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Posted by smithers (Member # 646) on June 24, 2011, 07:37 PM:
Are so stupid! My sister and her boyfriend watch that crap all the time and my kids love to watch them sometimes too. Blah! Ghost shmost...
Posted by Cdog911 (Member # 7) on June 24, 2011, 07:39 PM:
Then don't watch them.
Posted by TOM64 (Member # 561) on June 24, 2011, 08:01 PM:
Anybody catching these new bigfoot shows on Monster Quest?
Posted by smithers (Member # 646) on June 24, 2011, 09:24 PM:
Cdog, thanks... I don't watch them but I walk into the room every once in a while and the kids are watching them and freaking out. Is it real dad? Is it real?
Bigfoot? Now that's something I can believe in ![[Smile]](smile.gif)
Posted by TA17Rem (Member # 794) on June 24, 2011, 09:43 PM:
quote:
Bigfoot? Now that's something I can believe in
I believe Kirby huffed one of them in a hole a few years back. ![[Wink]](wink.gif)
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on June 24, 2011, 09:52 PM:
It ain't pretty. Brace yourself!
Posted by smithers (Member # 646) on June 25, 2011, 06:57 AM:
Rosie's such a homo... A bigfooted one.
Huffing holes.. Lol. That was funny stuff.
Posted by Okanagan (Member # 870) on June 25, 2011, 07:20 AM:
When I read the title of this thread about paranormal TV shows, I thought it was about hunting shows on televsion.
[ June 25, 2011, 07:20 AM: Message edited by: Okanagan ]
Posted by Dave Allen (Member # 3102) on June 25, 2011, 07:32 AM:
I kinda like "Haunted Collector" ...
Posted by Cdog911 (Member # 7) on June 25, 2011, 11:33 AM:
LOL, that old man just uses the paranormal investigator schtick as a way to get into your house, finds something he wants to take, and convinces the owner that the object is responsible for their problems so they'll ask him to take it. Then, he takes it home and puts it under glass. What bullshit. In the same show this past week, the entity they were investigating in Pueblo apparently went through solid walls and, yes, glass to start that old engine. Jay and Grant, at least, come at it from the angle that their intent is to debunk claims rather than steal your stuff. LOL
Posted by Cayotaytalker (Member # 1954) on June 25, 2011, 12:54 PM:
Big foot nut here.I guess it go's back to the 70's and a movie name of "The Legend of Boggy Creek" And a place name of Faulk Arkansas and the Faulk Monster.
I will watch a big foot movie if I'm flipping channels and catch one on.
Not sure way but I'm a bit of a crack head for Monster Quest.
They never find any thing,and I do not expect them to. But I do like to see some of the high tech toys they have on a few of the shows.
They don't seam to show The Monster Quest that much any more.
But it seams it all got started a few years back with a show with a hot blonde chick going all over the USA in a mobile home,chasing big foot.
I saw the one just the other day where they were looking for big foot in BC.
Not in to the paranormal stuff.
And have never been in to must see TV.
That might be way I watch alot of History Channel.
And for the record,just be cause I will watch Monster Quset does not mean I think any of it is real.
Posted by Cdog911 (Member # 7) on June 25, 2011, 01:23 PM:
When my step mom died and I had to explain to my then 12 year old son about life and death, he didn't seem to be buying into the whole everlasting life at the knee of God thing so I went to the science side which he seemed to grasp a little better. I told him, as I do somewhat believe, that energy can neither be created or destroyed and that what we know as "life" is, to me, more than a series of complex chemical reactions and is, in fact, an energy that, when we die, has to continue to exists somewhere. Where? We don't know. Heaven? A convenient story to allay our anxieties over what happens to us when we check out. In any event, I saw strange things happen repeatedly and in the same way time and again in our old house which was 120 years old when we moved out and those occurrences really got you to thinking.
On the Bigfoot, or unknown monsters, I often recall one of the first Stephen King stories I ever read where this guy was lost in the North woods being chased by something he couldn't see. King made the point in this story that there are sounds we cannot hear in this world because our ears cannot pick them up, and that there may very well be organisms we cannot see because they are of a coloration or a composition that is beyond the ability of our eyes to see them. I wonder if there is anything out there that we cannot see that could do us harm if it so chose?
Posted by TOM64 (Member # 561) on June 25, 2011, 02:12 PM:
I'm not much into ghosts but I don't doubt they exist. Being a believer in God, angels and the devil, nothing is out of the question...
Now bigfoot is another story. We have a guy here who owns a music store, he is a believer and even has a web site dedicated to finding bigfoot. The discovery channel came and paid him a visit, did a show and never found him.
But while they were here, a guy that works for a friend of mine (and is injun) got in on the documentery. He told the stories that had been passed down to him by his ancestors. Took em out looking for it, smelled something and saw a black object off in the distance, turned out to be a cow. Maybe some of ya'll seen the show, anyway he got paid serious money for guiding up a cow.
