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Author
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Topic: Martz Chart Quiz
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TundraWookie
Knows what it's all about
Member # 1044
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posted October 13, 2009 10:41 PM
Martz,
Are you trying to help or hurt yourself with your output power vs. supply voltage chart? How are you assuming people are going to get 15volts from a 10-AA battery pack for any real duration of time? Typical NiMh nominal voltage is 1.2volts, so right around 12 volts will be the nominal power output. Most hunters are going to use the NiMh's, they're cheap, easy to find, and work decent.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nickel-metal_hydride_battery
If the "Power Requirement" of your Mighty Atom (MA-15)is 15volts, the thing is already going to be underpowered.
Your chart on your website shows the FoxPro being superior in the nominal voltage range that most hunters will see in real world use. Why would you show your voltage going up to 18 volts for an "Apples to Apples" comparison of your MA15 model to the FoxPro Fury?
There are other questions still unanswered Martz. What is your definition of "CD Quality"?
Posts: 857 | From: Alaska | Registered: Dec 2006
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TheHuntedOne
Knows what it's all about
Member # 623
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posted October 14, 2009 04:57 AM
We KNOW the information presented above is TRUE because, in an EXCLUSIVE, we have obtained photos not only of the secret location of the Tundra Wookie E Caller Testing Service facility, but also of the Tundra Wookie himself hard at work in his lab!
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The On Line Resource For Custom Call Makers
THO Game Calls
Posts: 266 | From: New Hampshire | Registered: Mar 2005
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Cdog911
"There are some ideas so absurd only an intellectual could believe them."--George Orwell.
Member # 7
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posted October 14, 2009 07:19 AM
LOL that's funny right thar!!! I'm no fan of Bill's customer service methods, but I'm confussed here as to what I should be more concerned with. Bill's alleged inaccuracies (none of which really concern me), TWookies having obviously been ripped off by Bill (otherwise why would he be so obsessed with this), TWookie ordering a new caller from Bill (which makes me wonder why, if he's so unhappy with WT calls, would he buy another one?) or just how lonely does it get in Alaska that this would be your sole mission in life?
Looking at all the various and sundry things going on in my life and the world around me, I can't even hazard a guess as to how far down my "give-a-shit" list you would have to look before you found my concerns about the shortcomings of my e-callers. Reading these diatribes on every board on the web that will let him rant is like people watching at WalMart: a colossal waste of time, but damned if it doesn't make you feel a whole bunch better about yourself. Admittedly, I have no dog in this fight, but could you just give it a rest? It's hunting season... go out and kill something already!
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I am only one. But still, I am one. I cannot do everything, but still, I can do something; and, because I cannot do everything, I will not refuse to do something that I can do.
Posts: 5438 | From: The gun-lovin', gun-friendly wild, wild west | Registered: Jan 2003
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TundraWookie
Knows what it's all about
Member # 1044
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posted October 14, 2009 07:51 AM
THO,
If you're going to show my snow-cave, at least show the new double-wide model I built last winter. The other guy must be your twin, because I probably weigh as much as that things left leg. What kind of strange and demented things do you look at on your computer you freak? Maybe the fumes from spinning your orifice plugs are getting to you. Did you have anything intelligent to add to this post, or do you just want to add to everything I have to say? I could get you a fan-club shirt or something like that if you're that needy. If you have so much free time, why don't you walk down the street to visit your lying neighbor Martz and see if you two can formulate an intelligent response to my legitimate questions. If not, maybe you should just shut up and go back to spinning plugs.
Cdog911,
This is all technical information that concerned customers should look at before buying a caller. I enjoy using and testing out all of the callers around and helping people with theirs. I get lots of questions about callers and many people simply will not call Martz to talk about his callers because of what they read on the internet. I can't blame them, he's a liar. Like I've said before, I have nothing against WT products. I do have something against the owner of WT who has threatened me and has bullied customers and others for years. This is the only place where he feels man enough to sling his mud, so this is where it'll happen. Martz is a documented liar and I'm going to make certain that any potential customers know who and what they're dealing with before they order something. If these posts offend you or bore you, just don't read them. It's just like television, change the channel if you don't like what you're watching (reading).
