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Author
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Topic: Am I doing this right?
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grayman
Knows what it's all about
Member # 822
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posted March 25, 2006 10:37 PM
So,
We were out again for a night of hunting and I am calling away on my lil'dog. Suddenly the thought comes to me, "Am I doing this right?".
Been doing mostly, what I believe to be jack and cotton distress as well as howling.
The problem is I do not know if I am missing out on Coyote because I am not doing it right. I got the DvD with my lil'dog but the sound on it sucks because he keeps blasting the mic.
So what I am asking is, does anyone know of a good wqeb page to hear the sounds on, or perhaps know of a good way to compare what I am doing with actual sounds so I can see if I am even close?
-Grayman
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Posts: 46 | From: West Valley City, Utah | Registered: Mar 2006
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted March 26, 2006 03:36 AM
The coyotes will tell you. LB
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 32361 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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RedRabbit
Knows what it's all about
Member # 796
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posted March 26, 2006 06:31 AM
greyman, get the Ed Sceery video it has the sounds of live coyotes as well as demontrations and interpretations, it comes with the Sceery howler, but what the hell, it works and really helped me get started, also Mastering the Arts video will help you to if you dont mind William interfering with his flamboyant personality. He's all sales.
Posts: 241 | From: SE IDAHO | Registered: Jan 2006
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TRnCO
FUTURE HALL OF FAMER
Member # 690
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posted March 26, 2006 08:22 AM
You could buy just about any one of the calling videos on the market and pick up on the general idea of what you're trying to sound like. There's no magic sound, BUT some sounds work better than others and you need to have good/excited cadence, no matter what sound you use.
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Is it hunting season yet? I hate summer!
Posts: 996 | From: Elizabeth, CO | Registered: Aug 2005
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TheHuntedOne
Knows what it's all about
Member # 623
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posted March 26, 2006 08:25 AM
This is a page that has sounds recored by a call maker that you can listen too. He's a pretty good caller (IMO) and should give you a starting point anyway.
Varmint Al used to have some sounds on his page too. I forget the address but a Google search on VarmintAl will get you there I am sure.
Sounds
Al
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The On Line Resource For Custom Call Makers
THO Game Calls
Posts: 266 | From: New Hampshire | Registered: Mar 2005
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grayman
Knows what it's all about
Member # 822
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posted March 26, 2006 09:09 AM
Thaks everyone
-Grayman
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Posts: 46 | From: West Valley City, Utah | Registered: Mar 2006
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Krustyklimber
prefers the bunny hugger pronunciation: ky o tee
Member # 72
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posted March 26, 2006 09:40 AM
Grayman,
Try findsounds.com also try Western Rivers and here's Varmint Al's.
It's my opinion, that the (distress) sound you make and "how well you make it" is just not important, howling might be different (in that you are "speaking their language") and you have to say the right thing at the right time.
But any ol' "whaa whaa" will do.
Krusty 
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Think about how stupid the average person is, then realize that half of them are stupider than that!
Posts: 1912 | From: Deep in the Blue Ridge Mountains of Virginia | Registered: Jan 2003
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Cdog911
"There are some ideas so absurd only an intellectual could believe them."--George Orwell.
Member # 7
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posted March 26, 2006 09:52 AM
Krusty make a valid point. The distress sounds you make matter inasmuch as they need to have despair and urgency. The more dramatic, the better it seems. To the coyote, they understand what is being said in those "waah-waahs" no better than you or me. They just hear the sound and react.
Howling is another matter altogether. You really need to have a pretty good idea of what the sounds sound like and their proper application. And that can mean not only on any given stand, but how time of the year effects their effectiveness.
More importantly, realize that calling success is determined, by only a small part, by the sounds you employ. Far and away, most stands are ruined long before you even blow on a call. Your approach, setup, and conduct on the stand are critical to success. Furthermore, and I am convinced of this, how you leave a setup will determine, in large part, how that stand produces in the future. Leave the stand with as much care and stealth as you entered. You just don't know who's watching you.
Good luck.
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I am only one. But still, I am one. I cannot do everything, but still, I can do something; and, because I cannot do everything, I will not refuse to do something that I can do.
Posts: 5440 | From: The gun-lovin', gun-friendly wild, wild west | Registered: Jan 2003
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Krustyklimber
prefers the bunny hugger pronunciation: ky o tee
Member # 72
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posted March 26, 2006 10:49 AM
Lance,
I was just passing on what I've been told, (mostly) because I was suprised nobody else had brought it up.
A sound that I have found to be pretty productive (by my own use, and others using it on their e-callers) isn't a real animal at all (or any that I know of)... it's just a raucous birdlike distress I came up with, "just to be way different" and get away from the same old tired rabbit blues (these overcalled coyotes, around here, have already heard).
With howling, I find myself doing it too much, and not very well, so I try to remind myself to use it very sparingly.