I have another friend that saw something, he lived with his wife and baby daughter in an old ranch house close to Centrahoma in exchange for feeding cattle and a little ranch work
One night he was chopping wood for his stove and his horse went crazy. He had a pit bull that was nothing short of viscous with him and the dog started looking off in the woods. He could see by the yard light and then something big and dark colored stepped over the fence and looked at him.
He sicked his dog on it but the dog was already under the porch and wouldn't come out. It crossed the lot, stepped over and vanished in the dark.
Long story short, whatever it was stayed around his house that night and he moved the next day. I've heard the story when he was sober and drunk, never a word changed. His wife heard something that night and was scared to death of that place. It was pretty evident he saw something but what I don't know.
So since we can't pick on the fuzz, let's tell ghost stories. ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
Posted by smithers (Member # 646) on June 25, 2011, 02:37 PM:
Let's just say when it comes to ghosts and religion, I'm agnostic.
Aliens and bigfoots and yeti's are REAL!
Posted by Cayotaytalker (Member # 1954) on June 25, 2011, 04:19 PM:
Tom64.I saw that show but I don't think that they let on that the black object was a cow.
I get out into some wild country here in Nevada at night and must say a guy can start to see a few odd shapes in the darkness.Or get that over powering urge to look back over his shoulder.
But I have done some calling at night in some country that I have seen some lion sign in.
But I have never saw a UFO are any thing like that.I did get scared by some wild horses one night that ran up on the side of the quad I was on be for they turned back that was at night.
That's about it for me.
Posted by tlbradford (Member # 1232) on June 25, 2011, 04:46 PM:
I had two instances after my dad died which were the closest things to parnormal activity that I have encountered.
The first was when I was flyfishing for steelhead one summer evening. I had never caught one on the fly and had just started flyfishing in earnest that summer. I felt something out of the ordinary and turned around. There was a man walking his dog, that looked exactly like my dad and our old brittany spaniel. I waved, and he waved back. That very next cast I hooked a steelhead. I turned around right after the hookset and the guy was gone. I landed a beautiful fish and never could get it out of my mind that I had just seen my dad.
The second was when my alarm had not gone off after studying late into the night for an important final in college. Growing up, my dad would wake me by whispering my name from the door of my room for our early morning hunts or fishing trips. That morning I heard him calling my name and woke up with a rush. I made it to my final just in time.
Posted by smithers (Member # 646) on June 25, 2011, 05:00 PM:
Not much scares me, but, a few times I have been out hunting at night and spooked roosting turkeys. Them sum bitches make a hell of a racket flying through and into every tree in the vicinity. In the dead of the night, that'll get your blood pumpin'.
Posted by CCP (Member # 913) on June 25, 2011, 05:20 PM:
A covey of quail and a electric fence at night will do it every time for me. ![[Eek!]](eek.gif)
Posted by George Ackley (Member # 898) on June 25, 2011, 07:56 PM:
I never told anyone but I am a believer,
I been getting seduced and raped by the ghost of Marilyn Monroe in my sleep for many years .
my wife tells me i should call one of them investigates, I tell her I should sleep on before making any decision.
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on June 25, 2011, 08:13 PM:
I remember one time many years ago, can't even hunt, where we were, now days.
So we were out busting cottontails and valley quail, had vests so we just kept walking.
We didn't get back to the vehicle until well past dark and somebody slammed a door and all hell broke loose. We had parked between some good sized pinion pines and every one of them erupted with beating wings in every direction. I would guess we flushed a couple hundred quail and it scared the hell out of me, you can believe that!
I've been daydreaming about Michelle Bachman lately. Prefer brunettes. I'm a sucker for smart conservatives.
gh....lb
Posted by RagnCajn (Member # 879) on June 25, 2011, 08:56 PM:
Cayotaytalker, Fouke, AR. About an hour drive north of here. Small wide spot in the road. That was a big story around there years back. They have routed an Interstate around it now and I don't go through there any more. Before the interstate, all traffic from Shreveport to Texarkana, via Hwy 71 went through there. There was a store in town that had a mural of the creature on the wall.
Posted by Cayotaytalker (Member # 1954) on June 26, 2011, 07:48 AM:
I saw that name and that town Fouke but I guess I have always thought the name was Falk.
That must of been how I came up with Falk monster.
I was young when the movie came out. Still lived at home so life was easy and fun.
I don't think I have been to far past Lake Texoma. I guess your part of the world must look just about the same.
My buddy had an old dog that would go every where we went. That old dog would just run along with us,as we would roll a long on our sting ray bikes.
We soon had motorcycles and would haul the dog on our gas tank.
We were camping on some farm pound one night. when something came crashing through the weeds on it's way into camp, man was I glad it was just that old dog. Of course that was not all that long after seeing the movie.