Martz,
I asked a legitimate question, do you have an adult-like response? I just don't see many people buying multiple $86 Li-Ion packs and a $30 charger. There will be some, but most hunters are going to run NiMH packs. Why do you assume 15 volts?
Martz....The silent (but lying) one.
[ October 14, 2009, 07:55 AM: Message edited by: TundraWookie ]
Posts: 857 | From: Alaska | Registered: Dec 2006
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TheHuntedOne
Knows what it's all about
Member # 623
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posted October 14, 2009 08:47 AM
quote:
Did you have anything intelligent to add to this post
Did you?
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The On Line Resource For Custom Call Makers
THO Game Calls
Posts: 266 | From: New Hampshire | Registered: Mar 2005
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TheHuntedOne
Knows what it's all about
Member # 623
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posted October 14, 2009 08:56 AM
Oh, and by the way Peter....
You asked what kind of perverted things I look at on the internet all day....
While that might prove entertaining for some, even more entertaining would be to know why you asked me what happened to that Butt Plug you thought I was going to send you?
Why would you want one of my....what did you call them? Oh yeah...
quote:
orifice plugs
I know it's cold up there, and there aren't a lot of people, but surely you can find a friend to play with???? And "Lefty" and "Righty" don't count.
Maybe a Polar Bear? Lonely Eskimo?
eh?
God forgive me for what I said about Polar Bears and Eskimos and take care of Rich Cronk's Pygmies
[ October 14, 2009, 09:00 AM: Message edited by: TheHuntedOne ]
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The On Line Resource For Custom Call Makers
THO Game Calls
Posts: 266 | From: New Hampshire | Registered: Mar 2005
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Dan Carey
unknown comic
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posted October 14, 2009 09:02 AM
THO, that's funny as hell.
Sad he is so "whatever"
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TheHuntedOne
Knows what it's all about
Member # 623
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posted October 14, 2009 09:19 AM
OK, please disregard my last post Peter - I figured it out.
You said...
quote:
The other guy must be your twin, because I probably weigh as much as that things left leg.
And there he is in your shop in his Tighty Whities...which made me think that was you....I understand now....
I'll get that butt plug up to you over night mail.
I'm beginning to get the picture, and it's not a visual I want to keep around ![[Eek!]](eek.gif)
[ October 14, 2009, 09:21 AM: Message edited by: TheHuntedOne ]
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The On Line Resource For Custom Call Makers
THO Game Calls
Posts: 266 | From: New Hampshire | Registered: Mar 2005
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coyote whacker
Knows what it's all about
Member # 639
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posted October 14, 2009 09:33 AM
I think this should stay on topic and not get into a mud slinging fest on what one thinks of each other.
Hunted one could you add to the topic? Do you care about the topic? What caller do you use?
I always get leery when questions are posed and instead of clear/concise answers it turns into personnel attacks, that usually means they don't have an answer or don't know the answer?
[ October 14, 2009, 09:50 AM: Message edited by: coyote whacker ]
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This is done on my time and my dime. My views may differ from those of others!
Posts: 376 | From: USA | Registered: Apr 2005
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TundraWookie
Knows what it's all about
Member # 1044
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posted October 14, 2009 09:48 AM
THO,
I started the post with a legitimate, academic question. Did you miss the chart I posted? Then, I asked about the voltage and batteries. Did you miss that too? If so, let me know and I can Fax or email it to you.
If you took a moment to think, you'd learn what orifice means. Is there something in the well water by your house and the liars house that makes structuring logic disappear? Here's the primary definition of Orifice for you:
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/orifice
Do you see that the first thing it says is MOUTH? I'm assuming you thought I was talking about something twisted, like you like to talk about as shown here:
http://www.huntmastersbbs.com/cgi/cgi-ubb/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=2;t=000320
Don't worry about my friends and associates, some of whom live in your very backyard. Now tell me again why you're involved in this conversation, concerning your lying neighbor who calls what you build "Party Favors"?
Bill Martz said:
"I also find it amusing that you would lower yourself to kiss the bottom of a government "biologist" just you you could pay your own way to some distant location just to demonstrate your ability with a $10 party favor. You don't actually believe that you can emulate a real coyote vocalization with a 50 cent plastic reed, do you? If you think you can Rich, knowing that animal vocalizations are at least 30 times more complex then the human voice, let me hear you blow the human word "the" out of your mouth call."
http://www.huntmastersbbs.com/cgi/cgi-ubb/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=000610#000012
I'm still wondering when Martz is going to put out a Coyote recording saying the word "The".
