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Posted by jerryboy (Member # 231) on August 14, 2003, 01:03 PM:
Hi, new here. Just here and enjoy reading all the posts. I had a question that I posted here and there and have yet to get an answer.
Is there any widely used practices in calling that just doesn't work in your neck of the woods?
Like I tryed to call for 5 minutes (opening softly) last year and it just never worked. Where I'm at here in Indiana,it isn't open sky country,but it isnt brush country either. All my coyotes have been taken in the 2-300 yd range and in the open or treelines. I just get busted when I call that long. They can cover alot of ground in 5 minutes! I also get them up to an hour creeping arround at a distance looking for what was making all the reckett LOL. Just wondered what classic common rules don't apply to you.
Thanks, jerryboy
Posted by onecoyote (Member # 129) on August 14, 2003, 03:51 PM:
Hi Jerryboy and welcome. I'm sure someone can answer your question.
Posted by varmit hunter (Member # 37) on August 14, 2003, 09:47 PM:
Jerry. Could use a little more info here. If I am hunting open country. I open hard and loud, And stay that way till they slow down.
You say you are getting busted. Is it from the wind?. Are you setting up with little are no back ground.
The snooping around a hour later is pure Coyote. Would not matter if you were out there playing bagpipes. A hour after you finished there would be a coyote checking it out.
Please try and tell us a little more about you're setup , and terrain.
Posted by Tim Behle (Member # 209) on August 15, 2003, 08:25 AM:
If you making 2-300 yard shots, and hunting any place south of about Kokomo, you are shooting way too soon.
The northern third of the State is plenty open, and you may have trouble getting shy coyotes to cross a lot of open ground in the day light.
The Southern two thirds isn't so open. Calling the coyotes up close and personal shouldn't be much of a problem. Try using an electronic caller, set it out 25 yards away from you at about 3/4 volume and let it play for 30 minutes.
Never shoot a coyote that's still running towards you.
Posted by Alaskan Yoter (Member # 169) on August 15, 2003, 11:51 AM:
Welcome aboard JB........
Todd
Posted by jerryboy (Member # 231) on August 15, 2003, 12:55 PM:
Thanks for the welcome men. What I was meaning was,certain unwritten rules like open with 5 minutes. I called 5 minutes and got busted almost every time. I tryed calling about a minute or less really loud,and started busting them. 8 in 10 days on the last 10 days of the season on State property. My stands I try to maximise my views. I always sit against a tree with a sitting bi-pod and full body/gun camo. I noticed if I'm sitting there blowing,even at great distances,they busted me. I guess I shortened the call length enough to draw them to me instead of having them stand far away and catch movement.They seem to like to do that arround here. I hunt mostly north of Terre Haute Directly west in the center of the state. Near the Ill. border. I have had them run arround the edge to respond,but rarely across as mentioned. Once or twice. I have seen them stand and look at me,and I don't dare keep calling. I let the sound sink in,let him think about missing his share of the rabbit. I would rather take a 200 or 300 yd shot than have one run in LOL. Too close and I get all shook up LOL.I'll stop em' out there a couple hundred if I can. Just my style I guess. As soon as I started just coaxing them from far off, to my general area,seems to work better for me. I just have better luck being short N sweet. i try to get up and max my view. I hunt tree lines and open fields. A nice hill with a bush is the place I will be found. I like to cover as much ground as I can with my eye. I use good powered binos. I just get antsy and take them no matter how far they are(within range).Any ideas or teqs that dont work in your area is what I'm interrested in.I quit getting them hanging up,as when I see them,I knock out the calling,they seem to move into range if I lay off. If i keep it up,they will hang or eventually spot me. Thanks for the welcom,keep the info coming. Howling is where it's at for me too. I just howl once,and wait.Almost always works. I use the same method with distress. Gets them searching for me. jerryboy
Posted by Krustyklimber (Member # 72) on August 15, 2003, 02:42 PM:
I follow ya Jerry,
But we discussed this in the chat the other night...
I have a basic technique which just doesn't seem applicable here where we hunt... "spot and stalk".
Here we are lucky to be able to spot our quarry, and if it is clear enough for spotting there's way too much slash left from logging to think about creeping up on an animal (if we can see it was most likely clearcut).
And when we can see over these clearcuts it is usually from an elevated position (ie on a stump, rock, or fin/ridge of earth. If we moved down into the underbrush we'd lose sight of the animal.