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on June 26, 2011, 10:13 AM:
I watched something about bigfoot last night. Shit, found out it was two hours, so I went to bed after the first one. Kinda, <yawn>
But, I agree, there are some spooky things in the remote woods, at night.
I was joy riding a jeep along a powerline road in the Okifanoke. Actually, it was on Eglin AFB. ( know that ain't right, but it's the best I can do) I got stuck. First and only time I have ever been high centered by tree branches. Well past midnight, I don't think there was a moon.
I had to walk back to the crypto hut and steal a deuce and a half with a winch. This was not easy, it was in the middle of three landing strips.
So, for more than ten miles, (hell, it could have been twenty?) I drove one vehicle and leapfrogged the other, then walked back and did it again, and again and again.
The woods were impenetrable on both sides and it was spooky and there were sounds, but I just didn't want to get caught, forget the spooks. Nobody ever found out, so don't tell anybody; it's your word against mine, and everybody knows what a liar I am.
gh....lb
Posted by JD (Member # 768) on June 26, 2011, 10:57 AM:
Speaking of having a strange feeling and a need to look over your shoulder.........I was sitting in a small bush at the top edge of a drainage lightly blowing a hand call down the drainage and towards a wooded bottom when the hair stood up on the back of my neck, I stopped calling and sat still for a few moments when I had an urge to look over my shoulder which was usually unneeded as the farm house was maybe a 100yds over the hill behind me.
I turned slowly and locked eyes with a 100+ lbs Rottweiler standing no more than 15 feet behind me, as we stared at each other I saw him bristle up, I don't think he was totally sure what the hell I was, not sure if he was scared, pissed or both. I slowly swung my rifle around and prepared to stick the muzzle of my 22-250 in his chest and jerk the trigger as he was taking his first bite from the side of my face, just then he let out a strange little huff sound and turned and walked away. Wheeeew!!!
I don't know about bigfoots and ghosts and whatnot, maybe they exist maybe not, I think not, but one thing I do know is that I would take a ghost or a damn bigfoot over a Rottweiler any day, I have never heard of someone getting there face removed by a bigfoot......have you?
Posted by DanS (Member # 316) on June 26, 2011, 11:14 AM:
I was on a stand, and had my Airedale with me. Ended up calling in about 5 Dogs, not coyotes. I thought it might get ugly real quick, fast, and in a hurry, but luckily, didn't.
Can't say I've ever seen a bigfoot, or ghost. I have had those dern roosting turkeys scare that crap out of me though.
About the most edgy I think I've gotten was Bow hunting bear in Canada. Leaving the tree stand over bait, after dark, especially after hearing wolves did get my dander up a couple of nights. Only carrying a Bow, and sharp sticks, and waiting by the road for my ride to come pick me up on the way back was interesting.
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on June 26, 2011, 12:01 PM:
Spending the night in any broke down cabin or abandoned ranch house can be nerve wracking, lots of packrats and other critters make enough noise to keep you listening for more. I tried sleeping in an old mineshaft, once. It was probably 30° cooler than outside, but after setting up a cot and bag and taking my boots off, I changed my mind.
Maybe because I had caught a rattler at the entrance, the day before....should have killed him but I just let him go? First and only time I caught a rattlesnake with my bare hands. Upon reflection, I think it was a particularly stupid stunt.
gh....lb
Posted by smithers (Member # 646) on June 26, 2011, 02:39 PM:
DanS, I have an uncle that did the same as you. Bow-only bear hunt in Canada. He said damn near what you said. Scared the hell out of him walking out after dark, waiting for someone to pick him up. I'd have had a six gallon bucket of bear spray on me, no doubt.
Posted by the bearhunter (Member # 3552) on June 26, 2011, 03:38 PM:
been walking out of bear baits after dark for 27 years. it don't get any easier. never had a bad occurance but it's always on the mind. flushing ruffed grouse after dark under your feet will get the pucker factor into the 9's.
ghost's,(spirits) yeah, i believe. have had 2 way to real,unexplained things happen to me not to believe.
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on June 26, 2011, 04:11 PM:
Hey, have they finally decided to allow a firearm, (for protection) while bow hunting?
Really, there is Blair Witch stuff going on in the dark. I can't believe these guys that hunt at night by themselves! There are too many normal problems that require two heads. I remember the dog star freaking me out one morning. I really thought it was a flying saucer. Atmospheric conditions were just right. Like a harvest moon. That is something that looks like a planet is about to crash into the earth!
Best to just stay home and lock the doors and pull the drapes and hide under the covers.
gh....lb
Posted by DanS (Member # 316) on June 26, 2011, 05:57 PM:
Always heard the easiest way to tell bear poop from others is bear poop has cloth and pepper spray in it.
When I was up nort, in Canuk land, we had to have our bow cased until we entered the woods or bush as they called it. Upon leaving we had to case it again.