Funny that you show my shop being a snow-cave, yet it has carpet and drywall in the other picture with your brother/twin. You get a C- for contradicting photo data. You must still be bitter because you lost the illegal FRS remote radio argument. Come on Marine, do you want to make a bet on the FRS radio legality issues? Get out of your attic/shop and wake up your lying neighbor Martz so you two can formulate a plan to discredit me and my question.
Dan Carey,
Nice to see you, can you help answer the question?
Are all of the Martz Muffins going to just keep slapping each other on the back and posting nonsense information and twisted photos? This really goes a long ways in helping answer the question.
Lets keep this on subject and keep the twisted, perverted things out of it (THO). I'll keep my eyes peeled for the call, thanks.
Posts: 857 | From: Alaska | Registered: Dec 2006
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TheHuntedOne
Knows what it's all about
Member # 623
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posted October 14, 2009 10:08 AM
No, I dont care about the topic.
I do think it's funny as hell watching Peter have a stroke over something this silly, but other than that, I don't have a thing to add.
I do own both a FoxPro and and old WT caller in case you're interested. I would buy a new one but the kid is in his last year of college at Southern New Hampshire University and then he's heading to North Eastern for grad school and he comes first.
I promise to leave Peter alone from now on. It's hard though, the boy is so easy, it's a good thing he wasn't born a girl.
Have it boys - whooping up time is nigh,
[ October 14, 2009, 10:09 AM: Message edited by: TheHuntedOne ]
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The On Line Resource For Custom Call Makers
THO Game Calls
Posts: 266 | From: New Hampshire | Registered: Mar 2005
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coyote whacker
Knows what it's all about
Member # 639
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posted October 14, 2009 10:23 AM
Some would think it silly for a call manufacture to list the name of a person on his site and try to hold "A" person responsible for his lost market share because "A" person gave the competitor the information on sound equipment?
Do any of us think that Mr Marvin is the sole reason FP has 24 bit recordings??? Do any of you think the people at FoxPro couldn't have figured it out themselves?
Then said call manufacture list the 14 things needed to reproduce high quailty sounds on his site for all to read? What is the point then?
I mean I searched google for high quaility recording equipment and found out plenty to do so, if I was so inclined to record animal sounds.
[ October 14, 2009, 10:27 AM: Message edited by: coyote whacker ]
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This is done on my time and my dime. My views may differ from those of others!
Posts: 376 | From: USA | Registered: Apr 2005
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TundraWookie
Knows what it's all about
Member # 1044
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posted October 14, 2009 10:27 AM
THO,
No worries, you can attack all you want, I have thick enough skin to take whatever anybody dishes out. I didn't realize I was having a stroke over asking this question. You must've interpreted it incorrect, because I have many more questions like this. It's a perfectly legitimate question though and I really didn't go into a personal attack on Martz over it, if you noticed? I kept it pretty much straight forward, looking for an answer. Be certain though, that I'm not going to give Martz any room for his lying and deceitful tactics. Do you think I should cut the liar any slack?
Edit: Is this term "Whooping" some New Hampshire term? The definition for it says:
a. A loud cry of exultation or excitement.
b. A shout uttered by a hunter or warrior.
I guess if excitement or a shout by hunters is what my question provokes, then have at it..Whoop it up boys!!!
Martz,
Still waiting for a response to the questions. I'll cross post this in many different forums though so your customers or potential customers can ask as well, because many will want to know about the batteries and power. You still haven't answered Coyote Wackers question about the power of your caller either? You're failing in customer relations, which isn't surprising. Why don't you start fresh and just change the way you do business? Be a friendly, courteous salesman and take half of that garbage down from your website. Remove anything that can easily be discredited or isn't 100% true. You'd sell an exponentially larger number of callers if you did, I guarantee it.
Coyote Wacker,
You made a very good point about "A" person (Me) being the reason FoxPro went to 24bit recording and the equipment. There was and is better recording equipment around than what FoxPro and WT is using. I guess Martz just figured he had the secret solution to 24bit digital animal recording equipment and didn't want anybody to know. The funny thing though is the majority of WT's library was recorded years ago with analog equipment.