I think we use a little more of a "spot and fire a Hail Mary shot... before it disappears" technique here. ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
Jeff 
Posted by Cdog911 (Member # 7) on August 15, 2003, 04:02 PM:
JB,
Maybe I'm misreading what you've described, but I "hear" you saying you call for five minutes to start, and have reduced that to one minute. Right? Way longer than what I do. A lot of my stands start with lone howls. But, as part of mixing things up, I will more than happily strat with prey squeals. If I do, my initial squeaks last all of five, maybe ten seconds. I wait a minute, then increase to the twenty second range. I'm firmly convinced that a coyote can pinpoint your location within fifty yards or less from the first squeal, as long as the wind's not blowing like hell.
As far as shooting distances, if the coyote is still coming in, keep your mouth shut and let him advance. If he veers off, a lip squeak is often all it takes to set him straight once again. If he hangs up, maybe turns and goes out of sight, don't write him off. he may just be revamping his approach. If I go without seeing him for upwards of a minute or so, I'll let him have a high puppy howl, and he'll often suddenly appear at an edge somewhere to see who I am. In doing so, I often find that they've slipped behind cover and are circling to get the wind in their favor where I cannot see them. That howl will make them often give their sneak-in away.
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on August 15, 2003, 08:31 PM:
Welcome to the New Huntmasters, Jerryboy. Glad to have you on board.
This was a chore to log on tonight because I'm here in Sedona, and have to sign on as a guest. My links back home do me no good, at all. So, with a bright idea, I searched for DAA's site and used his link! Thanks, Dave!
As to the question, I'm not going to be much help tonight, can't get used to this laptop, etc.
Good hunting. LB
Posted by Barry (Member # 34) on August 15, 2003, 09:43 PM:
Hello JB.FAL,the ultimate......
Posted by Rob (Member # 75) on August 15, 2003, 10:19 PM:
Howdy JB ![[Wink]](wink.gif)
Posted by jerryboy (Member # 231) on August 16, 2003, 07:16 AM:
Cdog911, Yes ,I was calling too long last year and cut it to a soft one minute and it doesn't give them a fix on where I'm at. It helps me spot them looking for me. You are the first Person I have met who calls so short Like I do. There are times where I feel the distance is great and I need to lay into it, but I'd rather get closer and pull off my short -n- sweet method. As for what Krusty was saying, I think the terrain,even though rough is still much more open than mine. I have medium views. I try to hunt as open as I can get and across fields and flatts. Krusty has never heard of a hollar! LOL Must be an Indiana thing. What we call a hollar is a ditch to him LOL. Our hollars can be 100 yds wide,to miles wide. Some are so long here,they have names. Up on the edges of hollars,I can see both sides,up and down,I can see everything well. I guess we all have to utilize all our different territories. Here in Indiana,they act different than arround the hillcountry near San Antonio TX,where I grew up for 18 years. In San Antonio,I used the mesquite to my advantage. It seemed if you blew a call,they would come. I caught them in the open alot too. Here In Indiana,it's a rough ballgame. They are slicker and use distance to their advantage.They will stand in the edge of the woods and stare for a long time. The calling for 5 minutes thing is a sure bust here. There was a guy in ohio who was practicing and asked what he was doing wrong.I am no expert but he described what he had been doing,he described just what I had gotten by reading many posts.Alot will advise opening softly,and call for 5 minutes. No way here. I told him to do waht he had been doing and cut it to one minute. He did and called me the next day and was bragging about his first coyote! I think it's just a matter of terrain. In Krustys neck,it's kinda long and open, and I'm sure you would need to open and go 5 minutes. They would obviously be further away.So that makes since.
I had been reading a coyote language post by Rich Kronk and learned alot of stuff and definate howls. I am gratefull for the sharing of the knowlege.They do work.They work well.Even if I half ass do them,they still work. I mess up on a sweet lone howl,and still get a coyote.
My greatest howling lesson came from a large coyote last year who had managed to make it out into the middle of a field.Right in front of me(the field was 1-mile long and 6-700yds across.)