I heard some would put a padlock around the string and one of the cams, on a compound. Can't be shot that way. Crazy law, but I thought they were crazy eating "Gravy Fries" too. That and a big greasy burger was the traditional heart attack platter.
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on June 26, 2011, 06:48 PM:
Nope, ever notice a jar of Cheese Whiz on the table, in every restaurant? They put it on their toast, for breakfast. And guess what? When I was up there before Obama, the dollar was worth more than the Canadian dollar. Thanks to Obama, the Canadian dollar is now worth more than a real dollar.
gh....lb
edit: cloth, pepper spray and little jingle bells.
[ June 26, 2011, 06:49 PM: Message edited by: Leonard ]
Posted by knockemdown (Member # 3588) on June 27, 2011, 06:33 AM:
Tom, I'll admit I enjoy watching 'bigfoot' shows on TV, for the sheer entertainment value.
But this latest series is even more full of idiocy than normal & borderline frustrating to watch now.
Seems like these jamokes are more infatuated with searching for bigfoot than actually finding bigfoot. Or "squatch", as is the new slang lingo...
Posted by Az-Hunter (Member # 17) on June 27, 2011, 07:53 AM:
They all get lumped into the same genre for me; bigfoot, space aliens,space craft and black mountain lions. So many "sightings", yet over the decades and decades of hearing the myths repeated; not one single shred of evidence exists. Not photo,body,hide,head nor hair exist of any.
Very amusing living here in the south now. I hear of more black panther sightings here, than where it would actually be likely to occur, at home along the mexican border. Of course, when you attempt to advise a southerner, that the only cat capable of posessing a melanistic phase is spotted cats, and that type cat would be a jaguar here in the US, they blink and have that deer in the headlights looks.
I had to laugh the other day in the local gunshop. I asked about black bear in the area because Ive seen road signs advising to look out for them. The local hero hunter had never in his life seen one, and he grew up here; but low and behold; he had seen a black panther.....TWICE!!
Posted by TOM64 (Member # 561) on June 27, 2011, 08:39 AM:
Ya I like watching some of the bigfoot shows and even got a kick on our local guys web site reading all the "encounters".
But this latest show I was speaking of is stupid and insulting to anyone with a brain. One segment had several towns people lined up looking for a clue. They stumbled upon a deer carcus and the guy said that's what bigfoots (bigfeet?) eat...
Think I'll go back to watching whale wars, at least I can hope the japs will sink those idiots.
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on June 27, 2011, 12:46 PM:
I'm not sure I can conclude same as our southern gentleman? Lion cubs have spots and as far as I am concerned lions have the white and black ear patch just like jaguars and bobcats.
It remains difficult to prove a negative. But, the absence of a body does not prove they don't exist, ever and never will.
I don't know about hysterical people, but at some point, you start to wonder why there are so many reports of black panthers in the eastern US and usually Pennsylvania and Florida, for some unknown reason? Are all these people unreliable? Probably.
gh....lb
Posted by smithers (Member # 646) on June 27, 2011, 01:21 PM:
The Whale Wars thing is crazy. Whales are sooooo fake.
Why don't they kamikaze those American do-gooders? I watched it once and hatched a plan that would sink the Americans. Geez. Don't the Japs have Animal Planet?
Posted by JD (Member # 768) on June 27, 2011, 03:39 PM:
They actually did sink one of those ships, it was cool as hell, save the whales my ass, abandon ship and save yourself you goofy sumbitches!!.......Bob Barker is a faggot anyhow!! Not that I like those Japs any better, hell I hate em all!!
Posted by the bearhunter (Member # 3552) on June 27, 2011, 04:01 PM:
JD. you seem like such a kind,loving fella... why the hate all of a sudden? ![[Razz]](tongue.gif)
i get a hoot out of all the bigfoot sightings in the N.W. lets see?? with all the snow,don't ya figger SOMEONE would cut a fresh track and find the damn thing. or do apes hibernate??
Posted by Duckdog (Member # 3842) on June 27, 2011, 05:29 PM:
About the Packrats Leonard...
Sometimes, we'll "camp" in an old Quanset barn out on my buddies land where we hunt.
I was rudely awaken in the middle of the night by a mexican dinner that couldn't wait to leave until the next morning.
I wanted to see what time it was, so I walked over to my cell phone that I had plugged in on top of this old refridgerator...
Came nose to nose with that dang packrat!
Now I know it ain't no "squatch" or ghost, or even a snake...but it sure gave me the heebie jeebies!
Posted by Az-Hunter (Member # 17) on June 27, 2011, 07:27 PM:
Thats what makes me scratch my head Leonard.If indeed a melanistic phase of a jaguar was spotted, southern Az or NM would be the place? There is only a 6% occurrence of melanistic mutation among jaguars, and a large part of that occurs in captivity, due to breeding practices among zoos etc.
The chance of even seeing a plain vanilla jaguar, or capturing it on film in Az is well documented....pretty damned rare; maybe a half dozen over the last 25 or 50 years?