[ October 14, 2009, 10:46 AM: Message edited by: TundraWookie ]
Posts: 857 | From: Alaska | Registered: Dec 2006
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TheHuntedOne
Knows what it's all about
Member # 623
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posted October 14, 2009 10:49 AM
Well now I take it back - I see Peter was posting while I was agreeing to give the little pip squeak a break.
So here we go -
First - you dont have the right to call me Marine. You dont have the right to even carry my Jock Strap. From what you've said, and what you've posted, you would have to put on about 100 pounds and grow a set of balls to even be able to associate with someone who was a Marine. I served 20 plus years with some honorable men and women defending your right to speak your mind and it really pisses me off to see you abuse the privilege. Bill was right, you are a moron.
As for your friends and associates in my back yard - Was that some kind of internet threat? You're kidding me right? Again, Bill was right. You're a moron. Who you gonna send? That pencil necked geek Browning? Hell he about shit his pants in the woods one morning when we walked by a moose for gods sake. Get real.
As for the FRS issue, you want me to get the thread Peter? You got your ass handed to you,and you know it. You got caught in a complete lie, and then you tried to change the subject and went off on some tangent about the calls being duplicated and renamed and all kinds of BS. You posted pages and pages of pure spin and BS and never once addressed the issue once you had it stuffed down your scrawny little girl neck. But the bottom line is, was and will always be, you flat out LIED. You call Bill a liar? And you say that I'm defending him? Hell, I dont even know the man. We have never met. We could have walked past each other a hundred times here in town and not have even known it.
The whole FRS issue was a complete fabrication meant to scare people out of buying a great caller. To tell people that they would be arrested and fined by the FCC for using it? That they might cause someones death if they used it and it interrupted an emergency broadcast? Is it really that necessary to stoop that low to sell an E caller?
Now Peter, that's not my opinion either. It came right out of the mouth of the head of the FCC testing lab in Maryland. Yes Peter, you KNOW I called them about it. He even told me to file a complaint with the FTC over it.
So stop bringing that issue up. It was 4 or 5 years ago and we both know what was posted on the FoxPro web site and on Predator Masters was pure and utter bullshit. Or as you are want to say - a LIE.
Now, maybe you have some callers that are not FCC certified. But that has NOTHING to do with a person using one and being subject to arrest and fines by the FCC. The consumer is protected you moron. It was just a cheap scare tactic to keep people from buying a competitors product.
I'll close by letting you in on a little known secret -
There's a reason Mike Dillon has never killed a coyote in PA. He's not using a WT e caller.
Now, go back to your igloo and leave the big boys alone you little twerp.
And have a nice day too
![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
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THO Game Calls
Posts: 266 | From: New Hampshire | Registered: Mar 2005
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Alaskan Yoter
Knows what it's all about
Member # 169
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posted October 14, 2009 10:55 AM
quote:
just how lonely does it get in Alaska
Uhhhhhhh.........................not that lonely Lance. At least not not down my way. ![[Wink]](wink.gif)
Posts: 235 | From: Wasilla, Alaska | Registered: Mar 2003
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted October 14, 2009 11:09 AM
As far as I can tell, TW has legit questions, although some of the questions seem trivial, to my mind. THO, on the other hand, I can't quite figure your motive? TW has not addressed you except when poked and his comments are usually directed at some real or imagined relationship between you and Martz, such as being neighbors. He hasn't posted sophomoric photos, (as you have) that have nothing to do with you or Martz or TW, or the subject at hand.
I'm just an impartial observer, (I guarantee) but if the dialogue is between Martz and TW, why are you sticking your nose into it? I hasten to add, you have the right, confered on you by virtue of your membership to stick your nose into it, but I can't quite figure out why you are concerned and why you seem to object to his questions?
I conclude that there is something personal, or some history that we don't know about. I guess I could care less, your reasons, but why not let him get out on his limb and saw it off, and like he said, just quit reading his posts if he pisses you off.
You may find it interesting that my mail indicates that these threads are very entertaining, for some of us.
Now, don't quit what you are doing, my intent is not to shut you down. I'm just curious about your reasons for picking a fight with the guy when he has not rattled your cage?