He traveled down a series of ditches untill he reached a small frozen pond. I just about jumped out of my skin when I heard a loud howl. This was no howl I had ever heard before. It was long and low.It was like a lone,but much lower.Maybe just age I dunno'. It went like,Wooooooohhhhhhhhhhhhh
hhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww! Very long! I hadn't noticed him till I heard the holw and how close it was. He was out of My shooting range with the rifle I had. So I opted to watch him through a 32x scope. I learned alot that day. He was huge and had a black patch across his back.He stood out well against the snow. I was stunned at how he got out in the open on the frozen pond and I didn't notice him getting there. Soon,another lighter one showed up.This one was golden colored. i was amazed at the color difference in 2 coyotes in the same area. New knowledge to me. I watched them nip at each other and I wondered what they were doing. The golden one was lighter built and smaller but still not a small dog. It was obvious the big dark one was the Alfa ass kicker LOL. The smaller one ran arround it teasing it as a pup does to a bitch.But no real scrap incurred. As I was wondering if I was being stupid for watching and not putting a 45gr.hp through the bigger ones ear,I noticed a bark about 50yds to my right.Another trotting linkily down another shallow ditch until he got right up to the area the other 2 were at and trotted out on the pond too. It approached the bigger one and the big one attacked.Coyote #3 got the hell out of there.They chased him completely out of the field!Right by me. Far be it from me to waste a good kill and possibly 3 kills.As Im quick with an AR LOL,but I was trying to learn what and why they were doing that. Do they call each other up and just fight to prove who is boss? I don't really understand what I seen.But I seen it.It didn't sound like a challenge howl either. The 2 that were apparently getting along,returned to the frozen pond and howled together. I wish I had a video cam.Were they securing the territory for sport? I often get kills over this field and catch them mousing and spot and shoot them.
The younger of the 2 screwed arround and got into 250+ yard range and I let him have a Winchester cheapo 45gr HP to his spine. The wind was blowing bad and it was so cold,no other creature in his right mind was out there but me and the yotes LOL. After firing I didn't hear or see the coyote react. Then,a delayed Whop! I seen his ass end pop up in the air.I walked out to find him laying right where he took his last step in the snow. Here he is;
Now, to lay to waste another good practice; Here pressuring one certain area doesn't seem to slow down the activities much,as I shot 3 where I shot this one,and 5 fron one knoll 1/4 mile away. They were still out in the field on the last day of State season on State land. As I crossed over a large hill that cuts this area off from the rest of the world,they were out in the field howling like theres no tomorrow.Talk about killing me! But I had gotten 8 in the last 10 days of the season so I was satisfied for the time. The large dark one never messed up. I thought I would bushwhack him because I knew where his stomping grounds were.No way Jose! He was onto me and always appeared way across the field. I figured if I was being copped onto,they would steer clear all together.Not true with this one. I had seen him before in the field before the day I seen him dominate. I tryed getting there while it was still dark and setting up close to the pond in some bushes,no way, he entered the field from the oppisite side and scanned the field from the knoll where I watched him beat up the others.I can take a dozen,but I want him! LOL,maybe I'm insane,but I must take him. Just because he is way smarter and slicker. I tryed to just change up my approach,he was always one step ahead. I could have changed up all together and taken my Savage Tactical .308 with 32x and gotten him easily. But I wanted a challenge.I wanted to learn how they react when they know I'm there.I'm hoping this year I can get him. You will know why when you see him LOL.
I owe alot of my studying to good 16x binos and the open flat field. There are alot of coyotes in the State area I hunt.Krusty doesn't believe me but I invited him up for a 10 day free for all killfest LOL. He will see I'm not bullshitting LOL. Thanks for sharing the good info men,keep it coming. jerryboy
[ August 16, 2003, 07:38 AM: Message edited by: jerryboy ]
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on August 16, 2003, 07:59 AM:
Thanks for the complete rundown, Jerry. Some guys apologize for a two paragraph post, but we need more guys like you; people like to read the blow by blow descriptions. Thanks!
(now,we need some breakfast) ![[Smile]](smile.gif)
Good hunting. LB
Posted by Crow Woman (Member # 157) on August 16, 2003, 08:25 AM:
What a great post JB! Thanks for taking me hunting with your words
Gotta refill the coffee now... let's hear more
Posted by jerryboy (Member # 231) on August 16, 2003, 12:35 PM:
Thanks!
I am known (only to myself) for sliding down ridges on my A&&.LOL Ever seen a Chris Farhley movie? Yup,That's me!I don't just slide down a little,regain my footing,and resume my stalking.I go all the way or nothing! HAHA! One morning in particular,I decided to approach my favorite Un-mollested hill from the back door.Thats right, I was gonna go where no man has gone before('Cept for me) . To the back of the State lands and take an old mining road to the back of my favorite spot and Just do something different.The State lands I hunt are old coal mines.The land is speckled with hugh,deep lakes that are flooded coal digs. There are very few trails other than old roads with growover.A 2 track some call them.It was bitter cold and I wore 4 sweatshirts,a heavy camo sweatshirt about 3 sizes too big,2 pairs of sweats,apair of thermal longjohns,and a large pair of camo sweats,heavy hunting boots(2inch insulation)over a pair of wool socks and 4 pairs of thermal hunting socks from WallyWorld. And ya know what? It's still cold! I look like the michilin man ran into a mossy oak representative LOL.
