you down? First of all, if you were outside of his thicket, you would shoot any coyote approaching his hideout and you would negate what he was doing, so of course, he couldn't have that. But, on the other hand, it sounds like a clusterfuck to have 2 guys with shotguns in the bushes with no visibility? IDK? Maybe back to back might work. But you got bugs crawling up your legs and down your neck, and the odds are getting good that you will soon step on a fucking rattlesnake. Whatever, he thinks he has discovered a gold mine. But he's a one trick pony. Fuck him! He has stabbed me in the back several times, so yeah, I'm going to tell you what I think of the prick! He was jealous, because he never, ever won a fucking thing in our hunts, usually blanked? As a night hunter, he was a consistant failure. Some can, some can't and I don't care, but he always wanted to prove himself at something. Already wasted too much ink on a total asshole, <sigh>
Good hunting. El Bee
[ February 09, 2024, 10:39 AM: Message edited by: Leonard ]
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
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UTcaller
NEVADA NIGHT FIGHTER
Member # 8
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posted February 09, 2024 11:45 AM
Yeah I wouldn’t have cared if I even left camp. Just to sit around shooting the Bull and telling stories that would be priceless. I can go out and kill Coyotes any old time I want. But to swap stories that would make for some great memories.
Good Hunting Chad
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TA17Rem
Hello, I'm the legendary Tim Anderson, Field Marshall, Southern Minneesota Sector
Member # 794
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posted February 09, 2024 12:01 PM
Oh dam I forgot about Gerry, he was good story teller.
Yeah Leonard spot on about Clever Gary, he did think it was some sort of calling contest and few others there to prove themselves as well. I was there mostly to meet guys from group and stayed in camp mostly. Did get out for afternoon hunt, Bill suggested I go north across the interstate highway but there wasn't much open ground that I'm used to calling in. When I hunted with Shaw and Higgins, we went a few miles East and the ground was little more open for shotguns or rifles, and I felt comfortable hunting that area. I also remember that those Az. coyotes stink and smell so bad I doubt they could smell a human. LOL
I was sitting on one stand with Shaw and had some sort of bush for backing and noticed a hole in the ground right between my feet about the size of a silver dollar. As I was sitting on stand, I noticed this black object moving on the ground and coming in my directions so kept an eye on it while I scanned for coyotes. It finally got close enough to tell what it was, biggest dam spider I ever saw in my life, and it kept coming.
I didn't want to ruin the stand, so I just let the spider run its course. Just as the stand was about to be over the spider was now between my feet and headed straight for that hole and soon disappeared into it, wow that was close. LOL
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What if I told you, the left wing and right wing both belong to same bird!
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TA17Rem
Hello, I'm the legendary Tim Anderson, Field Marshall, Southern Minneesota Sector
Member # 794
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posted February 09, 2024 12:25 PM
On one of the campouts I road there with R. Shaw and his 3 amigos', we took two pickups and made a few stops in N.M. to call coyotes. I don't remember how many Geordie got on one stand but he did pretty good. Then I remember one stand 2 of Randy's amigos said to me as we was walking back to the truck that my calling was getting better. I told them I'm not here to teach and only reason they was along for ride was to glean what they could from who ever. We stopped down the road aways and think it was Shaws turn to call and he called in a nice big redish brown coyote and one of the amigos' took the shot and missed it. LOL
Found out his rifle was off and got that fixed.
WE got back in the pickup and Randy says its my turn to call so pick a spot and we got about 3/8 mile down road and I said stop. Randy and the amigo said why here so soon we just burned out that spot little ways behind us. I said its my turn and I want to call here.
They weren't too happy about my choice to say the least, but they complied, and we stopped and set up for a stand. I let out a few series on hand call and soon I hear the amigo's gun go off. Big reddish-brown coyote come out of a corn field and stopped in front of the amigo, and he hit it this time. He claimed that was the biggest coyote he ever killed to date.
As we walked back to the truck short time later, I look at the amigo and said to him, how's my calling coming along now? LOL He was speechless.
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What if I told you, the left wing and right wing both belong to same bird!