So, if you can find a minute to satisfy my curiosity, I should be ever so grateful, but other than that; please continue whatever it is that you are doing. I have no problem with it, really.
Good hunting. LB
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31462 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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TundraWookie
Knows what it's all about
Member # 1044
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posted October 14, 2009 12:26 PM
THO,
Thanks for serving our country, that was a commendible thing to do, Marine. The rest of your diatribe is another example of your perverse and skewed nature.
Don't worry, no threats about people in your "backyard". I just happen to know people in your neck of the woods and all over the US, showing you that I actually do have friends, one of which I thought was you. They're, including you are welcome to visit the igloo and Ewok tent anytime.
No need to get the FRS thread Al, here it is if you want to re-read through it. I think the FCC stuff starts on page 12.
http://finsandfur.net/forums/index.php?topic=4970.180
I got nothing handed to me if you actually read that post, NOTHING, and I didn't get caught in any lie. I stated Facts and my testing results. Show me where I lied Al, and I'll gladly address that publicly. Also notice how that thread ended on what seemed a decent note. You're obviously holding a grudge over it (and it's showing). Remember, I'm not FoxPro, so take that argument up with them if you're bitter. I won't say FoxPro lied, because there is a legitimate, legal issue with what WT's old FRS remotes did. I too spoke with the FCC lab, so you're not telling me anything I don't know. I didn't file a complaint though and to this date I don't believe anybody has. Martz was however using illegal (uncertified) FRS boards in his remotes while at the same time trying to discredit the competitors products. That's just downright stupid, no matter how you look at it.
AlaskanYoter,
Not that lonely here in Fairbanks either, plenty of fun, clean, ethical things to do. ![[Smile]](smile.gif)
Posts: 857 | From: Alaska | Registered: Dec 2006
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TheHuntedOne
Knows what it's all about
Member # 623
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posted October 14, 2009 12:33 PM
Well Mr. L
It goes back about 4 or 5 years - back to the old FRS remote issue. I was in the market for an E caller. I wanted to buy the WT caller.
I was told, by Peter, and pointed in the direction of the Fox Pro web site by Glenn Guess to read the horror stories about the WT caller.
There was even a thread on it on Predator Masters.
In short, I was lead to believe that if I bought the WT e caller, and used it, I would be subject to arrest and fines by the FCC.
I was also lead to believe that if I used the WT caller, the FRS remote could interfere with someone placing a distress signal and could be responsible for that signal not getting through, causing distress or worse to the person sending it.
I questioned this, and took it upon myself to seek out more information prior to spending, at that time, over 800 bucks on a caller that could get me thrown in jail.
So after several days on the FCC web site, not finding what I needed, I ended up going through New Hampshire Senator John Sununu's office to get a phone number to the FCC where I could actually speak to someone who might be able to tell me if what I had been told was right or wrong.
By telling the Senators office that the company that was being accused was a NH based company, they were very quick to get me a phone number for the head of the testing facility in Maryland.
I called. Got the Secretary. Dropped the Senators name. She told me when to call back and when I did, I spoke with the head of the facility.
He told me, that the remote was FCC certified, and I could buy it with no worries. He told me that the remote was one of the few, at that time, that had been certified "in house" at their facility instead of outsourced to another lab. The technician who did the certification was even now working at the Maryland facility.
He went on to tell me that even if the remote did not have a sticker on it, I would not be liable as long as I bought it believing it was a reputable product. He told me that the issue would be between the FCC and the company, not the consumer. He told me, after looking at the FoxPro web site that I should file a complaint with the Fair Trade Commission if I felt inclined to do so. He had no jurisdiction in the matter.
Well, I relayed that information to Peter and others and was called a liar, a Martz groopie and everything else you can imagine. Yet even after being presented with the results of my efforts, the misinformation about the WT remote persisted.
A year or so ago, it came up on FnF, and who shows up, but Peter. It started as some simple playful ball busting between me and Rich Cronk. But as soon as one mention of it was made, Peter showed up. At the time, he was a member there with very few post. But again, as soon as that issue of the remote came up, he showed up. It even went so far as to my receiving emails from FoxPro users telling me that I was a disgrace to the Marine Corps.
