This is topic How is the component supply situation? in forum Firearms forum at The New Huntmastersbbs!.
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Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on October 09, 2024, 08:49 AM:
Not a very catchy title and i'm not sure even, since I can't mail order any of this shit from Natchez anyway?
But I got their flier a day or two ago and I always thumb through it to see where the prices are heading.
It's my opinion that HazMat fees are bogus and the cost isn't justified but I'm one little guy, all I can do is bitch about it.
But, what got my attention is PRIMERS! What the hell is going on? First, on page 13 we have an abundance of variety, things available that I have not seen before like military primers from CCI. Also from Magtech and Fiocchi, which I hardly ever see advertised?
Anyway, just to take one category, large rifle primers/per 1,000
Winchester large rifle $74.99
CCI large rifle $84.99Remington
Remington large rifle $89.99
Federal Champion $89.99
Fed. Gold Medal large rifle Match $119.99
and Fiocchi sells 1,500 $121.99, which would be
$81.32 per thousand
Actually, almost the only primer I use is the Federal Gold Medal Match , which is the most expensive listed.
but, to be contrary, I use Winchester large rifle in 300WinMag.
and I use Remington large rifle 9 1/2 in 6mmRemington
Otherwise, it's the Federal Match primer for everything. I mainly stock only Federal and Remington and I do not use a Magnum primer in 300WM, I stick to the same load for at least the last 30 years, so it seems to work for me. You know, why change what works?
So, this is more than you ever needed to know but for some reason, the ammo panic seems to be loosening up. My mail order is non existent here in the People's Republic of Kalifornia. Yes, I can order powder and pay the Hazmat fee, but mostly, I have to buy off the shelf locally, ammo and components.
Good hunting. El Bee
Posted by Kokopelli (Member # 633) on October 09, 2024, 10:36 AM:
It's just the cost of doing what we do .......... ![[Eek!]](eek.gif)
And if Kamalala gets the win (fix) it ain't gonna get no better so you might as well bite the bullet and stock up now while you can.
Posted by UTcaller (Member # 8) on October 09, 2024, 10:45 AM:
I’ve found most of what I need. With the exception of Lapua brass in .22-250 …. Wish I had bought 1000 pcs. When I bought my last 200 pcs. 15 years ago…..
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on October 09, 2024, 11:03 AM:
Speaking of Lapua brass.
I have noticed in some cartridges, that Nosler is even more $ price wise than Lapua. I have some Nosler brass in 300WM that is absolutely gorgeous! I would easily compare it to Lapua. For all I know, maybe it is made by Lapua, but with the Nosler headstamp? All I know is that it is perfection. I haven't loaded it yet!
Good hunting. El Bee
Posted by UTcaller (Member # 8) on October 09, 2024, 12:18 PM:
I think it is made by Norma. Could be wrong but I thought I saw that somewhere. Which is great brass too….
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on October 09, 2024, 08:24 PM:
Interesting! Years ago, I could only get Norma brass for 220Swift. Never cared for it. It always had a more coppery tint. Swift always has to be trimmed to length, but when I finally got some WW cases, It "seemed" to be quite a bit less brass flow. Anyway, I haven't used any Norma brass in years.
Good hunting. El Bee
Posted by UTcaller (Member # 8) on October 09, 2024, 08:55 PM:
I usually try to get Lapua for the cartridges they make it for. But can’t get it for my .204 Ruger so I have been using the Norma brass for it seems to be good consistent brass. Not like Lapua but good enough.
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on October 11, 2024, 09:01 AM:
Yeah, I understand your reasoning, Chad. I'll tell you, talking about cartridge brass is opening a can of worms, for some folks. They all hav their axe to grind, be it Federal, WW or Remington, but never LAPUA, which is what God uses!
My personal, not thrilled about, brass is Federal. I've used Remington and Winchester lots of times in many applications and I can't really harp on any of them, like the comments I see all the time:
Quote; "X" brand is shit! Never use it, it's no good for anything, I'd never use it in any firearm I own and advise everybody to stay away from that JUNK!
Well, I cannot get that emotional about any maker of brass. At one time I stayed away from Starline, just because it was relatively new. I stared buying it when my favorite brand was unavailable and subsequently find out that everybody loves the shit! I was only ten years behind the curve. I've never used Hornady, don't know if they make it themselves, or just some of it?