Then throw in the even rarer occurrence of a melanistic cat, and the odds are like getting hit by lightning.Then look at a map, where "sightings" occur, and especially in the south, and the odds of an errant jaguar, much less one of the even rarer melanistic ones traveling 1700 miles from a place(Az/Mex border) where even at that point they are extremely rare,and I don't have a clue what the odds would be?
Posted by smithers (Member # 646) on June 27, 2011, 07:38 PM:
Maybe he was talking about the 60's black panthers?
Bears in Florida?
Posted by TOM64 (Member # 561) on June 27, 2011, 07:47 PM:
Here's a link to a video made by or at least with some locals. Tim Harjo is from Ada, David Wilbanks is from Calvin but has a business here in Ada.
http://videos.wittysparks.com/id/779073482
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on June 27, 2011, 10:23 PM:
Vic, I recollect from some time ago, that Brazilian melanistic jaguars are much more likely, actually closer to every third cat is black.
This could account for what you are talking about in zoos, since I assume Brazil is an abundant source for zoo specimens? I have seen examples where they are black, but you can still distinguish the rosettes.
Even African lions, there seems to be a few males with (at least) black manes. What that has to do with the price of tea in China, I don't know?
Anyway. Based on the shear number of reports, can we confidently assume they are all crackpots and unreliable? I think there are 10 or 12 subspecies of lions and the one always mentioned as panthers are the catamount and painters in specific areas of the east coast. Rare as hens teeth, but I'm not willing to say flat out, they don't exist and never did.
Tom, I don't like that clip. Walks way too much like a man in a monkey suit, if you ask me?
gh....lb
Posted by TOM64 (Member # 561) on June 28, 2011, 05:27 AM:
I agree, just thought ya'll would like to see downtown Ada.
I've been fortunate enough to see a mountain lion in okieland and have spent alot of time in remote areas on horseback, afoot, on 4 wheelers and jeeps. Never seen a bigfoot or heard any unusual vocalizations.
Though I know people who are 100% convinced they do exist.
Posted by Paul Melching (Member # 885) on June 28, 2011, 05:36 AM:
Tom
If you find someone that buys that bigfoot I have some remington brass for sale.
I did enjoy seeing downtown Ada.
[ June 28, 2011, 05:39 AM: Message edited by: Paul Melching ]
Posted by Az-Hunter (Member # 17) on June 28, 2011, 05:54 AM:
Actually, the reason more melanistic jaguars occur in zoos, was not due to where they were collected from Leonard, but because of the captive breeding programs.
Your close on the sub spieces, there are technically six recognized subspecies, five of which occur only in latin america.
The various names given to the mountain lion; painter,puma,catamount,panther etc, are purely regional, nothing to do with scientific taxonomy.
Posted by Paul Melching (Member # 885) on June 28, 2011, 06:46 AM:
Vic
What about cougars?
Hows Fla. treating you? your missing out on some good Az. summer temps supposed to be 114 today.
My lovely wife and I saw a very dark cat cross a dirt road in front of us while out checking some new areas for coyotes. it was not quite full daylight but I assume it was a very dirty Mtn. lion. It was black enough for me to call the fish and game bioligist and inquire about sightings in that area.Tthe next morning when we went back out to call this cat, a dog wagon empty of its canine contents was parked right there. I will never do that again.
Posted by Dave Allen (Member # 3102) on June 28, 2011, 07:07 AM:
Last, I saw of Sasquatch, he was on a golf course somewhere ? Anyway two dink's offered him a soda, but they shook it up 1st. Really pissed him off..
Posted by Az-Hunter (Member # 17) on June 28, 2011, 02:19 PM:
As far as mountain lions go Paul; they are not considered to be among the "spotted" cats, so the melanistic mutation doesn't occur among them.
Most sightings of what people believe to be "black lions" are just like you saw, usually very early am or very late pm, where the dark mahogany of the saddle and tail, viewed in that light(lack of it actually) and dark background can appear very dark.
To date, not one single verifiable black mountain lion has ever been seen, photographed,killed,found dead on the roadside, mounted,skinned or treed by houndsmen. Pretty likley, they simply don't exist....except in the minds of those, who think they or their third uncles dead brother have:)
Posted by Paul Melching (Member # 885) on June 28, 2011, 02:41 PM:
except in the minds of those, who think they or their third uncles dead brother have:)
Aint that the truth!
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on June 28, 2011, 02:58 PM:
Quoting from my source:
quote:
A large, slender cat with a long rounded tail, the cougaris without spots and is uniform in color, varying from reddish-brown and golden yellowish-brown to dull gray. Occasionallyone will see a black cougar, most of which are found in Florida.
This source also lists 15 subspecies.
Natural Histories by George G. Goodwin, associate curator of mammals, American Museum of Natural History.
