This is topic 223 ACKLEY IMPROVED in forum Firearms forum at The New Huntmastersbbs!.
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Posted by UTcaller (Member # 8) on January 27, 2003, 07:12 AM:
Just want alittle input on this caliber.I have a Thompson Contender carbine with 221 fireball barrel,fun caliber but not enough gun for my way of calling coyotes.So I thought I would get the AI barrel as a back up rig for my 22-250.It looks as if you can get the AI to shoot pretty close(Ballistically)to the 22-250 rem.
What I am wondering is some of the other pro's and con's to the AI.Plus I need some reloading info to get started.Thanks for any input you can give....GOOD HUNTING Chad..... ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
Posted by DAA (Member # 11) on January 27, 2003, 07:49 AM:
I don't have one, yet. But I'm going to have one probably in time for next years coyote hunting. The .223AI will run not too far behind the .22-250, as you noted. But does it with a lot less powder.
The mechanical advantages of the AI design, less brass flow, less bolt thrust etc..., are well known and have been talked about many times.
Really, for a pure predator rifle, I don't think it has any advantages over the .22-250. Because, while it will run "close" to the .22-250, it sure as hell won't run "with" the .22-250. The advantages, to my mind, don't come into play until you start talking about high volume shooting and loading. Then the greater efficiency and use of less powder, the lesser bulk and weight of the loaded ammo and components, the reduced barrel heat and barrel wear, the lower recoil and muzzle blast, all of these things start to take on significance. But for a dedicated predator rifle, none of these things mean diddly-poo, if you ask me. I'd take the extra 200 fps of the .22-250 over all of that in a heartbeat, for calling coyotes. But of course, I also believe whole-heartedly that "just wanting" one is more than enough justification to get one ![[Smile]](smile.gif)
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- DAA
Posted by UTcaller (Member # 8) on January 27, 2003, 08:30 AM:
Thanks for the info Dave.Yeah,I agree about the 22-250,great rifle and I love mine.Like I said I just want a back up rifle for my 22-250.And about the most I can get for my contender(carbine)in 22 caliber is 223 AI.Once my 22-250 barrel goes I think I will chamber it in 22-250 AI.Thanks for the info GOOD HUNTING Chad.....
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on January 27, 2003, 11:57 AM:
These questions are a little hard to answer, mainly because of the wide divergence in mission.
For general use, in Utah, or most western states, for that matter, the 22-250 is a good choice.
I know a few people that own everything, and can still see the nitch where a 223 Ackley will fit in. Generally, the reasons are limited distances, and fur considerations and noise. Usually, the performance they like to talk about is 50 grain bullets in the 223 versus 55s in the 22-250. This, in itself is a clear distinction, as to the fitness of the chambering, for the concept. As with many other comparisons, you need to move up the scale before you see the benefit of the higher capacity case. This is one reason why I like to use 65 grain bullets in my 22-250 Ackley. With 55 grain bullets, in some guns, it is hard to show a real gain in performance.
But, for converting a maginal 223 Remington into a more reliable performer, this starts to get my attention. And, I don't mean by punching an existing barrel. (another)But, if you have a shot out barrel on an action with a small boltface, this is a very worthwhile consideration.
Good hunting. LB
Posted by Rich Higgins (Member # 3) on January 27, 2003, 01:56 PM:
Chad, since you are going be chambering a Contender barrel for your backup rifle and you cannot chamber a Contender for a 22-250 you are left with two very good cartridges that will equal the 22-250 in performance. My 226 JDJ with 22 in barrel pushes a 50 gr. Nosler BT to 3850 with 35 gr of 4064 and into 1/2 MOA. Mike Bellm told me that he is getting 3800 with a 50 gr. bullet out of an 18 in barrel chambered for the 222 Mag AI. That one sounds interesting to me.
Posted by UTcaller (Member # 8) on January 27, 2003, 02:24 PM:
Leonard,and Rich thanks for the replies.Rich both of the calibers you mention sound interesting to me,I need to do alittle more homework I guess before I make my decision.Reason I chose the 223 AI was
1)availablity of ammo to fire form
2)it's close ballistics to a 22-250 rem.
3)Thompson's custom shop has them for reasonable price.
4)want a good coyote killer in a light carrying rifle(contender carbine)
Thanks again for the reply's GOOD HUNTING Chad.....
Posted by Rich Higgins (Member # 3) on January 27, 2003, 03:57 PM:
Chad, while on the subject, Tyler and I both have 22 in 223 barrels on our calling rifles (Contenders) and have never felt the need for more gun. The vast majority of our shots are well inside 100 yards, but I have taken some out at 300+ and one at better than 400. With the scope sighted 1 in high at 100, we hold on hair out to about 250. The 400 yard shot can be considered a scratch shot since I had to hold about 2 feet over and I would hate to have to try to repeat that shot consistantly. What is important to know is that the Sierra #1365 bullet performed beautifully, as always,and laid it out properly. I honestly cannot remember ever losing a coyote with my 223 and that bullet and have never felt the need to improve it. If I know I am going to be shooting at extreme range or in high wind I have a 22-250AI, a couple of 6s, a couple of 25s. I hunted 1 full year exclusively with a 338 Win Mag. Took a lot of coyotes with it. I still would take the 223 nine times out of ten.
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on January 27, 2003, 04:17 PM:
yes, and Rich hunts bears with a switch.
There you go, an honest difference of opinion. It's your choice. LB
Posted by UTcaller (Member # 8) on January 27, 2003, 05:15 PM:
Rich,I do have a 223 21" barrel that I like to shoot on my thompson,and you're right they will definitely do the job on the coyotes.I think I was just wanting that little extra energy,speed and flat shooting possibilities.I would say my shots vary alot from 50-300 yards so I want to cover those ranges consistantly,that's why I mostly use my 22-250 for coyotes.For cats,and foxes I use my 221 fireball(22" Thompson contender barrel) with 40 grain bullets.
Thanks for all your input Rich,it is really appreciated.GOOD HUNTING Chad......
Posted by 20t-n-t (Member # 46) on January 28, 2003, 11:37 PM:
I must be crazy and the only one here to shoot the Tact-20?? I don't know why? Its a tack driver, its easy to load for and kills them dead, dead. its a .223 case necked down to 20 cal. with no other changes. It spits that 36 grain Berger bullet out at over 4100 fps and will drop a coyote like a bad habbit. 400 yard shots are very doable with consistancy. I think you guys would be impressed with the chambering, I sure as hell am a beliver, I've seen it at work, not only will it compete with the 22-250 but it shoots flatter and faster with a smaller hole.
Thats my 2 cents
Slydog
Posted by Jerry Rice (Member # 78) on February 02, 2003, 01:55 PM:
If you have a small bolt face rifle it is one of the best rounds out there!! I have two of them and no they aer not 22-250's bur the one I built for my grandkids has a 22" barrel and it drives a Sierra 50 gr. Blitz King at 3540 fps but it is a single shot, XP100, the other one I set up for coyotes, Rem model 700, but I have not gotten the fire forming done yet but both rifles are one hole rifles.
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on February 02, 2003, 03:13 PM:
Well, Hi Jerry! It's been a while.
Folks, I had the privilege of inspecting some of the guns built by Jerry Rice. He does a fine job.
You can engage him in your project here:
nor-cal@worldnet.att.net
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on September 30, 2005, 12:12 AM:
Some projects take a while to fruition.
(don't get sucked in, note the date)
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