Watching videos, and listening to "all the experts", will likely only confuse you (like it has me).
My advice on howling is, don't do it if you can help it. Sometimes, I can't help myself.
But I am like you, I really wonder if I am doing it right, at all?
Coyotes in your area are "experts", I think you might have it worse than me, you're gonna have to be a virtuoso to fool them. ![[Wink]](wink.gif)
Krusty
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Think about how stupid the average person is, then realize that half of them are stupider than that!
Posts: 1912 | From: Deep in the Blue Ridge Mountains of Virginia | Registered: Jan 2003
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grayman
Knows what it's all about
Member # 822
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posted March 26, 2006 11:16 AM
HEH!
Setting up is not too hard for my regular hunting prtner and myself. He is ex-special forces and I was a tabbed sniper. We know how to be stealthy in and out.
Of course with our lack of luck we tend to laugh a bit about us sneaking up for nothing but what you going to do, right?
The calls really are the problem with us so far. We had a coyote out about 1 klik and it would not come in for anything. That is what prompted my wondering. Though it was fun setting up my .308 and taking a shot at 1 klik, maybe I should have sighted in more recently. Went just under him.
-Grayman
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Posts: 46 | From: West Valley City, Utah | Registered: Mar 2006
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RedRabbit
Knows what it's all about
Member # 796
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posted March 26, 2006 11:51 AM
I dont know if your problem is the same as mine, but I find myself being too cautious when getting into an area where I know coyotes are hanging out. What usally happens is I call them up they come and stop and won't come any closer I noticed this several times I figured it was their territorial boundry and they seem to honor it most of the time. It wasn't till I got right into their turf that I got them to come right in, but that turf is where you have to be careful.
Posts: 241 | From: SE IDAHO | Registered: Jan 2006
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grayman
Knows what it's all about
Member # 822
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posted March 26, 2006 11:58 AM
HEH!
You know you might be right. I should have thought about them having a perimiter. Thanks for the kick in the mental pants Red.
-Grayman
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Posts: 46 | From: West Valley City, Utah | Registered: Mar 2006
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RedRabbit
Knows what it's all about
Member # 796
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posted March 26, 2006 10:34 PM
Now build you one of these and come in from where they didnt hear you last.
 
[ March 26, 2006, 10:36 PM: Message edited by: RedRabbit ]
Posts: 241 | From: SE IDAHO | Registered: Jan 2006
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grayman
Knows what it's all about
Member # 822
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posted March 26, 2006 10:46 PM
HeH!
I was a tabbed sniper in the Army. Making a Ghillie Suit comes second nature to me. I have 4 and am working on my 5th one. Winter sage is not as easy as it sounds.
Generally though I am just all about my OD greens.
Call me old fashioned.
-Grayman
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Posts: 46 | From: West Valley City, Utah | Registered: Mar 2006
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RedRabbit
Knows what it's all about
Member # 796
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posted March 26, 2006 11:43 PM
I would like to build me another one, but this one was patterned after my Natural Gear cammo minus the garnish I tried to blend in various desert tones using my own dyed jute to get a blended callico look to be some what universal it was fun to build, but it really burned me out.
Winter sage huh? that would have alot of grey highlighted with a seafoam green and pearl grey Rit dye combination lightly bathed in hot water. That be something to play with.
Posts: 241 | From: SE IDAHO | Registered: Jan 2006
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grayman
Knows what it's all about
Member # 822
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posted March 27, 2006 01:00 AM
Hey red,
Are you using the really light jute or the heavy jute you have to take apart?
-Grayman
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Posts: 46 | From: West Valley City, Utah | Registered: Mar 2006
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted March 27, 2006 08:44 AM
Looks like Susquatch, especially the blurred facial features.
This is friendly advice, not trying to bust your bubble.
I don't know how to tell ya, but coyote hunting doesn't involve a lot of playing Army.
70 pound backpacks? That's the first time I heard of someone hunting coyotes with that much gear. What (exactly) is "tabbed" relating to sniper? Describe your 308 sniper rig for us.
Ghillie suits. Hunting coyotes is much different than hunting humans. The suits are hot, very hot in warm weather. They snag on all manor of thorn, and a lot of debris sticks to them, everything from tumbleweeds to cactus to just twigs and other vegetation. That jute stuff can flop down in your face, between you and the scope. Working the action of the rifle is sure to get some of that yarn caught in the bolt or the bolt handle; sooner or later.
Here's the main thing, (Bulletin) you don't need it! Any idea how many coyotes are killed every year without any camo, at all?
Good hunting. LB
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 32361 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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DAA
Utah/Promoted WESTERN REGIONAL Hunt Director
Member # 11
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posted March 27, 2006 09:37 AM
There were a lot of reasons I only used my ghillie once or twice (after spending who knows how many hours making it). Leonard covered most of them. But one very important reason, he left out. That damn jute catches fire pretty easy. And I like to smoke cigars while I'm coyote hunting. No way I'm going to smoke a cigar wearing my ghillie though!
