The New Huntmastersbbs!: Well, where were you aiming?

This is topic Well, where were you aiming? in forum Optics forum at The New Huntmastersbbs!.

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Posted by Krustyklimber (Member # 72) on July 29, 2005, 08:01 PM:

"Umm, I'm not exactly sure?"

I am no spring chicken anymore, the fat belly I swore "I'd never have" is here, my beard is getting really grey, and I think these suddenly bushy eyebrows are ruining my vision.

I am not sure I can blame the less than stellar perfomance of my rifle, lately, on the rifle.
I think I need some "visual assistance".

There are some aftermarket iron sights, but by the time I buy them, and pay a gunsmith to knock em off and back on, I think I could buy and mount (doing the work myself) some better optics.

My Mosin Nagant isn't well suited to fitting a conventional scope to. But there is a mount made the replaces the rear sight, for using a long eye relief scope, a red dot, or a holosight.

Of the three, scout scope, red dot, or holosight, which would you choose and why?

Is a red dot going to be a small enough aim point, at say 150 yds?

Is parallax a big issue with LER scopes?

Is a holosight so much cooler, it's worth the price?

Thanks.

Krusty

[ July 29, 2005, 08:02 PM: Message edited by: Krustyklimber ]

Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on July 29, 2005, 08:10 PM:

Go with the forward mounted scope, unless you plan on shots inside 50 yards, or so. The holosite is a great setup for a shotgun, and you see a lot of red dots on handguns. Just my personal opinion.

Good hunting. LB

Posted by Krustyklimber (Member # 72) on August 03, 2005, 07:23 PM:

Gee, did I ask this on the wrong board?

Thanks for your input Leonard.

Krusty

Posted by Krustyklimber (Member # 72) on September 01, 2005, 06:23 PM:

Okay, I have been saving up, well I did a bunch of extra work.

I dunno if I can ever afford a good quality scope, the holo-sight is just as far out of reach.

Here's what I decided to do for now;
I ordered the B-Square scope mount, and one of these.

It's a Super-Bright Laser Sight, $29.99 at Cabela's. It should give me a reliable enough point of aim that I can finish trying to work up a load, and see if this rifle is actually worth putting better optics on.
I still can't put a 5 shot group on an eight inch pie plate at 100 yds, with hunting bullets.

Down the road, if the rifle deserves one, I'd like to get one of these.

It's TRU-GLO's 2x30mm Red Dot, $79.99 also at Cabela's.
I feel like it fits my needs. It has unlimited eye relief, 2x magnification is about all I really need, the red dot should be an advantage in the dark timber and gloomy days we have around here.

Krusty

Posted by Melvin (Member # 634) on September 01, 2005, 10:53 PM:

Krusty,if thats the best you can group with that rifle,you should consider saleing it..Sale the gun,keep the money for the scope and invest in something that will shoot...with what you got,you probably would be better off with a pocket full of fire crackers. [Smile]

Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on September 02, 2005, 07:34 PM:

K, a laser is not easy to pick up in bright sunshine. Works great at night....on a handgun? At close range.

Good hunting. LB

Posted by Krustyklimber (Member # 72) on September 03, 2005, 12:01 AM:

Melvin,

I do not believe this is the best I can do with this rifle. I'll hang onto it for a while longer, and see if I can't do better.

Selling my $75 rifle, and adding the $50 I just spent, wouldn't have put me very much closer to owning a "real rifle" with a quality scope on it.

I'd rather own a crappy rifle, than a dream of a great one. [Smile]

I bought a tough, old, reliable, battleaxe of a rifle, for a reason.

I'm beginning to wonder about the validity of the advice that lead me here. But we often feel lost until we actually reach our destination, even though we're on the right path all along. [Wink]

Leonard,

Thanks, we were wondering what other uses we could have for a fun toy like the laser sight... BB gun, 22lr, the crossbow.

I have heard you can get a bobcat to chase the light right into your lap.

Red's .357 might be a good place for it?

I already ordered it, so I might as well try it. [Wink]

(*we do have a couple places we can shoot at night, and cloudy days aren't hard to come by here)

The scope mount was the most important "next step" I needed to make, I can always upgrade the optics later.

Krusty

Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on September 03, 2005, 11:21 AM:

The pictures you show have a grooved receiver mount, for use with a 22 rimfire. I doubt that your mil. surplus rifle has that type of receiver; you need to have it drilled and tapped for a one or two piece mount, because you need two rings to secure a scope properly.