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted February 10, 2024 07:58 AM
That story only proves what I have believed for a long time, play your hunches. It's like a hot spot on a lake, biggest bass I ever caught was off a dock with a backlash and landing in the weeds close to shore. And calling in a cat while busy working on some equipment and routinely playing a sound. We had 4 coyotes standing on a berm watching us while we were looking at a map spread out on the hood of the truck. It's kinda unpredictable, like you can't catch a fish unless your line is in the water. Same thing with Higgins, he used to call parking lots and back yards, unlike me, I'd get as far out the end of the road as possible, then keep going. What looks good to you might not look as "gammy" to me. So, you can't teach instinct, just play hunches. And then work a stand in a way that guarantees a blank. I've seen these guys waste a lot of time worried about hiding the truck and then watch a coyote run right past a vehicle at a gallop heading to your stand a quarter a mile away, but the truck was "hidden" from YOU! Whatever!
Good hunting. El Bee
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31449 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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Kokopelli
SENIOR DISCOUNT & Dispenser of Sage Advice
Member # 633
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posted February 10, 2024 08:37 AM
![[Smile]](smile.gif)
It's not too hard to bring up a visual of two pick-ups passing each other on a dirt road (neither one slowing down to reduce dust for the other guy) one with a shotgun leaving the wide open country and heading for the thick brush and the other with a rifle leaving the brush country heading for the open areas ........... and both knowing that they're doing it right. ![[Eek!]](eek.gif)
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And lo, the Light of the Trump shown upon the Darkness and the Darkness could not comprehend it.
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TA17Rem
Hello, I'm the legendary Tim Anderson, Field Marshall, Southern Minneesota Sector
Member # 794
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posted February 10, 2024 01:54 PM
In my case I learned long time ago the game is never over with a called and missed coyote till coyote says it's over. I remember reading where many callers would claim a shot at coyote was headed for the next county or what have you and it's not the case. They just run far enough till they feel comfortable and can't see you. Plus, one needs to keep in mind coyotes are territorial so they only going to go so far. I had a 50/50 chance of bringing that coyote back in, the others gave up but I didn't. LOL
This winter I have small groups I been calling to and take one out at a time or if stand goes sour just let them go. I have 5 groups I've called in more than 7 times but do have two coyotes I have not been able to do anything with due to my nephew doing a fauking mag. dump on them, but I'll get them figured out soon enough.
I also remember years ago callers making claims they have a tough pair way out in front and couldn't do anything with them and they just gave up and would sneak back out of the area. I've stayed for as long as 2 1/2 hours or better with some and long as they stick around you just stick it out for long as you can till one fucks up. The temp.s been nice this year which allows me to stay longer on a stand if I have too.
I don't have hundreds of coyotes, so I don't have the option of just packing up and going to look for a easy one, but then again what does that prove.
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What if I told you, the left wing and right wing both belong to same bird!
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TA17Rem
Hello, I'm the legendary Tim Anderson, Field Marshall, Southern Minneesota Sector
Member # 794
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posted February 10, 2024 02:11 PM
Yeah I agree with the truck deal Leonard. Had it happened here few times this winter. I don't have too many spots to hide the truck, so I just park it in a field approach and walk farther away from it down the road or farther into a field. I get a coyote that swings wide to my downwind side which is where my truck is and they walk right by it. But do know if the caller is set up to close to truck and then they see it they will lock up. So now I walk little farther and set caller down and walk back towards the truck but still aways away from it and sit. I know coyotes can see well in the dark but just don't know what they are seeing or how far exactly. A foggy night seems to help in my favor.
Another thing I don't like is I have to use a tri-pod and stand or you just don't see them come due to ground being so flat with little dips and shallow valleys, not much for high spots to sit on due to not being in right locations to where they will come from and some high spots just offer the coyote a hiding spot as when they get to base of a little hill you can't see them and then they lock up and bark. Second shooter would be nice to have along for those places.
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What if I told you, the left wing and right wing both belong to same bird!