It was right after this that FoxPro finally took that information off their web site. They had left it there for over two years AFTER WT changed their remotes.
So roll forward to just a few weeks ago, when Andy asked about WT sounds here on Huntmasters. Who shows up? Peter - Tundra Wookie.
His credibility is certainly in question with me over this issue. And it should be with everyone. His "legitimate" questions may not be so legitimate nor sincere. It is certainly funny that when ever WT comes up on a forum that he hardly ever participates in, he shows up with his white hat and Bill Martz club.
In short, I think Peter has an agenda, a malicious one.
He pretends to have more than a layman's grasp of the technology, and uses it to mislead people, when in fact, he has never demonstrated anything more than a "backyard" mechanic's understanding of the working of an E caller. He is adept at reading articles on Wikipedia, and other on line publications, and uses those references to bolster his theories. He has tested e callers and written reviews on them, which in effect are nothing more than you or I could have done on our own given the machines and the time.
He has never demonstrated, nor shown, any technical expertise beyond that of a tinkerer. He has never produced any certificate of education in electronics.
Yet he comes to any forum that discusses WT, and wades in purporting to be an expert on E Callers, and proceeds to lash out at WT and anyone who uses one or thinks they might want to.
While I agree and defend his right to to go around and say what he wants, within the bounds of legal limits of course, when he does so, he must realize that he will be challenged and shown for what he really is. Simply someone with a hard on for Bill Martz.
To this day, as is evident in both this post, and two others on this forum, he continues to bring up the FRS issue which has been proven false, and because that remote is no longer used, even germane to the discussion.
So yes, it is personal, for the remarks made about my service, and it is opinion based on experience, however slight, at seeing what a WT can do in the field compared to other callers.
In closing, weather the caller puts out 11 watts or 12 watts makes no difference to the average coyote hunter when he is staring at an animal 50 yards away, and to lead people to believe that Bill Martz is a liar so they should not use a very fine product, does need to be defended. Unlike Mike Dillon, I do not believe the customer is always right. I believe, sometimes the customer is naive and needs to be pointed or lead in the right direction. Perhaps Mr. Martz lacks some tact or people skills, but it would simply not be in his best interest to sell a caller to a hunter that he knows is not going to work for him, no matter how insistent that hunter might be. Enthusiasm and hype from reading message boards full of newbie post sometimes needs to be tempered with a few hard knocks by people who have "been there done that". Which is why I think you see so many guys with two or three years of coyote hunting finally showing up over here. It takes a while to learn that what you have learned in the past, might not be so good.
It's time for Peter to just accept that the WT is a very good machine. His personal attacks on the owner of the company do nothing for the image of hunters. His queries and claims have nothing to do with weather the caller works or not in the field, and therefor, must be construed as simply bias based on personal dealings with Mr. Martz. They serve no useful purpose to the average hunter looking for a machine that will call coyotes consistently.
Thank you for the opportunity to respond, and I apologize for being so verbose - but you asked....
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The On Line Resource For Custom Call Makers
THO Game Calls
Posts: 266 | From: New Hampshire | Registered: Mar 2005
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TundraWookie
Knows what it's all about
Member # 1044
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posted October 14, 2009 01:03 PM
THO,
You can read what I was typing as you posted.
You're right on one thing, I have an agenda to point out the deceiving information and lies put out by Martz. Not that that makes the callers junk, because they're obviously not. I won't tell a person to not buy a WT, but I'll tell them which caller I prefer and why. I can give an honest evaluation of the callers without bringing my grudge with Martz into it. You'll see soon enough when I get a Mighty Atom how it goes. I will however show up when Martz is discussed because he's slandered me on his website and tried to personally threaten me on the phone. No hard feelings, just defending myself, understand? And this will go on with more things as long as my name is on his website. So get over it and learn to just not read what I type if it irritates you.
Read AGAIN, what I've written many times before, that it's not the caller, it's the owner. Get it through your head that I'm not against the WT callers, just the claims and history of lies. I have "accepted it", that's not what this is about THO. If you want to do some helpful e-caller testing to actually help people out, feel free to do it, I'd love to hear about it.
Bring some facts to the table and proof where I Lie, Lash Out at WT owners, Badmouth the WT callers, and I'll gladly deal with it. Especially show me where I told you that YOU lied. Until then, please stay in the Mouth Call section unless you can add something useful to my posts. Thanks.
