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Author
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Topic: Found in today's mail...
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Cdog911
"There are some ideas so absurd only an intellectual could believe them."--George Orwell.
Member # 7
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posted November 07, 2005 07:38 PM
is a letter with a Phoenix postmark that reads as follows:
November 3, 2005
To whom it may concern,
This is a heads up to all concerned sportsmen
I recently attended a screening for the showing of a new video soon to be released called Maximum Predator Control from Trigger Time Productions and Produced by Gary McGraw, Phoenix, Arizona and endorsed and funded by Modern Call Products as an “instructional video”. The description proclaims that this video is “the future of hunting videos”.
Prior to the viewing, the producer/hunter explained to the audience that this video will be carried by WalMart, Kmart, Cabelas, NRA, Sportsman’s Warehouse, Dick’s Sporting Goods, Bass Pro Shop and more.
Only 58 minutes of the 2 hour video was shown.
I found the video extremely disturbing inasmuch as it held absolutely ZERO sporting value. Furthermore, this video glorifies the mutilation of coyotes, fox and bobcats with extremely poor shooting, maiming, close-up views of large wound channels with hanging entrails, body pieces being launched and more. This video takes great delight in showing graphic gore in real time followed by 4 and sometimes 5 slow motion repeats of the same bloody scenes (every time, over and over). The poor shooting skills portrayed were inexcusable and an absolute disservice to wildlife. HUNTING IS NOT LIKE THIS! PERIOD!
This video is not anything that should be promoted as sport hunting to sportsmen, children or the general public on any level.
As a parent, I am outraged knowing that a video such as this could somehow be seen by my children or those in my neighborhood attending the same schools as my children. The nightmares of Columbine come to mind.
This material shold never be associated with the hunting industry on any level. This video goes far beyond red-mist. Close ups of coyote heads bouncing on rocks as they are dragged. Bodies are being tossed and slammed on the ground.
I strongly suggest that you (as a sportsman involved in predator hunting) obtain a copy of this video and decide whether this hapless, blood-cult pornography material should be promoted or even portrayed. Personally, I find it extremely offensive, wrong-minded, unethical, destructive and a total disservice to sportsmen everywhere.
I am not against the First Amendment, but as a sportsman I would be against any business who would consider this as acceptable sport hunting.
Anonymous
Your thoughts?
[ November 07, 2005, 07:39 PM: Message edited by: Cdog911 ]
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I am only one. But still, I am one. I cannot do everything, but still, I can do something; and, because I cannot do everything, I will not refuse to do something that I can do.
Posts: 5440 | From: The gun-lovin', gun-friendly wild, wild west | Registered: Jan 2003
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Gerald Stewart
Knows what it's all about
Member # 162
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posted November 07, 2005 08:33 PM
I was approached at the SHOT SHOW about this video and given a trailer DVD. I was concerned about what the final cut would look like. I had a negative gut feeling about it from a combination of the music, the firearms used, and the words used to characterize the video.
I would like to see the full video before I pass final judgement on it for myself, but it does not bode well for it, if it is getting this kind of bad press already.
It will be interesting to see what kind of a debate ensues. If that video and it's graphic scenes are really bad, then any other scenes of spinning dogs or death dances are just....sort of bad? Just food for thought.
I too recieved the anonymous letter today.
Posts: 419 | From: Waco,Tx | Registered: Mar 2003
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Jay Nistetter
Legalize Weed, Free the Dixie Chicks
Member # 140
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posted November 07, 2005 08:38 PM
I received the same letter as well.
I got a phonecall from Randy at PM because he got one too. While talking to him it seemed odd to us that they said it should not be promoted but everyone should buy it.
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Understanding the coyote is not as important as knowing where they are.
I usually let the fur prime up before I leave 'em lay.
Posts: 1006 | From: Arizona | Registered: Feb 2003
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Gerald Stewart
Knows what it's all about
Member # 162
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posted November 07, 2005 09:19 PM
Can someone buy it and bring it to the campout with one of those portable DVD players. It could be our Friday night entertainment. ![[Wink]](wink.gif)
Posts: 419 | From: Waco,Tx | Registered: Mar 2003
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Rich Higgins
unknown comic
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posted November 07, 2005 09:59 PM
I called Modern Calls to order it and was told that it is still in final editing and will not be available for two more weeks.