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted February 11, 2024 11:33 AM
I'm sorry, I can't get very serious about coyotes in Minnesota. I don't know what else to think about it, but do not forget, within my memory, there weren't any coyotes in that state! Zip! I have mentioned before that the biggest deal, ever, for me was spotting a Red Fox hightailing it at the end of a cornrow we were tramping through, while pheasant hunting. To me, at the time, it was equivalent to seeing maybe a Bengal Tiger cross the road in front of the car. (nobody had trucks)
I am as positive as I can be, well "speculating" might be more accurate; that we starting to hunt coyotes in California, and soon after, in neighboring states, that is the reason for pushing coyotes EAST. That's my story and I'm sticking to it!
I had always heard that the Mississippi river was a historic barrier for coyote movements....until they took a chance and crossed a friggin' bridge! Which they will do, that's a fact.
Another story I heard, a long time ago is that somebody, somewhere? was live trapping coyotes for some application in, was it one of the Carolina's? I'm sort of hazy on the story, but they supposedly were training dogs to do something? And anyway, that was the "HOW" coyotes wound up all over the eastern states. Could be bullshit, IDK? But, it does offer a reason for how and why they got spread all over the United States in the 50's and 60's when they never had the urge, before, without help?
And suddenly we heard stories about COYDOGS. Personally, I never believed those stories until i personally killed a couple and had no other explanation? Rare, but possible.
Anyway, the whole idea of hunting coyotes in Minnesota is just weird....to me?
Good hunting. El Bee
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
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TA17Rem
Hello, I'm the legendary Tim Anderson, Field Marshall, Southern Minneesota Sector
Member # 794
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posted February 11, 2024 12:12 PM
I knew we had coyotes' way up north in the state back in 70's and then had our first coyotes in southern part of the state moved in in 1985.
Think my coyotes came from the north and they called them brush wolves back then.
According to studies I have the Eastern strain of coyotes that go as far west into half of the state of S.D..
If you look at a AZ. coyote vrs. western S.D. coyote and then Minnesota coyote there is a difference in them. Build of body, size and fur are different. Coyotes here tend to be little more timid as well and not always eager to defend their terr. like other places.
A Lady in Tenn. or close by cross breeds coyotes to dogs so yes it can happen.
Coyotes can swim also.
Not weird hunting coyotes here, just different and more work at times. I guess I could say our coyotes behave like your coyotes that been called to by a F-P several times.
Little tid-bit on overshooting at coyotes. The dogs I run are not bred as gun dogs so when you shoot around them to close it can shut them down for a few hours or even a day depending on how bad the shooting was, each dog handles it little different. If this happens then I have to take them someplace without other hunters around and get them to hunt again and forget about the shooting. I believe coyotes that been shot at behave same way and it just takes time for them to get over it, some never do depending on how bad they were shot at like a mag. dump for example.
I don't have a lot of coyotes so I can't afford to mag. dump or overshoot a group and just try to take one out with one shot and then let it get quiet, then come back at another date and try for another.
I got out last night and used my side by side to get around with, much easier to hide than a pick up. Went back to area I called 7 times before and had coyotes all seven times still willing to play and I got another one of them last night. I went to another spot I called 8 times and got another coyote out of the area which took 2 hours to come in from mile away. If I hear them howl or happen to spot one of them, I don't leave till the coyote does. It was dark with 32 temp. and no wind, dead calm which was perfect as coyote has no downwind to go to, just come straight in. If you had a bigger screen on phone, I would send you a vid. from last night.
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What if I told you, the left wing and right wing both belong to same bird!
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TA17Rem
Hello, I'm the legendary Tim Anderson, Field Marshall, Southern Minneesota Sector
Member # 794
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posted February 11, 2024 12:17 PM
Koko you got a smart phone with big screen??
If so send me a text. 507-227-2097
[ February 11, 2024, 12:19 PM: Message edited by: TA17Rem ]
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What if I told you, the left wing and right wing both belong to same bird!
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Kokopelli
SENIOR DISCOUNT & Dispenser of Sage Advice
Member # 633
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posted February 11, 2024 12:28 PM
Nah, a burner flip phone pretty much maxes out my tech savvy. Sorry.