- DAA
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"Oh yeah, they're gonna talk to you, and talk to you, and talk to you about individual freedom, but they see a free individual, it's gonna scare 'em." -- George Hanson, Easy Rider, 1969.
Rocky Mountain Varmint Hunter
Posts: 2676 | From: Salt Lake City, UT | Registered: Jan 2003
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RedRabbit
Knows what it's all about
Member # 796
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posted March 27, 2006 09:42 AM
Grayman, I used both the unwoven stuff from ghillie Suits.com and I took apart burlap bags. mine has about 7 lbs of jute on it and its just a converted desert BDU into a poncho and the hat is a boonie. I didn't buy the dyed stuff since I was going desert the natural jute worked fine for most of the blend.
Leonard,
When my boy took the photo from my cell phone camera I didn't expect it would come out that way it looks cool though, but heres a break down reply about ghillies.
1. They are used in some circles as an aid in photography of wild animals.
2.Its true they do snag, but if you build them a certain way you can minimize that. Look at my hat and you can see the jute is tucked under the net thats just one example and most of the time I dont put it on till Im near, or on the stand think of it as a wearable blind. It also affords me some movement when the winds blowing. yeah sure dumb coyotes are a little more forgiving, educated ones arn't.
3. Were just having fun. And they work too.
[ March 27, 2006, 09:44 AM: Message edited by: RedRabbit ]
Posts: 241 | From: SE IDAHO | Registered: Jan 2006
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grayman
Knows what it's all about
Member # 822
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posted March 27, 2006 09:55 AM
Leonard,
Tabbed means I went through sniper school at Ft. Benning and passed. Got my "Tab".
I just like making Ghillie suits, I do not think I have ever worn one out in the field. Well except during a really long paintball game a few years back.
And the pack is not 70 pounds only 15-20 depending on what other crap I take.
Now to describe the weapon used in the army as asked:
M24 SWS (Sniper weapon system)
7.62x51 mm standard nato round (.308 for those who do not know nato rounds)
10x24 detachable scope
Bolt action
Adjustable length stock
About 12 pounds
5 round capacity
Anything else?
-Grayman
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[Img]http://www.graymanmedia.com/sigs/animated/grayman.gif[/img]
Posts: 46 | From: West Valley City, Utah | Registered: Mar 2006
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TA17Rem
Hello, I'm the legendary Tim Anderson, Southern Minneesota Know it all
Member # 794
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posted March 27, 2006 09:56 AM
I'm with you leonard as far as camo goes, dont really need all that stuff. Maine thing is use a backing and dont wear anyting shinny.
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What if I told you, the left wing and right wing both belong to same bird!
Posts: 5613 | From: S.D. | Registered: Jan 2006
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TA17Rem
Hello, I'm the legendary Tim Anderson, Southern Minneesota Know it all
Member # 794
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posted March 27, 2006 10:00 AM
Grayman, when in the sniper school how do you break in the ghillie suite they look awfull stiff.
[ March 27, 2006, 10:01 AM: Message edited by: TA17Rem ]
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What if I told you, the left wing and right wing both belong to same bird!
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grayman
Knows what it's all about
Member # 822
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posted March 27, 2006 10:07 AM
TA 17rem,
HEH! I never had a problem with stiff. When we would get on site we would always roll around in the dirt/twigs/undergrowth to pick up bits and peices of the local fawna. Perhaps that did it.
Just never had a problem with "stiffness".
-Grayman
P.S. The only time I would ever wear a ghillie suit in the back country I think would be for bow hunting, which I do not do, and getting close to campers in the early evening to do a few howls and watch them freak out a bit.
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Posts: 46 | From: West Valley City, Utah | Registered: Mar 2006
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted March 27, 2006 10:45 AM
quote:
and getting close to campers in the early evening to do a few howls and watch them freak out a bit.
That's what I figured; farting around with humans. Humans don't circle downwind to get your scent, but they just "might" sling a little lead in the direction of the noise?
Good hunting. LB
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 32361 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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grayman
Knows what it's all about
Member # 822
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posted March 27, 2006 02:03 PM
Leonard,
That is why you also have the cover of a good rock/tree. It has not happened yet, but the one time someone did get a rifle they just held it at port arms and yelled a lot, telling the "wolf", yes they actually thought it was a wolf, to get outta here. the funny thing though is that howls do not scare people s much as a jack distress call. People know what howls are but very few city slickers have ever heard a rabbit distress.
They best people to do that to are boyscouts out on a camp.
-Grayman
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[Img]http://www.graymanmedia.com/sigs/animated/grayman.gif[/img]
Posts: 46 | From: West Valley City, Utah | Registered: Mar 2006
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