When it comes to brass, price is a factor in handgun brass. In most rifle chamberings, it's quality and consistency, I really don't care much about the price. Now, why do I care when a large percentage of my shooting is hunting and predators, not targets. I don't have a logical answer except I require confidence, I have done all I can to use the best most accurate ammunition possible. And, of course, that's handloads.
This latest trend to buy custom loaded ammunition from Federal, the only one that comes to mind, it's not as good as what I make myself and that's it. Maybe for some that don't know what they are doing, yeah, go ahead and pay those premium prices for custom loaded ammunition, maybe it will boost their confidence?
That's it, sorry to ramble.
Good hunting. El Bee
Good hunting. El Bee
Posted by UTcaller (Member # 8) on October 11, 2024, 11:28 AM:
Yeah it is funny how you get stuff in your head. I never cared for Federal or Hornady brass either. I have shot and like both Remington and Winchester brass for a lot of years. But like you said God’s brass is Lapua so when I can get it I buy it.
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on October 11, 2024, 05:50 PM:
You know, when it comes to paying a hundred bucks for 20 rounds of custom loaded ammunition, that's the point where a man aught to get his ass in gear and start loading his own ammunition!
Just right off the top of my head, I bet Federal doesn't sort the brass in any method, be it internal capacity, or just going by weight, which is easy but doesn't accomplish very much, in my opinion.
Anyway, if a man isn't satisfied with just buying a specific lot number and hoping it's all sorta the same and therefore he reasons that it must be more accurate than random boxes. But then he doesn't have the advantage of the fireforming in his own chamber and reloading those valuable empty brass; I mean, what a waste of the resource!
I could go on, but I believe that any man that hunts with a centerfire rifle should do himself a huge favor and do his own handloading! It's a friggin' no brainer! If you go out and buy a serious rifle, you are making a significant mistake in not hadloading for that rifle. It's like common sense!
It must be a stigma of some kind? They are scared, or intimidated because they just don't know what it's about, or it involves details that they don't want to bother with. Well OK, but don't boogie out there are think you are going to ring steel at a thousand yards and blasting away with factory ammunition. That's like having one arm tied behind your back, if you think about it. The name of the game is accuracy and accuracy starts with handloads. Sorry! If you aren't loading your own ammunition, you are making a serious mistake....that's just the way it is, period!
Got carried away, sorry for the rant!
Good hunting. El Bee
Posted by TA17Rem (Member # 794) on October 11, 2024, 06:53 PM:
i use Lapua in my 20x47 Lapua, Nosler in other cartridges and win. and Rem.
Primers anything that's BR standards.
Posted by TA17Rem (Member # 794) on October 12, 2024, 07:53 AM:
New kid on the block "Alpha munitions" 6mm Dasher small rifle primers. Also, ADG brass for the long-range shooters PRC 7mm Mag. just name a few.
New gun smith that really knows his shit and pays attention to detail and also affordable "Apex Custom rifles" He is a full-time chiropractor and rebuilds and fixes rifles in spare time. He collects lays and end mills and rebuilds them to use. Do a search on Net or Facebook for apex custom rifles. He makes some nice builds from what I seen very good and nice guy as well and a shooter on PRC range.
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on October 13, 2024, 10:07 AM:
Well, the secret to accurate rifles has been known for many years. It's the same knowledge involved in fabricating Swiss watches, for example. It's accuracy and workmanship to tight tolerances.
So it is discipline and the ability to hold tight tolerances. Anybody can build an accurate rifle for themselves because they are careful about the details. It's when you start manufacturing thousands of rifles for the man that doesn't do it for himself and wouldn't know the difference anyway.
So, if you devote the time and the attention to detail and you understand that "Time is money" then you can turn out a product that will be successful and will sell and you can make a profit doing it. No secret, if you have the talent and knowledge.
And, by the way, this stage of the game with digital machines, called CNC, you almost take a large part of the CRAFTSMANSHIP out of the equation. These machines will hold accuracy to insane tolerances. The talent is designing a program then push a button and the machine will spit out a barrel and action that is more accurate than the human shooter and at that point, knowledge of shooting skills comes into play, doping wind and control of heartbeat and pulse rate ....shit like that. That's the art and craft of accuracy when you have a well crafted instrument in your hands. The rest is not much mystery, it's talent and discipline. Some got it, some don't.