I was at the meeting where the video was previewed. Before showing the video Gary McGraw stated that he would like everyones feedback . After the viewing he stated that he didn't care what we liked or thought. He told us that he had shown the clip at the shotshow and it was well received. The NRA is interested in using it to attract young people to the shooting sports. Personally I found it to be disturbing as did a number of other members that spoke to me about it. The letter was accurate.
IP: Logged
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scruffy
Knows what it's all about
Member # 725
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posted November 08, 2005 08:20 AM
quote:
I strongly suggest that you (as a sportsman involved in predator hunting) obtain a copy of this video and decide whether this hapless, blood-cult pornography material should be promoted or even portrayed.
Yea, this statement also struck me as odd. It's almost like "Anonymous" is using all of you guys to spread the word around the net to generate interest to generate sales. If I were a betting man I'd put some $$$ on "Anonymous" being part of the production's advertising department.
I seriously doubt the tree hugging higher ups at walmart and kmart will sell a blood and gore "too violent for TV" film on their shelves giving $$$ to those that created it. But saying it will, sending out letters to every big name in the industry, talking to the big names at the shot show, showing special presentations, etc will generate alot of publicity on the net and get the word out about their gore offering.
Just my two cents, feel free to tell me it I'm way off base.
later,
scruffy
[ November 08, 2005, 08:23 AM: Message edited by: scruffy ]
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Git R Done
Posts: 361 | From: south central Iowa | Registered: Nov 2005
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Gerald Stewart
Knows what it's all about
Member # 162
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posted November 08, 2005 09:59 AM
I have not mentioned it to anyone because I have not seen it. If it is, as anonymous says it is,...trust me...., I will say something about it to people in higher places than me. If in fact the NRA has decided to use it to "promote" to youth....they will hopefully hear from many of us.
If they made that decision based on a watered down promo version then, they need to be made aware of the true nature of the video.
Posts: 419 | From: Waco,Tx | Registered: Mar 2003
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted November 08, 2005 10:29 AM
Well, I'm bummed that I wasn't important enough to get a letter. A letter? In this day and age? Why not transmit this electronically? And here is where it starts to stink, right away: anonymous. Why?
Of course, considering the attitude displayed at the promotion: "we don't cae what you think". Really? Almost begging for a few negative letters.
It's a unique sales gimmic, for sure.
Good hunting. LB
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 32368 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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scruffy
Knows what it's all about
Member # 725
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posted November 08, 2005 11:21 AM
Hey, maybe the "mailing list" was those individuals that have produced a predator video. ???
Did Bill Martz get a letter???
later,
scruffy
[ November 08, 2005, 11:22 AM: Message edited by: scruffy ]
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Git R Done
Posts: 361 | From: south central Iowa | Registered: Nov 2005
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Cdog911
"There are some ideas so absurd only an intellectual could believe them."--George Orwell.
Member # 7
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posted November 08, 2005 12:26 PM
I haven't done no video. I think it came from the T&PC mailing list since it was add'd to me the same as my magazine is with both my name and my business name.
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I am only one. But still, I am one. I cannot do everything, but still, I can do something; and, because I cannot do everything, I will not refuse to do something that I can do.
Posts: 5440 | From: The gun-lovin', gun-friendly wild, wild west | Registered: Jan 2003
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scruffy
Knows what it's all about
Member # 725
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posted November 08, 2005 01:09 PM
Sorry Lance, my bad about the video. I'll have to get a T&PC subscription so I'm not left out.
later,
scruffy
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Git R Done
Posts: 361 | From: south central Iowa | Registered: Nov 2005
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Cdog911
"There are some ideas so absurd only an intellectual could believe them."--George Orwell.
Member # 7
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posted November 08, 2005 01:32 PM
Counting on it, Scruffy. Tell them you like my work and am ordering the subscription solely for that purpose. Keeps my family off the poor house roster. LOL
In truth, I had a mixture of emotions when I first read the letter. On one hand, I too felt that this may be some advertising ruse to generate controversy and push sales. Kinda like the misting article did for T&PC. ![[Smile]](smile.gif) Otherwise, why the anonymity?
On the other hand, a few passages reminded me a lot of anti-hunting propaganda and thought maybe we had an anti trying play themself off as "one of us" and trying to get us all to "unify" against the carnage film.