Martz,
Still no word from you on your chart and voltage? It's not that tough of a question to answer is it?
Posts: 857 | From: Alaska | Registered: Dec 2006
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TheHuntedOne
Knows what it's all about
Member # 623
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posted October 14, 2009 03:21 PM
Try this one Einstein...
How is supplying 12 volts to a power supply that can handle 15 any different than supplying 9.6 volts to a power supply that can handle 12?
Both 12 volts and 9.6 volts are 80% of max.
If both are only powered to 80% of max, would that not make them both, in your words - already underpowered?
And while it is possible with a bit of money and putting up with a bunch of weight and bulk to get that 9.6 volt underpowered amp up to 12 volts, does it make sense to push something to it's limits every time? Or will a component last longer if it is allowed some room to "breath" shall we say?
WT clearly posted the voltage requirements on their web page, and you take them to task for it.
FoxPro buried it in their instruction manual and they get a pass.
This argument appears weak, and nothing more than an attempt to discredit the WT caller while ignoring a similar if not exactly the same set of circumstances for the FoxPro.
Would you like to clarify any of this?
I forgot to ask if I passed the quiz??
[ October 14, 2009, 03:29 PM: Message edited by: TheHuntedOne ]
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TundraWookie
Knows what it's all about
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posted October 14, 2009 03:49 PM
My point is, if you want to compare "Apples to Apples", which is what that whole thing is supposed to be about, the higher than 15 volt portion shouldn't even be a part of it. 80% of whatever the Power Requiment is can be calculated, but what's the point, it's right there on the chart (look at the 12 volt mark)? People are typically going to be using 12volt (10 AA battery packs). Some will use the high dollar Li-Ion packs, but not the majority. If you look at the charts, at that voltage range (12-13 volts), the FoxPro is putting out more Power (Watts). If the callers amplifier is nearing it's upper power threshold, then the circuit design needs to be looked at since it can ultimately damage the thing. Ramping up voltage isn't that amazing of a feat either and isn't cutting edge technology if that's what's going on in the MA-15. The simple question is, based on those charts and the power packs hunters will be using, why would somebody choose a WT over a FoxPro from that chart? The data shows the FoxPro putting out more Watts in the range of power hunters will be using. Do you really need to know how much voltage the FoxPro units will handle? If they put a chart like that on their website with a claim of Power Requiments of 15 volts, but say that you use 10 AA batteries, I'd question it, you bet. I'll tell you exactly what FoxPro units will handle in terms of voltage requirments if you'd like? Why does their lack of data offend you, yet fuzzy data is fine? You still think slandering an individual on a manufacturer website is legit too don't you?
You failed the Quiz. You haven't brought any facts showing I lied to you or anybody else. Good use on the math though and crunching those numbers.
Posts: 857 | From: Alaska | Registered: Dec 2006
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TheHuntedOne
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posted October 14, 2009 04:08 PM
I believe you said
quote:
Are you trying to help or hurt yourself with your output power vs. supply voltage chart? How are you assuming people are going to get 15volts from a 10-AA battery pack for any real duration of time? Typical NiMh nominal voltage is 1.2volts, so right around 12 volts will be the nominal power output
and then you quipped
quote:
If the "Power Requirement" of your Mighty Atom (MA-15)is 15volts, the thing is already going to be underpowered.
I simply stated, that what you said, should be equally applied to both Fox Pro and WT. The 80% of peak is exactly the same for each caller.
Therefore, your statement
quote:
the thing is already going to be underpowered.
based on that 80% number is disingenuous at best, and misleading at worst.
You attempted to lead people to believe that the Mighty Atom was "already underpowered" when in fact, it is powered exactly the same as as any FoxPro straight from the factory.
I'm just responding to what you wrote Peter. Perhaps you would like to go back and edit your original post to help bolster your point.