Another thing to consider. I will use my friend as an example, a knowledgeable benchrest shooter that is talented in the fabrication of accurate ammunition. The problem is; he is a deplorable shot on game! He chokes. Some people can't do it, unfortunately.
Good hunting. El Bee
Posted by TA17Rem (Member # 794) on October 13, 2024, 11:01 AM:
But if a gun smith is using a reamer with too many miles on it the job can be wasted, and you end with a just so so rifle. accuracy is important all the way around and not just in ammo or shooter. What I like is I can get a certain rifle and shoot factory ammo in it that shoots as well as home spun ammo, that happens then you got hell of a nice rifle in your hands.
My last rebarrel job shoots so well with factory ammo I may not reload for it.
Posted by UTcaller (Member # 8) on October 13, 2024, 12:11 PM:
What is this Factory Ammo you speak of? I haven’t shot factory ammo in any of my rifles in 30+ years. Except my 17 HMR……
Never even thought about it.
Posted by TA17Rem (Member # 794) on October 13, 2024, 02:12 PM:
[ October 13, 2024, 02:21 PM: Message edited by: TA17Rem ]
Posted by TA17Rem (Member # 794) on October 13, 2024, 02:20 PM:
i needed new brass for ackley couldnt find any at time. nephew got me factory ammo that shoots nice clover leaf groups. so whats not to like. HSM made dam good ammo for the 221 f.b.
Posted by UTcaller (Member # 8) on October 13, 2024, 02:56 PM:
I always stock up on good brass for the guns I shoot. I have enough Lapua brass for two+ barrels in .22-250AI. And most of my guns are either obsolete or wild cats so I don’t even look at factory ammo in the store. I
Posted by TA17Rem (Member # 794) on October 13, 2024, 03:26 PM:
i put alot of rounds through old ackley. Never thought I'd have to rebarrel, plus I shoot 22-250's as well
Posted by UTcaller (Member # 8) on October 14, 2024, 03:08 AM:
I’m lucky I bought lots of Lapua .22-250 brass,RL-15 powder,CCI BR 2 primers and Bergers bullets. I Don’t have to waste my money on inferior factory Ammo. I like consistency, I guess I’m weird that way.😉
[ October 14, 2024, 03:11 AM: Message edited by: UTcaller ]
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on October 14, 2024, 08:41 AM:
The problem with factory ammunition is, okay you buy what is reputed to be accurate stuff and use it and now you have to buy a different lot number and now what?
Look at the gun magazines. They test accuracy with factory ammo. And then they list the results and some of it shoots and some of it doesn't. Let's say you have a rifle that seems to love Federal "Summit". Oh, and you bought a lot of it. When that's gone 1 or 2 years down the road, do you buy the same stuff? Or do you do like the gun mags do, and purchase 4 different brands and recognizing that barrel life in not infinite, you are again in the exploration mode?
I just don't get it? If you hand load, when you have your "LOAD" that's it! As long as you can get the same components you are good for as long as your barrel lasts.
I think that shooting factory ammunition is first, expensive and second, you are hostage to supply, which can dry up. And, now you will be buying something more like buying a lottery ticket! Even if you purchase quantity, it will run out and what are you going to do with your fireformed empty brass? Throw it away?
Everything, all factors leads me to conclude that hand loading for your own needs is smart, economical and logical. The factory ammunition argument makes zero sense to me!
Good hunting. El Bee
edit:
PS I admit that nickel brass is all shiny and dazzling and doesn't tarnish even if kept in leather belt loops. So, it's great for handgun cartridges, But do not buy it for your 243Winchester! You cant, or shouldn't trim the necks or ream them because it will chip and in the first place, it will dull your cutting tool. Inside or outside neck turning is out of the question, so this is what makes plain brass cases so utilitarian, the ability to work the brass and ream it and trim to length, it's just a lot more servicable.
[ October 14, 2024, 08:51 AM: Message edited by: Leonard ]
Posted by TA17Rem (Member # 794) on October 18, 2024, 05:18 PM:
I have plenty of other guns to shoot. Nephew gave me some factory loads and I like how they shoot, doubt reload be any better. I'll shoot the stuff up and reload the fireformed brass. no big whoop.
Posted by TA17Rem (Member # 794) on October 18, 2024, 05:19 PM:
Just got home and had two packages on table. One had set of match dies for the 204 and got rechargeable battery pack for the Duck.
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