THE BIG GAME ANIMALS OF NORTH AMERICA by Jack O'Conner 1961
Yeah, that's what it says: fifteen subspecies.
gh....lb
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on June 28, 2011, 03:02 PM:
This is my copy which I inherited, and I believe most everything contained in it. Do I have to list the subspecies for you?
Posted by Paul Melching (Member # 885) on June 28, 2011, 03:04 PM:
If a Cougar is black doesnt that make it a panther.
[ June 28, 2011, 03:12 PM: Message edited by: Paul Melching ]
Posted by Az-Hunter (Member # 17) on June 28, 2011, 03:13 PM:
I suppose as with anything, depends on the source?
SubspeciesUntil the late 1980s, as many as 32 subspecies were recorded; however, a recent genetic study of mitochondrial DNA[15] found that many of these are too similar to be recognized as distinct at a molecular level. Following the research, the canonical Mammal Species of the World (3rd edition) recognizes six subspecies, five of which are solely found in Latin America:[1]
Argentine puma (Puma concolor cabrerae)
includes the previous subspecies and synonyms hudsonii and puma (Marcelli, 1922);
Costa Rican Cougar (Puma concolor costaricensis)
Eastern South American cougar (Puma concolor capricornensis)
includes the previous subspecies and synonyms acrocodia, borbensis, capricornensis, concolor (Pelzeln, 1883), greeni and nigra;
North American Cougar (Puma concolor couguar)
includes the previous subspecies and synonyms arundivaga, aztecus, browni, californica, coryi, floridana, hippolestes, improcera, kaibabensis, mayensis, missoulensis, olympus, oregonensis, schorgeri, stanleyana, vancouverensis and youngi;
Northern South American cougar (Puma concolor concolor)
includes the previous subspecies and synonyms bangsi, incarum, osgoodi, soasoaranna, sussuarana, soderstromii, suçuaçuara and wavula;
Southern South American puma (Puma concolor puma)
includes the previous subspecies and synonyms araucanus, concolor (Gay, 1847), patagonica, pearsoni and puma (Trouessart, 1904)
Posted by Az-Hunter (Member # 17) on June 28, 2011, 04:09 PM:
Last sentence in that particular quote is patently false... "one will occasionally see a black one, especially in Florida"
To date, not a single one has been seen and documented, and by seen, I mean laying on the tailgate of a pick-up truck, or hanging on a wall, or a documented photograph,or a documented road kill.
Posted by Paul Melching (Member # 885) on June 28, 2011, 04:18 PM:
So it would be like saying I saw bgifoot walking his black cougar. well not really me , my cousins brothers nephews freinds sister but she was drunk at the time
Posted by Cdog911 (Member # 7) on June 28, 2011, 04:48 PM:
All I can say is that I had a large bobcat in a trap one time. It was caught, about fifty yards from another set I had gang set in the area. While pulling the first set, I saw that I'd caught something, and looked at it through my rifle scope. For the life of me, it looked like a large, very black feral house cat. I didn't hurry. When I finally got to it, I got as close as fifteen to twenty yards before I realized that it was a normally colored bobcat. Except, that previously, worked up and agitated as it fought the trap, it was piloerected - it's hair was fuzzed up - and it looked every bit to be coal black. As I approached, it hunkered down to gimme the stinkeye and when it did, it laid its hair down and the spots became evident. damndest thing I ever saw, and to my thinking, easily explains a lot of those black panthers that everyone sees.
Edit to add that I don't know which subsp. it was, I wasn't drunk and there were no recent reports of bogfoots in the area.
[ June 28, 2011, 04:50 PM: Message edited by: Cdog911 ]
Posted by Duckdog (Member # 3842) on June 28, 2011, 05:23 PM:
I know I'm gonna regret this...
I was 17 or 18 at the time...It was spring.
Workin' for my Dad. (Excavating company)
We were repairing the spillway on a small lake that sat at the back of a housing development.
The gravel road we used to access the spillway ran perpendicular to the dam. So We'd park at the dam...then walk all the way down the dam to work on the spillway. The area to the left of the road was thick timber.
Anyway, it was lunchtime. Instead of walking down the dam, I decided to cut across the timber to see if I could find some morel mushrooms.
I was moseying along with my eyes to the ground lookin' for mushrooms when I looked up a little bit and there it was...less than ten feet in front of me was a big black cat!
Luckily, one of our operators who was walking down the dam saw it too.
It locked it's yellow eyes with me and I yelled "HOLY SHIT!!!"
That must have scarred it, cuz at this point it loped off through the woods. My two biggest memories of this cat are the yellow eyes and the big fat tail that waved back and forth as it bounded through the timber.
I'd heard all the same stories you guys did growin' up about black mountain lions.
I'd just assumed that that's what I saw. It wasn't until probably 8-10 years ago, when someone called me a friggin' liar on PM that I decided to do some research.
I discovered exactly what you did. Not ONE shred of evidence exists that they're out there.