6448
[ October 14, 2009, 04:09 PM: Message edited by: TheHuntedOne ]
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The On Line Resource For Custom Call Makers
THO Game Calls
Posts: 266 | From: New Hampshire | Registered: Mar 2005
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TundraWookie
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posted October 14, 2009 04:29 PM
THO,
The WT says "Power Requirement" 15 Volts. No minimum value, just 15 volts. Therefore, if it is "Required" to have 15volts, and only has 10 x 1.2volt AA batteries = 12 volts, it's underpowered. This thread isn't about FoxPro, is it? Did you see me ask FoxPro anything in this thread? But since you seem so bent about it, the FoxPro's I've used will run on 12 volts up to and above 15 volts that I've tried.
I don't need to edit anything Al, I'm content with what I wrote and if any "bolstering" is needed I can always start another thread.
You still haven't brough any Facts to the table here that show me being the liar, and WT call basher you make me out to be. You can play this game as long as you want to THO, but why are you in this thread again? Did you ship out my call today overnight like you said you would, or were you lying?
Edit: I'm still waiting for you to show me where I was handed my rear end in that FnF post too? If you could point out that part of that thread, I'd appreciate it. Thanks.
[ October 14, 2009, 04:50 PM: Message edited by: TundraWookie ]
Posts: 857 | From: Alaska | Registered: Dec 2006
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Cdog911
"There are some ideas so absurd only an intellectual could believe them."--George Orwell.
Member # 7
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posted October 14, 2009 04:48 PM
"America's favorite hot dog!!!"
That's what it said on the package of weenies I was grilling for the kids just moments ago. I wonder if they actually polled people to back up that claim? Better yet, whose gonna buy the package, read that, and climb all up in their asses for making such a boastful claim, even after they ate the hot dogs, enjoyed them and would probably admit that they'll buy the same brand again in the future?
On a travel hunt several years ago, we were hunting with a guy who invented and owns the rights to a very popular and successful brand of personal hygiene products. He was trying to get Higgins to bottle pee and sell the mist after watching how it worked. When Rich told him he had no idea who would buy such a thing, this guys says, "Look at me! Two bucks of stuff in a fifty cent bottle and $12 worth of bullshit on the label, and here I am!"
It's product promotion, plain and simple. I'm with Al in feeling that aside from Tundra Wookie and maybe Gary Clevanger, most guys are perfectly happy if the thing will just call coyotes, regardless of who made it. I personally wonder if 16-bit versus 24-bit versus this and that means nearly as much to us as some think it does to the coyotes. Any claims that it does seems like a lot of boastful product promotion to me, but I may be wrong. Doesn't mean I'm going to take the time to attack the manufacturer's character, his advertising methods, or sue him because I just don't like the way he dresses.
The bigger question is whether or not Bill actually knew that what he has claimed is false, assuming for just one moment that it is, or were his facts true, as far as he knew, when the statements were made? If his belief is that they were true at the time, it'll be damned hard to back up any claims that he's a LIAR, as you say. On the other hand, all he has to do is prove that your remarks have caused him to incur a loss and he has buttloads of evidence with which he can prove libel at the push of a "print" button.
As far as what is on his website, I haven't seen it, but if it's there, then it's libelous, not slanderous, and in a court of law, you would have to demonstrate that you incurred a loss. If remarks he made were, to his knowledge, true, and he has evidence that can prove his position, you're toast. IMO, you've probably done more to prove who you are and what you're about by running all over the web attacking the guy then anything he might have posted. I know that I, for one, know you only by how you have conducted yourself here and elsewhere within the calling community and it appears, for all intents and purposes, that you have an agenda. If Bill is smart, he'll just stand down, control his temper, and let you feed yourself rope.
Now, I'll change the channel.
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I am only one. But still, I am one. I cannot do everything, but still, I can do something; and, because I cannot do everything, I will not refuse to do something that I can do.
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TundraWookie
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posted October 14, 2009 05:03 PM
Cdog911,
Martz knew he was selling callers that played 16bit 32kHz sound files and touting them as "CD Quality". I have his published brochures and old websites touting them as such. All of the data I've written is based directly from WT's own "facts", including the MP3 player thread and other threads discussing past products. I have the actual products and literature to prove my case if need be. I'm not making this stuff up, I just ask the questions and show the data. Of course, I do think Martz is a Liar, he's proven that to me both online and on the phone. He has been asked specifically several times to say what his prior KAS2030MS model bitrate and frequency was, because it was touted as 24bit/48kHz and was proven to be a 16bit/32kHz unit. I think the term for that is False Advertising, correct?
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