I went in a huge downwind circle off the trail and thought I would judge the distance well enough to come out where I had planned. I ended up in an area where they dumped the dirt they dug from all the mines! It was a series of ridges about 30-50 ft high,and there were what seemed to be a mile of them! I wasn't giving up yet. I have slid and fell down many a hill so I'm not new to this.I know when to try to stop. I know the old"Spread your arms and legs" maneuver but that rarely works on an inch of slush/snow/mud! I have learned to just go with the flow like Chris Farhley to avoid and broken bones.LOL I won't step on a hill,slid a bit,and say ,"Ok It's too wet and steep, I'll find another way".Nope,I'm goin' up! I'm coming down too! LOL But that never matters to me. I slipped going up and down every mound in that dirt dump! LOL. After a while,I was tired and weak. Before I got to my planned spot,the sun had broken through and began really slushing things up. As I neared the break in the woods where I planned to sit,I fell through the ice of a ditch and dipped my right leg into a foot of Slush water LOL! That pissed me off bigtime LOL!
Nothing like a slushy frozen foot. I was so pissed I though about dipping the other foot to even things out.HAHAHAAAAAA! But I pressed on. I got to the spot and took some cheap tin snipps and cut a couple limbs off a Shrubb,just enough to squeez into to get a break from the wind.I layed the limbs across my legs and set up my Gun and just rested for a few. 10 minutes tops. I heard some yiping and thought it sounded like a yote. A couple minutes later I seen a black lab chasing some deer. I looked at him with my optics on the rifle and I seen a tattered old red collar.
4 miles from the end of a dirt road,this dog was having fun. I thought it was good that neither the deer or the dog knew I was there. They ran down a game trail right out in front of me about 200 yds. I let the dog carry on and the deer were staying a safe distance ahead. I howled to see if the lab would react.He glanced twords me and resumed chasing the deer. I thought about giving him a warning shot but didn't want to loose my chance at a coyote. They played thier cat & mouse game for a few minutes,then worked away. I howled pretty loud and wondered if I should try to mix in a few distress sounds.I had read that it wouldn't make sense as a coyote wouldn't give a public signal before a kill. I tryed anyways. I gave out a owww owwww owww! And again owww owww owww! Very loud. I was still exausted from the ridge affair. I was still catching my breath. I heard the lab begin barking in the distance and wondered if I should just head for the car as I was hungry as heck. I caught movement from the corner of my eye. It was right on the trail where I usually sit. I had called this hill once before and nothing happened.
Sure enough,it was a short fat coyote moving swiftly through the brush. The brush was about waist high but I could see him clearly. He was taking the trail from the top of the hill to the bottom. He never really stopped,he had some purpose in mind. I got on him with the 32x and the wind kept me from settling too fast on him. I tracked him pretty good and had to have him stop. I'm a great shot but moving isn't my bag. He got directly in front of me at 200 yards crossing right to left on level ground,And I put a circe 3 way I keep on mouse coaxer in my mouth,got on him again and gave a half screech half squeek! It was kinda' frozen up and sounded really bad LOL. He stopped Stared at me for a second,then looked back straight ahead,and was about to continue and I let him have a 45gr.HP to the heart. He froze. I knew it hit him but he didn't react. Then he stood there and wobbled his head looking confused. He turned to nip at the stinging object that was hurting him. He bagan doing the old circle chase. It was just instinct to me that he was in serious pain.So I gave him 3 more quickly to the gereral body.When the fire fight was over.I seen no coyote through my scope. I stayed in stand for a good 15 minutes waiting for other sloppy coyotes to run by or come to my yipes. Nothing showed so I ventured over to see my prize! I stood up and noticed he was smack dab in the middle of another small pond. ![[Mad]](mad.gif)
Water and sub-0 temps,and my high wire abilities don't mix! LOL From where I was sitting,I couldn't see it was a pond. If I would have just waited and got him on the other side.But nooooo,I had to shoot LOL. I made my way to retrieve him. I walked to a circular road/trail and as I was almost to the road,yup, you guessed it,I fell through a ditch covered with snow up to my knee on my left leg LOL. This one hurt! The ice was just hard enough to scrape my leg going in. I used my AR to bash the ice away and free myself. From the angle I had been walking and the cracks in the ice,I broke my leg free pretty easily. Now I was really pissed! Extra chapped.But my feet were even! LOL
Both numb/slushy.
I knew I had better head for the car and get warm.