Rich's remark that the letter is accurate tends to make me feel that it is a legitimate effort to stop an otherwise unnecessary video. As far as the emotional scarring of watching a dead coyote's head bouncing over rocks as it is dragged along, I guess I need some counseling 'cause I just saw that twice today alone. Now, if it was, say, my grandmother, that would be one thing. But it's a coyote, for chrissake. ![[Confused]](confused.gif)
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I am only one. But still, I am one. I cannot do everything, but still, I can do something; and, because I cannot do everything, I will not refuse to do something that I can do.
Posts: 5440 | From: The gun-lovin', gun-friendly wild, wild west | Registered: Jan 2003
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scruffy
Knows what it's all about
Member # 725
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posted November 08, 2005 01:52 PM
Lance, as soon as I find one to buy to get the little card out of I'll send it in for a 1 year subscription. Is there another way? Are there T&PC cards in FFG magazine??? I'm not sure why it sticks in my head that there is/was?
Anyway, I dropped outdoorlife last year for FFG. This year I'm looking for a replacement for Field and Stream. I usually carry 3 or 4 subscriptions in a year. My wife complains I have to many, I tell her all of mine combined are cheaper than her "people" magazine subscription (over a hundred a year!!! ![[Eek!]](eek.gif) ).
Oh, sorry for the sidetrack!
later,
scruffy
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Git R Done
Posts: 361 | From: south central Iowa | Registered: Nov 2005
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Gerald Stewart
Knows what it's all about
Member # 162
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posted November 08, 2005 02:25 PM
For the same reason the Abu Gharib pictures did not need to be shown to the Arab world, a dead coyotes head bouncing along the rocks does not need to be shown to the anti's. It inflames and creates a more determined adversary. Think how you felt when you saw the almost naked soldier being dragged through the streets of Mogidishu. I wanted to Nuke'em.
The same goes for a scene of a spinning coyote, a coyote pulling at it's entrails or legs sticking up in the air shaking uncontrollably until death sets in. It is just not necessary to show those scenes to accomplish entertainment. Creative editing and added graphics can easily be used to soldify the shot fired-hit-killed image in the viewers mind........in my humble opinion.
[ November 08, 2005, 02:26 PM: Message edited by: Gerald Stewart ]
Posts: 419 | From: Waco,Tx | Registered: Mar 2003
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Cdog911
"There are some ideas so absurd only an intellectual could believe them."--George Orwell.
Member # 7
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posted November 08, 2005 04:37 PM
And a valued opinion it is, Gerald. Point well taken.
Scruffy,
go to www.trapperpredatorcaller.com and subscribe there, or their toll free number can be found there. Don't have a copy close at hand but if I think about it, I'll post it here in a little bit.
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I am only one. But still, I am one. I cannot do everything, but still, I can do something; and, because I cannot do everything, I will not refuse to do something that I can do.
Posts: 5440 | From: The gun-lovin', gun-friendly wild, wild west | Registered: Jan 2003
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Cal Taylor
Knows what it's all about
Member # 199
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posted November 08, 2005 06:03 PM
CDog, Do you know if T&PC is selling or giving out their subscriber list? I hope not, because that is really annoying, and I know that most magazines do it, but I hoped the T&PC if any would have class enough not to do it.
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Democracy is two wolves and a lamb deciding what to have for lunch.
Liberty is a well armed lamb contesting the vote.
FoxPro Field Staff Member
Posts: 1069 | From: Wyoming | Registered: May 2003
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Cdog911
"There are some ideas so absurd only an intellectual could believe them."--George Orwell.
Member # 7
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posted November 08, 2005 07:06 PM
I don't know about that, Cal, and I agree with you on the annoying part. But, the price offered for those things makes selling them very attractive. Sometimes as much as a buck an address, but I doubt that this individual paid that much. There are just very few places that I deal with where I use both my name and my taxidermy shop name in the return address line.
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I am only one. But still, I am one. I cannot do everything, but still, I can do something; and, because I cannot do everything, I will not refuse to do something that I can do.
Posts: 5440 | From: The gun-lovin', gun-friendly wild, wild west | Registered: Jan 2003
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Krustyklimber
prefers the bunny hugger pronunciation: ky o tee
Member # 72
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posted November 08, 2005 08:08 PM
Cal,
Yes, it HAD to be T&pc mag... it's happened to me.