Not a picture
Not a game camera pic
Not a dead one
Nada...
Could one exist...I guess
But, I now think that what I saw so long ago...was someone's exotic pet that they either turned loose, or it got away...
Either way, it's an experience that not many people can say they've had.
I know I'll ALWAYS remember it!
Posted by Paul Melching (Member # 885) on June 28, 2011, 06:10 PM:
Okay Duckdog you brought this on yourself!
just kiddin cool story your as well Lance
Posted by smithers (Member # 646) on June 28, 2011, 06:20 PM:
Mmhmmm... Yep, black cats. Right.
Looks like y'all have a little summer project ahead of yourselves. Bring me the head of a black cat. (not a domestic one neither!)
Posted by CCP (Member # 913) on June 28, 2011, 06:49 PM:
I think some people really see a Black Panther.
I jumped a Panther while bush hogging a grass strip and it was big brown and had the big brushy tail like all the stories describe. It loped quartering away from me down toward the edge of the field. Once close to the edge of the field it stopped and it was as Black as any animal could possibly be. If I had not just seen it closer and clearly seen how brown it was I would have sworn I had seen a Black Panther.It was the lighting and angle.
I believe this is what people see so they are not always lying when they say they seen a black panther. Problem I always had when living in Fla was when mentioning a Panther nobody seen just a good ole plain panther it always had to be a BLACK one.
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on June 28, 2011, 11:49 PM:
Well, I know there has been a concentrated effort to change taxonomic classifications. All neat and tidy and Vic swallows it, because? I know the British Columbian lions don't look like the AZ lions in several details but thanks to some snotnose, they are the same animal; and nobody would dispute the fact that they can interbreed, etc. But, when you see a a Baja lion and a Vancouver Island cougar, it seems reasonable to consider them as distinctly different. So they might be classified as the same subspecies, but they are different and that's all I care about.
When somebody talks about those stinking AZ coyotes and the ones in Montana, some college boy pounds sand up Vic's ass and he buys it, therefore, they are all the same.
The difference seems to be observable, but not after they type the DNA. I guess that is the whole deal and I'm sorry, I don't accept (so called) scientific studies, in some cases. I think they have an axe to grind and their credentials don't impress me like they impress some people.
So, is there universal agreement on that new classification, Vic? How could the earlier studies have been so wrong?
As far as black cats, what are we going to do when we find a black road kill? I think it's a weak argument to say that we don't have a dead specimen. You won't find a Carolina Parakeet or a passenger pigeon either, but that doesn't mean they didn't once exist. Maybe the last black panther was killed a long time ago and they didn't realize you needed to see it?
Should I set this reference out for the trash tomorrow, since so much of the information is false? Let me know.
gh....lb
Posted by knockemdown (Member # 3588) on June 29, 2011, 05:19 AM:
Leonard, to draw a parallel between coyote size /wolf infusion and cougars, what would those monster B.C. cats have to been interbred with to get so big?
Happily for biologists, we have wolves to blame for 'hybridizing' our big NE coyotes. But I ain't buying the notion that a B.C. cat interbred with a saber toothed tiger to get that big! If the shoe fits, try a different one? (I don't' even know what the means)
Moreso, I believe that phenomenon relates to Bergmann's Rule, as touched upon in the past here...
Also, I've known our resident varmint, the woodchuck, to appear JET black against a cut alfalfa field in the summer time. Never seen a black woodchuck in my life, but I'm tellin' ya the sure do look it from a distance. Same as CCP mentioned with his cat encounter...
[ June 29, 2011, 05:20 AM: Message edited by: knockemdown ]
Posted by George Ackley (Member # 898) on June 29, 2011, 08:42 AM:
Posted by knockemdown (Member # 3588) on June 29, 2011, 09:15 AM:
holey schmokes, George!!!
That one musta REALLY looked black across the field...
See, ya learn somethin' new here everyday!
Posted by Dave Allen (Member # 3102) on June 29, 2011, 09:20 AM:
So do those Chucks back east really, chuck wood ?
Posted by Az-Hunter (Member # 17) on June 29, 2011, 09:41 AM:
Im crushed Leonard; when it comes to getting sand pounded up ones ass, I get a know nothing college boy pounding mine, and you get non other than the late great Jack O'connor pounding it up yours...damnit, you always have to "one-up" me don't you?
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on June 29, 2011, 10:29 AM:
Oh great! I was about to surrender to your superior knowledge!
I think it's a AZ prejudicial issue against CA residents. You never give us a decent break.
By the way, who is getting most of your baloney sandwiches in your new area? Cubans or Jamaicans? But, can you get a decent burrito in your new town? Oh, forgot about Taco Bell, never mind.
gh....lb
Posted by smithers (Member # 646) on June 29, 2011, 10:34 AM:
May be me being cynical, but I think Geaorge spray painted that woodchuck.
