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Author
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Topic: What do you recommend?
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted September 12, 2003 08:11 PM
You have, we all have, certain guns for certain applications.
But, if a friend, (or whatever) should ask you what they should get for hunting predators; what is your plain and simple, no nonsense, one gun answer?
(it doesn't have to be what you shoot)
Good hunting. LB
PS what rifle, or caliber would you try and talk your friend out of? ( that's easy....for me) ![[Smile]](smile.gif)
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31450 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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bucksnort
Miss Chris from AZ
Member # 202
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posted September 12, 2003 08:40 PM
Leonard, you ask a big question with many scenrios. Do we want to save the pelt, or we don't.
You ask for one caliber, I will say the 22-250. Final Answer! ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
I know Danny will go with a different one.
Take care.
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"There are lion chasers, lion catchers, and lying SOB's."
"Warriors of El Gato - The Lion"
Posts: 368 | From: Tucson, AZ | Registered: Jun 2003
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted September 12, 2003 09:33 PM
Danny's going to say 220 swift. I used one, almost exclusively for about fifteen years, until I found something better. But, that's my preference, and not necessarily what I might recommend.
In fact, I tend to agree with you, a nice 22-250 is awful hard to beat, for a guy just starting out. With the right bullet selection, it will do almost anything.
But, there are many choices, and many opinions. And yes, you need to take the man's needs and motivation into consideration.
Good hunting. LB
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31450 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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Az-Hunter
Hi, I'm Vic WELCOME TO THE U.S. Free baloney sandwiches here
Member # 17
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posted September 12, 2003 09:36 PM
Ive answered that question many times from acquaintances, to fellas at work who were told "go talk to Vic, I think does that calling **** " and my pat answer is a 22-250. As far as talking them out of a rifle/caliber choice, I try to steer them clear of AR15 pattern rifles,and any caliber larger than .243.
Posts: 1627 | From: 5 miles west of Tim | Registered: Jan 2003
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Steve Craig
Lacks Opposable Thumbs/what's up with that?
Member # 12
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posted September 13, 2003 06:31 AM
All around, fur friendly,works on fox to lions, at ranges to 200 yards,works in brush as well as the open areas, gotta go with the 222 Rem., with 50gr bullets. Try to steer them clear of 30 caliber stuff.
All around for coyotes, I have to agree with Vic, 22-250 or I feel the 225 Win is slightly better. Just my 2 cents and,
FWIW
Steve
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Yes, we did produce a near-perfect republic. But will they keep it? Or will they, in the enjoyment of plenty, lose the memory of freedom? Material abundance without character is the path of destruction. - Thomas Jefferson
Posts: 442 | From: Cottonwood,Az, USA | Registered: Jan 2003
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted September 13, 2003 08:58 AM
I was going to stay out of this for a while, but I need to give a thumbs up for Vic for discouraging newbies from AR15 type armament. I know a lot of guys like them, and that's fine , but I (honestly) can not see any advantage?
For Steve. Hey, buddy. Show me a well constructed 50 grain bullet suitable for large predators. I'm not saying they don't exist, I just haven't seen one.
Also, your "recommend" list looks suspiciously like what you use, personally. Where the heck is a guy going to locate a 225, these days?
Good hunting. LB
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31450 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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DAA
Utah/Promoted WESTERN REGIONAL Hunt Director
Member # 11
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posted September 13, 2003 09:47 AM
Agree with the forming concensus here. If a fella needs to ask, then I'm going to tell him .22-250 bolt action sporter, whatever brand feels good to him. Covers the whole waterfront, for a newbie or casual/occasional caller.
- DAA
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"Oh yeah, they're gonna talk to you, and talk to you, and talk to you about individual freedom, but they see a free individual, it's gonna scare 'em." -- George Hanson, Easy Rider, 1969.
Rocky Mountain Varmint Hunter
Posts: 2676 | From: Salt Lake City, UT | Registered: Jan 2003
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varmit hunter
Knows what it's all about
Member # 37
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posted September 13, 2003 11:07 AM
22-250........
PS I do have a 225 Winchester.
[ September 13, 2003, 11:09 AM: Message edited by: varmit hunter ]
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Make them pay for the wind.
Posts: 932 | From: Orange,TX | Registered: Jan 2003
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Steve Craig
Lacks Opposable Thumbs/what's up with that?
Member # 12
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posted September 13, 2003 01:56 PM
Leonard, 50gr Nosler Balistic Tip in the 222 Rem. Tears heck out of fox, but I have killed everything else with it including a 400pound black bear called to 40 yards and slipped it right between the ribs into the lungs. Bear ran 40 yards and dropped graveyard dead. Lungs were jello. Dont recommend it for all bear calling though!hehe It is all I had in my hands at the time and the bear was a big one, so I took the shot. Shot placement is far more important than caliber anyway.