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And lo, the Light of the Trump shown upon the Darkness and the Darkness could not comprehend it.
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted February 11, 2024 12:37 PM
That's another thing. I almost NEVER call even close to the same place, a second time. I admit that are a couple spots on the reservation that it would be a shame to not make a stand, it's so ideal, and I might not get there again, the same season. But, it's always cold calling and no repeat stands. There is too much territory available and even making a stand in the same place would be more or less an accident.
When, you can document some spot where you made a stand 8 times, that just doesn't compute, for me? I remember a place on the res. where you drive in a half mile and there is a tank, and it's just begging to be called, but even then, I'm pretty sure I only called that spot 3 times over 15 years, so that's hardly the same thing. It's not a legit concept, again, we have wide wide open spaces!
Think about this. We head out on a week end hunt, and might go to 4 different states. Yes, we decide ahead of time, but when I would leave the little woman at home, she piped up and said, hey look, should something happen and you don't come back, I would feel pretty stupid when the cop asks; okay where did he go. And she would say, he's been going to Nevada lately, or in the fall, he seems to go to Arizona more often. So, she insisted on buying me a cell phone, the analogue type so I wouldn't be broke down and stranded. That's why I can't relate to somebody making a statement that he has called the exact same spot EIGHT TIMES!
Good hunting. El Bee
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
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TA17Rem
Hello, I'm the legendary Tim Anderson, Field Marshall, Southern Minneesota Sector
Member # 794
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posted February 11, 2024 01:07 PM
Yes eight times. Thats where they are, the whole family group and somewhat split up with some in one mile section and some in the next and all within hearing distance. Drive about five miles down road and then the next group is scattered about. Then go another five miles north and another group. I don't have to drive to Iowa or S.D. to find coyotes.
Got a red fox living on edge of town to south and a pair of coyotes on edge of town to east. Then just down road have a family group living up by feed lot in the haystacks. I usually don't get a second shot on multiples so just let them go, I'll be back. LOL
Its kind of like it here as it is for state trappers in S.D. they only have certain places they can work or call, no large numbers if you go about it right way. Skim the easy ones early and work for the tuff ones later, just how it is.
Been using the Lucky duck for skimming and WT on the tuff ones and also have a few other guys that come through area calling with their fox pro's of which it doesn't hold a candle to either caller I have.
[ February 11, 2024, 01:10 PM: Message edited by: TA17Rem ]
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What if I told you, the left wing and right wing both belong to same bird!
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TA17Rem
Hello, I'm the legendary Tim Anderson, Field Marshall, Southern Minneesota Sector
Member # 794
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posted February 11, 2024 01:23 PM
Speaking of callers did you know WT had coyote vocals from the beginning that were recorded by the owner of WT. (over 25 years ago) Still going strong!
Lucky duck comes along, and owner recorded his own sounds a few years back. And then Fox pro which has been around for long time as well is just getting into the coyote vocal game and their sounds are outsourced from Cal. T. and MFK.
And if you remember my old posts about how I set caller next to me so I can rotate it 360 degrees to get the sound out there? Well a few people must have listened cause F-P and Lucky duck now both have rotating E-callers. LOL Faukers aren't smart enough to come up with their own ideas on calling coyotes, always have to copy someone. LOL
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What if I told you, the left wing and right wing both belong to same bird!
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted February 11, 2024 10:13 PM
We used to do a version of that before you ever saw a fucking coyote. With a Weems all call.
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
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TA17Rem
Hello, I'm the legendary Tim Anderson, Field Marshall, Southern Minneesota Sector
Member # 794
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posted February 12, 2024 12:29 PM
Perhaps Leonard but only documented info on it was by Ed Sceery Using his howlers and by me using a E-caller and I'm talking calling 360 degrees not just side to side. But do know some guys did it with E-caller to locate only. I have most of the calling handbooks and most articles written on coyote calling back from the 70's and no mention of it.
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What if I told you, the left wing and right wing both belong to same bird!