I paced the shot off at 200 yds or there abouts and was patting myself on the back when I decided I needed to get the coyote from the 50 yd pond. LOL No I didn't try slush walking,LOL. I carry a piece of old clothesline for emergencies in a fannypack with extra binos,junkfood,extra rounds,a cell phone,and what ever I can stuff into it. It was about a 50 ft. piece of rope and I used it to grapple the yote LOL!!!!!!! I wouldn't care if I seen a 18 wheeler drive across that ice, no way jose! I was done dipping for the day.LOLLLLL! It was a nice short fat male. His teethe were barely wisible. I was so far from the car, I gave him the proper brush burrial and headed happily for the car. As I got to the road,I heard a feeding frenzy.Yipes and squeels and coyote babble. It had snowed an inch since I started out and I followed my own tracks back and seen coyote tracks crossing mine. I knew they were not there that morning.Actually I seen several sets. I knew for sure because I seen a coyote track inside my boot print. Buahahahaha! There are more idiots out here! HAHA
My other favorite spot where I had shot 3 from,is where the feeding sounds were coming from.The crows were joining in the fiesta too.
I shoot over that spot from a 30 FT power line mound. It is a series of bottoms that meet in one spot and drain down into a small creek. I creeped up to the top and just enough for my binos to peep over. I seen a bunch of crows up in trees waiting their turn. I gazed over and took another step up and I seen several wild dogs and several coyotes. All battling for a fresh killed doe. There was a coyote who had posession of the doe.They would near it,and be fronted off with a scream and a snap. I took aim and shot for the shoulder. I heard a loud plop! His chest hit the ground he got up and ran in a big circle. All's fun till the lead starts flying! LOL The party was crashed! They all split up and were flat getting it to the nearest bushes.I got on a couple but they never stopped so I let em ride. I knew I would get them eventually anyways LOL. I was frozen and tired. The one I hit, hit the bushes a runnin'! I heard the crashing sounds and knew it was a good hit. I was too cold to go get him.
I was so happy that day! 2 in less than an hour. That night I emptied my AR magazine. I did the unthinkable. I had put 3 FMJ rounds on bottom as I liked to do in case I ran out of HPs.I put 3 hps on top and that was my hunting mag set up. I did the math. I put 4 rds into the first yote and one of them was a FMJ!
And the second 100 yard shoulder hit was a FMJ also. The next day I went looking for the one I hit good. I got out of my car at my normal parking spot,and walked about 25 yds. twords the spot and seen red snow! There layed a big female,a pin hole on the entrance side,and (I'm not exagerating) The exit was big enough to put 2 fists in. Inside the exit I could see the perfect shape of a .224 bullet upright where it had yawed. And then the exit wound took a funnel shape.Small to large. I met a guy there from our State news paper. He asked what the hell shot that! I showed him a .223 round LOL. Not the greatest,but lethal!
Sorry I took so long to reply, I went to the range about 10:oo to break in a new bull bll AR I just slapped together last week. I try to shoot every day. If I don't.I feel cold naked and alone! haha Godda keep my chops up!
Earlier this year, I was invited by a Sports writer from the Ininapolis Star(our Capitol City News paper.) I had no Idea I was gonna' be on the front page of the sports section. ![[Cool]](cool.gif)
Thanks Gang, Jerryboy
[ August 16, 2003, 01:00 PM: Message edited by: jerryboy ]
Posted by varmint101 (Member # 41) on August 18, 2003, 11:40 PM:
There he goes braaagging about that front page of the sports page again. I see you're still at it Jerry! I still love the looks of that gun! Gotta build me one of those some day. School is starting for me this week and believe it or not I'll have more time on my hands!!! Not much longer before our 'season' starts again either. Can't wait!! Take care,
Matt
Posted by jerryboy (Member # 231) on August 19, 2003, 06:01 AM:
Matt, The day you come,will be the day we kill some dogs! My Favorite spot is a callin. I have a slew of new calls to choose from. Take a weekend and we will make a killfest out of it.
I hunt all day or until I am almost frozen to death which ever comes first. I hear guys say there isn't many coyotes here(Hah!) I have a pen pal that says Mo. is even worse! ![[Eek!]](eek.gif)
There is actually 4 State lands all arround me. Within 15 minutes to each on. They are huge too. Theres Schnook(my personal favorite)Cecil M hardin forrest,and 3 others. I'm blessed to have such nice spots. And I'v only seen 2 other guys on any state forrest. Life is sweet. Give me a call 812-201-5462. jerryboy
[ August 19, 2003, 06:06 AM: Message edited by: jerryboy ]
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