As far as the 225 win. I have 3 of them. They are easy to make. Just take any old 223 to your local gunsmith and have him ream out the chamber to the 225. Gary Reeder of the Pistol Parlor in Flagstaff,Az. will make you one in about an hour for about $40 to $60. Mind you, they are all Encore,Contender or T/C Rifle/Carbines.
Again,
FWIW
Steve
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Yes, we did produce a near-perfect republic. But will they keep it? Or will they, in the enjoyment of plenty, lose the memory of freedom? Material abundance without character is the path of destruction. - Thomas Jefferson
Posts: 442 | From: Cottonwood,Az, USA | Registered: Jan 2003
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Curt2u
Knows what it's all about
Member # 74
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posted September 13, 2003 09:28 PM
I have to agree with the 22-250 and 220 swift being great coyote rifles. Toss up between them and the awesome AR-15 of course.
Posts: 236 | From: NW | Registered: Jan 2003
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Jack Roberts
Knows what it's all about
Member # 13
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posted September 13, 2003 11:01 PM
My experience is quite limited, but I have shot eastern and western coyotes. They all are tough.
Even with perfect shots, 17, 223, 22-250, 243, can not be relied on to put them down right now.
There is probably no caliber that will insure sudden kills, even with perfect shots.
I can guarantee that anybody who claims to have shot 200 coyotes, and never had a runner, is totally full of it. Lot of this crap being posted lately, for whatever caliber.
Jack
Posts: 499 | From: Elko NV formerly MD | Registered: Jan 2003
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Tim Behle
Administrator MacNeal Sector
Member # 209
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posted September 14, 2003 08:02 AM
Jack,
I do honestly have one rifle, that's killed quite a few coyotes, and a few hundred other critters, with out having anything ever run off.
It's an old Stevens Model 72 in .22 rimfire and I normally shoot CB cap shorts.
I'd never consider calling with it, but it's a hell of a good trapline rifle!
Tim
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Personally, I carry a gun because I'm too young to die and too old to take
an ass kickin'.
Posts: 3160 | From: Five Miles East of Vic, AZ | Registered: Jun 2003
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted September 14, 2003 10:17 AM
Yeah, thanks for that pearl of wisdom, Tim.
As far as runners, I'd believe anything. I shot a coyote with a 300Win. Mag, right through the boiler room. Knocked him off his feet, got up and ran off. Never had another clear shot, but I know he ran at least a half a mile.
The problem with most scenarios where you have an occasional runner, is that the animal moves very slightly while the bullet is in flight. At two hundred yards, that can move the point of impact several inches in any direction.
Good hunting. LB
PS Tim and Jack, you forgot to give your recommendation! ![[Frown]](frown.gif)
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31450 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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Krustyklimber
prefers the bunny hugger pronunciation: ky o tee
Member # 72
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posted September 14, 2003 10:51 AM
As usual, I have no real wold experience to base my opinion on... other than my wallet's experience buying components.
For me the ultmate calling gun (for fur bearers) is a .222 Rem...
They shoot well with about a half dozen powders, fill up with half as much as a 22-250 case can hold, shoot fairly flat out to close to 250 yds, and have a wide election of readily avialable projectiles... from 40 gr varmint bullets to 55 gr Barnes X or even Bonded Bear Claws. (I currently put two Remington bulk HPs in the magazine for my last two "serious shots".
The particular duece I shoot (with 26" bbl), shoots a 50 gr v-max at around 3280 fps, when topping off 20 grs of IMR 4198, which I light off with a CCI match grade primer.
With this I can usually shoot 1 3/4' inch groups at 200 yds (not national match shooting, but middle of coyote ![[Wink]](wink.gif) ) even with the piece of crap Weaver K-6 it wears.
As far as my best advice I could give a friend...
I say "pick a gun, any gun, prefferably one you like... they all kill critters when used well." Then I tell that same friend "...now get out and practice, until that gun is part of you!!! Because NONE of them will kill critters if you can't use it well"
The problem (IMHO) with most guns is they have a loose nut on the trigger!
Jeff 
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Think about how stupid the average person is, then realize that half of them are stupider than that!
Posts: 1912 | From: Deep in the Blue Ridge Mountains of Virginia | Registered: Jan 2003
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Tim Behle
Administrator MacNeal Sector
Member # 209
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posted September 14, 2003 04:46 PM
Leonard,
For a new hunter, I'd recommend most any of the center fire 22 calibers. A 22-250 is probably one of the best I've ever used.
But I'd never recommend anything much larger. Saving fur or not, deer rifles should be saved for deer. Most of the coyotes I've seen run off have been shot with them. I’ve taken plenty of coyotes with 30 calibers, but they don’t seem (at least not to me) to drop them as fast as a smaller, faster moving bullet.
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Personally, I carry a gun because I'm too young to die and too old to take
an ass kickin'.