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on June 29, 2011, 10:43 AM:
More likely, a nice shade of ladies hair dye. That's it, right George?
gh....lb
edit: and what killed that chuck? I see no blood.
[ June 29, 2011, 10:44 AM: Message edited by: Leonard ]
Posted by Az-Hunter (Member # 17) on June 29, 2011, 01:35 PM:
You nailed that one Leonard; for the life of me, I can't even find a decent tortilla! Got to use my cow-pen spainish the other day at Wallmart. Saw two, obviously deep south meskin boys at the atm, peeked over their shoulder and could see they were using the spainish language feature on the atm. They looked furtively at me when I asked them in spainish if they spoke english, to which they shook their heads no. Asked them where a guy could find a decent tortilla in this town for the ones in the stores are abysmal. They told me I have to go to Fort Walton and there is a meskin "tienda" there...I think they thought I might be "la migra"(BP) for they sure were hesitant to yack with me:)
Posted by Kelly Jackson (Member # 977) on June 29, 2011, 01:50 PM:
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on June 29, 2011, 02:43 PM:
Who is that, Kelly, Ernest Hemingway?
gh....lb
PS, if you were in your regular "uniform", Vic, I can see why they didn't want to talk to you. Fort Walton Beach. That was the closest town, along with Valparizo to Eglin AFB (In which, we saved the world, btw) where I spent about 6 months during the Cuban missile crisis. Nice area, way better than Miami, IMHO.
[ June 29, 2011, 02:44 PM: Message edited by: Leonard ]
Posted by Kelly Jackson (Member # 977) on June 29, 2011, 03:10 PM:
Heck I thought that looked alot like Vic.
It is Flip Pallet. Fishin dude from Florida.
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on June 29, 2011, 04:42 PM:
Maybe Vic's younger, better looking brother?
Posted by George Ackley (Member # 898) on June 29, 2011, 04:51 PM:
quote:
and what killed that chuck? I see no blood.
I have shot black and blondes, that photo i pulled off a PA sight so as to what killed it i dont know. i do know it wasnt me.
i dont go out to pick them up my go to G Hog gun is a 308 so there nothing much to see
Posted by the bearhunter (Member # 3552) on June 29, 2011, 04:55 PM:
shot me a northern MN chupacabra once. they actally filmed a MonsterQuest show about 20 miles from me. said something strage was killin horses/cattle ![[Roll Eyes]](rolleyes.gif)
what a freeking joke. open farmland with very little cover.
[ June 29, 2011, 04:56 PM: Message edited by: the bearhunter ]
Posted by Cdog911 (Member # 7) on June 29, 2011, 05:00 PM:
If'n I didn't know any better, I'd say that what you have there is the even rarer, and more elusive wooly chupacabra. All kinds of strange stuff these days. Just this morning, I coulda swore I saw a giant midget in my bathroom. Turns out it was me looking in the mirror. Teehee
Posted by the bearhunter (Member # 3552) on June 29, 2011, 05:28 PM:
hot as hell here. wifes in the tub takin a cool bath. might sneak in and see iffn i can get a glimps of a squawsnath
Posted by the bearhunter (Member # 3552) on June 29, 2011, 05:31 PM:
huh. not bad............
Posted by smithers (Member # 646) on June 29, 2011, 06:46 PM:
Did you mean squaw snatch? Lol!
Posted by TOM64 (Member # 561) on June 29, 2011, 09:08 PM:
Leonard you ought to charge the lurkers admission. Where else can they get all knowed up and be entertained at the same time?
Gotta love this place.
[ June 29, 2011, 09:08 PM: Message edited by: TOM64 ]
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on July 01, 2011, 08:16 AM:
What for? I'm already making a fortune in dues from members like you. Wait a minute, it looks like you haven't been paying, at all? You better pay up or else, deadbeat! I may have to turn the vilifiers on you; JD, stand by.
gh....lb
Posted by TOM64 (Member # 561) on July 01, 2011, 09:18 AM:
The check is in the mail.
Posted by smithers (Member # 646) on July 08, 2011, 08:05 PM:
I'm sure that 60" tv is possessed and that surround sound system too. Have any gold bullion? That's known to be a hiding place for evil spirits. I'm gonna have to take that stuff outta here, so you can begin the road to recovery.
The paranormal guy that takes your stuff is full of shit.
Posted by Cdog911 (Member # 7) on July 08, 2011, 08:07 PM:
, see what I mean. Cool swords. Must be haunted. I thought he was gonna take that guy's whole house. LOL
Posted by smithers (Member # 646) on July 08, 2011, 08:18 PM:
I asked my kid to change the channel 22 times. He wouldn't, so I got suckered in. He's 8 and loves that crap so I let him have his way. Usually I leave the room but tonight I half- watched it and waited for him to snake away with some haunted stuff.
[ July 08, 2011, 08:19 PM: Message edited by: smithers ]
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