I haven't subscribed to any publication in years (especially a hunting related one), or recieved much if any junk mail addressed to me, until it came time to renew my T&pc subscription.
Each time I got another notice, and ingnored it, the level of junk mail went up. Now it's annoying.
BECAUSE of this, I'm going to let my subscription go. ![[Mad]](mad.gif) Too bad it's a good read most issues.
Krusty 
P.S. I am not on the mailing list about the video.
[ November 08, 2005, 08:10 PM: Message edited by: Krustyklimber ]
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Think about how stupid the average person is, then realize that half of them are stupider than that!
Posts: 1912 | From: Deep in the Blue Ridge Mountains of Virginia | Registered: Jan 2003
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Tim Behle
Administrator MacNeal Sector
Member # 209
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posted November 08, 2005 09:08 PM
Krusty,
Sounds like you are just looking for an excuse to let your subscription go.
I've been on the TPC mailing list for 15 years or more. I didn't get anything about it either.
But then I didn't sign up for all of these Viagra, Prozac and Free software emails that I get each day. I guess I should blame you for those? After all, you do have and use a computer on the internet.
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Personally, I carry a gun because I'm too young to die and too old to take
an ass kickin'.
Posts: 3160 | From: Five Miles East of Vic, AZ | Registered: Jun 2003
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Krustyklimber
prefers the bunny hugger pronunciation: ky o tee
Member # 72
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posted November 09, 2005 12:28 AM
Tim,
You make a point, I guess, I don't know for a fact that T&pc mag sold my name.
It does seem an odd coincidence that right about the time my subscription lasped a wave (a tsunami) of hunting related junk mail began.
I'm not looking for an excuse, but they did make it convinient if I was.
Of the ten issues, I only recieved eight of them, the replacement copies, plus the back issues I was promised (as consolation for messing up the activation of my subscription) never arrived.
That's poor customer service.
I'll miss the good reading, and the helpful information. My subscription was a gift, for which I am very grateful, but I am glad it wasn't my money.
If they did sell off my name, dude , that's just not cool.
Krusty
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Think about how stupid the average person is, then realize that half of them are stupider than that!
Posts: 1912 | From: Deep in the Blue Ridge Mountains of Virginia | Registered: Jan 2003
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Kokopelli
SENIOR DISCOUNT & Dispenser of Sage Advice
Member # 633
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posted November 10, 2005 05:35 PM
Why would anybody put out a tasteless splatter video when there are so many quality ones to chose from??
And I'm hurt 'cause I didn't get a letter too.
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And lo, the Light of the Trump shown upon the Darkness and the Darkness could not comprehend it.
Posts: 8236 | From: Under a wandering star | Registered: Apr 2005
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Norm
Knows what it's all about
Member # 240
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posted November 11, 2005 04:42 PM
Krusty, I don't think it was the magazine.
I have a life subscribtion and I didn't get one; I am a member of the Phoenix predator callers and I didn't get one... Oh well, I wouldn't have wanted one, but it won't change my memberships...
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Carpe Diem
Posts: 778 | From: Phx AZ | Registered: Oct 2003
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Krustyklimber
prefers the bunny hugger pronunciation: ky o tee
Member # 72
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posted November 11, 2005 07:54 PM
Norm,
I didn't get a letter about the video either.
And like you I am glad I didn't get one.
I suspect T&pc sold my name off to a clearing house that serves other companies like Cabela's, Delta Force, Sportsman's Guide and others.
Having a lifetime subscription, might be why you don't get the junk/treasure mail. It didn't start until my subscription was about to lapse.
New customers, who look like they are headed out the door anyways, are not as valuable as "the regulars". And mailing lists are big money.
It very well could be, I signed up for something else and don't remember.
Enjoy your subscription. ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
Krusty
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Think about how stupid the average person is, then realize that half of them are stupider than that!
Posts: 1912 | From: Deep in the Blue Ridge Mountains of Virginia | Registered: Jan 2003
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Jack Roberts
unknown comic
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posted November 11, 2005 10:16 PM
It is quite common for magazines to not sell current subscribers but sell former subscribers to everybody they can. A name and address can easily be worth $1 each time you sell it.
I doubt T&PC does this as I let my subscription expire and had no big increase in stuff.
Jack
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