I have heard of the bobcat chasing the laser thing. I wouldn't count on it, and think it is mostly an urban legend, although lots of people have had their pet chase a laser around on the carpet in the living room.

You will read a lot of advice where they suggest that you buy the best glass you can afford, or wait until you can afford it. These people mean well, but just can't relate to a financial situation where discretionary funds aren't available in vast amounts. It is valid advice, but if you don't have the money; quite useless.

However, you should show appreciation for all well intended advice, even if they can't visualize your price range.

I don't know what to tell you, either? Buy a cheap Bushnel or Tasco scope, and if it breaks, you are not out a lot of money, but if it works reasonably well, at least you are up to speed except under severe conditions.

Good luck, LB

Posted by Krustyklimber (Member # 72) on September 03, 2005, 04:33 PM:

Leonard,

I didn't mean any disrespect, I really do appreciate any advice I am given, even if I chose not to follow it.

I rarely go about a project in "one fell swoop", but slowly, step by step, work my way to the finish.

No drilling or tapping is necessary to mount the Weaver type scout scope mount I ordered, I should be able to do the work myself.

I thought the laser sight would fit that base. [Confused]

Worst case, I have to return it, and keep saving.
Best case, it'll provide a good enough point of aim, that I can sort this rifle out (and then keep the laser as a "fun toy").

Most sporterized M-N's are set up as scout rifles, especially the carbines.
Because the action is "open lug" (I think ya call it), like a Mauser, it requires a sidemounted base and considerable inletting of the stock, for traditional placement of the scope.
Not only does the action load best from straight above the stiffly sprung magazine (stripper clips actually help), but it ejects straight out the top as well.
Top that off with a bolt handle that opens at 12 o'clock, and too much modification is required (for me), for too little gain.

Hey, this thing still shoots better than the Mini-14, so I don't feel bad at all.

Krusty

Posted by Krustyklimber (Member # 72) on September 07, 2005, 08:03 PM:

A switch in powder, from H4350 to H4198, and shimming the action to float the barrel, made a huge improvement.

I feel confident I could put eight of ten shots in an eight inch circle, at 155 yds, sitting on the ground with my elbows on my knees... because I did it.

The scope can wait, I'm goin' huntin'. [Big Grin]

Krusty

Posted by Alaska Dave (Member # 565) on September 11, 2005, 03:36 PM:

Krust, if you run into any more problems with that rifle try duck tape, worked for me.

Posted by Krustyklimber (Member # 72) on September 12, 2005, 10:01 PM:

Dave,

Duck tape? Is that something I play in my e-caller to attract waterfowl?

Welcome to HuntMasters (if Leonard didn't already say so).

Krusty

Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on September 12, 2005, 10:11 PM:

Oops, how did I miss this? Welcome to the New Huntmasters, Alaska Dave from SE Wisconson. Glad to have you on board.

Good hunting. LB

Posted by Todd Woodall (Member # 439) on September 14, 2005, 12:15 AM:

Hey Krusty, The lasers work fine at night, but we havnt found a day that they would show up well. Another point to ponder is that we bought a cheap one to play with first. It did well and stayed on target until the recoil of the first shot, after that it would jump off target. This is evident in our second video. Make sure you mount it solid and check it often. I wouldnt want to consider it my primary sight to say the least. Like Leonard said a cheap scope is better than alot of the alternatives. I realize the money conscern, but a cheap scope is pretty inexpensive and can easily be secured on a weaver base. I wish you well.

Take care,

Todd

Posted by Krustyklimber (Member # 72) on September 14, 2005, 12:56 PM:

Todd,

Thanks, more facts will help me make a better decision.
And I definitely don't have enough facts of my own yet.

Like I said before I have never looked through a red dot, a holosight, or a scope with an illuminated reticle. I am lost, and at the mercy of the ad writers.

Most fall and winter days here, like today, are full overcast.
In the middle of winter, daylight only lasts about 8 hrs, with the Sun flying low on the southern horizon like an all day sunset.

For larger animals, like deer, elk, and bears, I wouldn't use or need a scope.
I just don't feel like I could hit a coyote sized critter (especially once facing straight at me), every time, where I am supposed to, with the iron sights that are on my rifle today.
Missing ANOTHER coyote is not acceptable, I WILL NOT shoot at one if I have any doubt (which I do).

I went shooting yesterday, and am just short of having put 200 rounds through this gun.
I am still not used to it, the way I am my shotgun, so some improvements can still be made there.

Shooting at the pit, I have the advantage of "walking in" my shots (often with some adjustment of my battle sights), then repeating that.

I don't have that same option when calling.

Krusty

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