Posts: 3160 | From: Five Miles East of Vic, AZ | Registered: Jun 2003
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Lonny
PANTS ON THE GROUND
Member # 19
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posted September 14, 2003 05:24 PM
I would also recommend a bolt action 22-250 as the first choice. Followed by a .243 if a guy was thinking he might need to kill a bear or other large predator. I think the reason most beginners have a rough time hitting coyotes when using the larger deer and elk calibers is because they are sighted in 2-3" high at a 100 yards. When that coyote with a 6" kill zone is standing at 125 yards they over shoot.
I would say to stay clear of the long heavy barreled varmint rifles for predator calling. I'm always surprised at guys who want a prairie dog rifle for killing called coyotes at moderate to close range. Stick with a sporter weight rifle that packs and points nice.
Posts: 1209 | From: Lewiston, Idaho USA | Registered: Jan 2003
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WhiteMtnCur
Knows what it's all about
Member # 5
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posted September 22, 2003 04:02 PM
Okay, so you'll recommend a .22-250. But which factory .22-250 would you recommend?
Posts: 97 | From: Nevada | Registered: Jan 2003
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted September 23, 2003 05:11 PM
Well, if nobody else speaks up, I have a strong preference for Remington. You can't go wrong with a Model 7 or a 700.
Good hunting. LB
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31450 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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Purple220
Knows what it's all about
Member # 173
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posted September 24, 2003 10:41 AM
I bet you can't guess what my answer is !!!!!!!!
220 Swift
Sorry Jack but I've been bustin coyotes for many years and I can truly attest that nothing puts a yote down like my Swifts except for the 22/6mm. I have never had one go past 15 yards with a Swift hit and some of those shots were not so perfect. I have shot yotes with about everything from 17 to 300 mags. Swift wins !!!
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Predator Control Specialist......Here Kitty Kitty
Posts: 154 | From: Big Spring,Tx | Registered: Apr 2003
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UTcaller
NEVADA NIGHT FIGHTER
Member # 8
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posted September 24, 2003 03:50 PM
I think I'm with the majority here.I would go with the .22-250.That has been my primary calling caliber for the last 15 or so years.It has been a good shooter for me.I switched just this year to the .223 Ackley(love it)Have shot 4 coyotes with it so far,I get about the same results as I did with the 22-250.GOOD HUNTING CO
Posts: 1612 | From: Utah | Registered: Jan 2003
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crapshoot
Knows what it's all about
Member # 225
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posted September 25, 2003 04:28 PM
Time to piss everyone off i guess. I love my AR as a calling rifle. I have a 16" in 223 which swings and points exceptional, and i also have a 24" in tac20. Both shoot exceptional and are a blast .
Posts: 44 | From: S. Nevada | Registered: Jul 2003
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted September 25, 2003 06:05 PM
Don't worry about pissing off anybody, crapshoot. It's mostly good natured preference, I own a black gun, myself, but seldom admit it.
It's a Ford/Chevy thing. Use what you like, no apologies.
Good hunting. LB
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31450 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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Cal Taylor
Knows what it's all about
Member # 199
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posted September 25, 2003 08:18 PM
If they are a true friend you would reccomend that they spend their money on a poker game and stay the hell away from anything to do with predator calling. But if you must drag them in the mire with the rest of us, any of the big centerfire 22's will do fine. That being 22-250, Swift, or the 223 wssm.
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Democracy is two wolves and a lamb deciding what to have for lunch.
Liberty is a well armed lamb contesting the vote.
FoxPro Field Staff Member
Posts: 1069 | From: Wyoming | Registered: May 2003
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22-250
Knows what it's all about
Member # 36
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posted September 25, 2003 09:02 PM
My favorite rifle is the 22-250. However, the gun I like best for predators, is the Savage 24F. As an over-under rifle combination, it is my opinion the best gun for predators. I keep the gun set for the 12 gauge when I set up. If a coyotes slips in and surprise me I am ready for a shot with 3" BB or BBB. Having the 12 gauge set and has really save me on the surprise attacks. The 223 is not a 22-250 for long range shots but its works. If Savage really want to have a great predator gun, they would add the 17 rem or 22-250 as a option. Just my 2 cents.
[ September 25, 2003, 09:03 PM: Message edited by: 22-250 ]
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The coyote is a living, breathing allegory of Want. He is always hungry. He is always poor, out of luck and friendless. The meanest creatures despise him and even the flea would desert him for a velocipede.
Posts: 108 | From: Longview, Texas, glad to be gone | Registered: Jan 2003
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DAA
Utah/Promoted WESTERN REGIONAL Hunt Director
Member # 11
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posted September 26, 2003 07:27 AM
As to which brand, I'd say just go somewhere that you can handle a bunch of them and get the one that feels best to you.
My personal preference is usually a Remington. But then, I'm usually looking at them as primarily organ donors.
- DAA
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"Oh yeah, they're gonna talk to you, and talk to you, and talk to you about individual freedom, but they see a free individual, it's gonna scare 'em." -- George Hanson, Easy Rider, 1969.
Rocky Mountain Varmint Hunter
Posts: 2676 | From: Salt Lake City, UT | Registered: Jan 2003
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