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Kokopelli
SENIOR DISCOUNT & Dispenser of Sage Advice
Member # 633
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posted February 12, 2024 12:45 PM
Gerry Blair mentioned turning the caller in an old vhs video. Not sure of the year. ![[Confused]](confused.gif)
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And lo, the Light of the Trump shown upon the Darkness and the Darkness could not comprehend it.
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UTcaller
NEVADA NIGHT FIGHTER
Member # 8
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posted February 12, 2024 01:06 PM
Wow TA’s contribution to the history of predator calling is turning a E-caller 360 degrees while calling on a stand. Revolutionary!!!!😂😉
Good Hunting Chad
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted February 12, 2024 02:02 PM
See there, Tim. He's using sarcasm and suggesting your methods and ideas aren't totally revolutionary.
You know, there have been people browsing these pages that actually have been there and done that and it's somewhat difficult to tell them something they don't already know. I myself started calling coyotes in the 1960's, actually my first call was a Seercy. I ate half of the mouthpiece over the years. My first machine was a car tape deck using 8 track tapes I had to modify. I still have it. I had Gerald Stewart build me a special called for applications few people would understand a need for, at the time. which was more than a half a century ago. There's not much I haven't thought of, on my own.
I USED TO HAVE A STUFFED PUPPY RIGGED WITH RUBBER BANDS THAT I WOULD YANK ON, BEFORE ANYBODY DID IT WITH A MOTOR AND BATTERIES. THE NEED FOR SUCH A THING/DEVICE WAS CONSIDERED, EMPLOYED AND DISCARDED BEFORE MOST FOLKS HAD EVER SEEN A REAL COYOTE.
Ahead of the curve, sorta. I did a lot of experimenting with different equipment long before anybody had ever heard of Foxpro. But, there I go tooting my own horn. Sorry! Excuse me. It's just that I've been screwing around with coyotes for years, not the first but I have wasted a lot of money on stuff that had little monetary value.
There is an article in one magazine about using an ebike for hunting coyotes. WE didn't have the "E" but we sure as hell used a bike along the canals and levees. One guy I know used a special skateboard on a 40 mile run of highway 95 in Nevada. Just over the hill was Area 51.
The Burnham brothers plowed some new ground, back in the day. Hell, this was before the CAMO revolution. Believe it or not, when I stared hunting coyotes and making stands, absolutely nobody made camo clothing of any kind. Now, it's mandatory....they think.
I've seen quite a bit, now that I think about it.
Good hunting. El Bee
edit: excuse this, I don't want to sound like I know it all.
[ February 12, 2024, 02:20 PM: Message edited by: Leonard ]
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
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TA17Rem
Hello, I'm the legendary Tim Anderson, Field Marshall, Southern Minneesota Sector
Member # 794
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posted February 12, 2024 02:55 PM
quote:
See there, Tim. He's using sarcasm and suggesting your methods and ideas aren't totally revolutionary.
And yet people are still walking out and placing there caller on the ground or in a tree/ fence post. LOL
Like said though there is no other documentation of anyone doing it till now. Look through archives on a rainy day let me know what you can find on it. Most articles you also read, or books say place E-caller out in front of stand nothing more on it. Can also remember when I mentioned placing caller next to me most members here questioned my reason for doing it not one stepped in and said likewise or said so and so does it, not one peep. LOL Then for years all a guy hears about is how the remote range sucks on this caller or that caller and so on. LOL
Yeah I started with a Dennis Kirk cassette caller and a Johny Stewart cass. caller, never used the speaker with the wire on it.
I started on red fox till the coyotes moved in, same game just different sounds and approach and spent many years calling coyotes in the Dakotas before I was even a member here. Funny thing about the Dennis Kirk caller, wasn't that hard to switch sounds on it and he came out with some nice duplex calling tapes that no one else ever thought of at the time.
[ February 12, 2024, 03:02 PM: Message edited by: TA17Rem ]
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What if I told you, the left wing and right wing both belong to same bird!
Posts: 5062 | From: S.D. | Registered: Jan 2006
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