|
Author
|
Topic: Is it really Mange????
|
TA17Rem
Hello, I'm the legendary Tim Anderson, Southern Minneesota Know it all
Member # 794
|
posted March 03, 2012 10:14 PM
From time to time I still run into a few coyotes that look to have the start of mange and it seems to stay pretty much to a few key areas...
I also noticed that the animals in these key areas also have alot of fleas.
Whats the difference in one area from the next and what do some of these areas have in common.
What I see that is common with another area is the vegatation. We have alot of CRP and sloughs with cat-tails that stay dried up most of the year and both of these places also have fox or coyotes hanging around them. I see alot of coyotes that use our drainage ditches for cover and a place to live which consists of tall grass on the banks just like the crp fields..
The area in mid-central Mn. where mange first showed up has alot of the same cover as I have here, its just they had it up there longer and more of it, and when the farmers here started getting into the CRP programs it seemed like the mange showed up here shortly after.. I also noticed more of the animals had more fleas on them compared to areas that did'nt have this sort of ground cover...
I noticed that my dog copper picks up a few fleas from time to time and they are usually located in a general area on the dog (hips, shoulders, around neck area and part of the legs)the dog tries to scratch them away but they move back to one of these areas shortly after...
In S.D some of the places I hunt have simular vegation and also coyotes which appear to also have mange and alot of fleas on the healthy coyotes..
There is a area at home here that has roughly 3 square miles of CRP that is privately owned and has coyotes around.. This used to be a major area that had mange infested coyotes but in the last five years or so the farmer has done controlled burns one section or a half at a time. I noticed that this area does not produce as many mange infested coyotes as it once did...
Anyway I did a search on Flea infestation and on how severe it can be on animals that become infected with too many of these fles (Cat fleas)..
It turns out that the damage is very simular to mange and can also cause infections in the animal and hair loss starts in some of the same areas as coyotes that have mange..
So I can't help but wonder if perhaps our coyotes and coyotes in other parts of the country don't just have a severe flea problem rather than mange..
Those that have mange in other parts of the country what do you see as far as vegation that is simular to our CRP (long grass)??????
--------------------
What if I told you, the left wing and right wing both belong to same bird!
Posts: 5613 | From: S.D. | Registered: Jan 2006
| IP: Logged
|
|
Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
|
posted March 04, 2012 09:41 AM
So, CRP causes mange? I don't know what your working hypothesis is, but could it be cold weather or Liberal Democratic politics that attracts fleas?
One thing I have always remarked on, we don't have nearly the fleas or mange out here as what I read about further east. Now, why is that? I'm thinking creasote, or Midland bushes, as AR Shaw calls it.
Good hunting. LB
--------------------
EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 32361 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
| IP: Logged
|
|
Cdog911
"There are some ideas so absurd only an intellectual could believe them."--George Orwell.
Member # 7
|
posted March 04, 2012 10:30 AM
I think he's saying that CRP contributes to flea infestations which leads to hair loss often misidentified as mange. The consistency of where the hair is being lost would be accounted for because those are areas a coyote can easily access to scratch, whether the cause of the itching is mange or fleas. I wold think that any transmission of fleas from one host to another would be more directly attributable to the fact that the grass creates cover that coyotes are likely to seek out and, thus, share, moreso than thinking that the grass itself exacerbates the problem. For example, walking through CRP is a daunting task when you're barely two feet tall. Once a trail has been established, whether by deer or whatever, every animal coming rhrough is going to use it and it's certainly possible to think that a coyote walking through this morning could shed a flea or mange mite that will jump on another coyote walking by this afternoon. Consider also that in any given area, CRP grass is often the cover of choice for bedding coyotes, and coyotes intuitively will seek out the same sheltered areas within that grass - what's good for one coyote is likely good for all coyotes - and by cohabiting the same choice spots, they'll pass along parasites, just like a coyote reusing a previously used den.
An interesting observation, but I still think mange is the culprit. Fleas are just more evident on a nekid coyote.
--------------------
I am only one. But still, I am one. I cannot do everything, but still, I can do something; and, because I cannot do everything, I will not refuse to do something that I can do.
Posts: 5440 | From: The gun-lovin', gun-friendly wild, wild west | Registered: Jan 2003
| IP: Logged
|
|
Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
|
posted March 04, 2012 01:18 PM
Well, if you ask me for my thoroughly undocumented theory, my guess is they contract all parasites in the den, this year or next year while the critter eggs lay around waiting for a nice warm body, as long as it takes.
I have walked a few trails and the only thing I seem to attract in the spring is blood sucking ticks, which always freak me out! Hey, come to think of it, I don't recall our coyotes having ticks like back when I was a kid in Minneesota, with my dog? What's up with that? I just know that we have a better class of coyotes that seem able to keep themselves reasonably clean. Minneesota coyotes could learn a thing or two from them if they would just listen! But, like TA, <sigh> they just don't pay attention.
Good hunting. LB
Good hunting. El Beņo
--------------------
EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 32361 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
| IP: Logged
|
|
TA17Rem
Hello, I'm the legendary Tim Anderson, Southern Minneesota Know it all
Member # 794
|
posted March 04, 2012 03:14 PM
Lance is pretty close to my thoughts.. Also from reading up on fleas tall grass is just one of the areas fleas can hang out in till they pick up a new host as the rest of the land is tilled twice every year..
The thing with fleas and cold weather is you can shoot a coyote infested with them and leave it hang over nite and still have fleas jumping off the hide as you skin the coyote out..
We have alot of ticks around in the summer in the woods as well as the taller grass and I've never seen a coyote with any on them in the late fall or winter...
Here is a pic of a dog infested with fleas, looks very simualer to coyotes that have mange.
[ March 04, 2012, 03:21 PM: Message edited by: TA17Rem ]
--------------------
What if I told you, the left wing and right wing both belong to same bird!
Posts: 5613 | From: S.D. | Registered: Jan 2006
| IP: Logged
|
|
knockemdown
Our staff photo editing Guru, par excellence
Member # 3588
|
posted March 05, 2012 01:49 PM
Posts: 2202 | From: behind fascist lines | Registered: Mar 2010
| IP: Logged
|
|
Duckdog
Knows what it's all about
Member # 3842
|
posted March 05, 2012 06:10 PM
I find it strange that none of your coyotes have had ticks. I killed a few this year that were infested with them!
One, in particular, had big dog ticks all around it's neck! Nasty....
Posts: 205 | From: Ks | Registered: Jun 2011
| IP: Logged
|
|
the bearhunter
HM PROSTAFF & MIDWEST REGIONAL GURU VOTED MOST HANDSOME MINNESOTAN
Member # 3552
|
posted March 05, 2012 06:36 PM
well first off, i'm thinking this is a trick question of some sort as i've NEVER seen TA ask a question on a forum??.
i'll ponder this for abit and see if i can come up with a responce due to what i've noticed over the years.
just shot # 100 for the year yesterday and only 2 have has fleas. one from central ND in mid oct and one from easterm MT that was shot yesterday.
Posts: 1049 | From: minnifornia | Registered: Jan 2010
| IP: Logged
|
|
DanS
Scorched Earth (AZ Sector)
Member # 316
|
posted March 05, 2012 07:28 PM
damn ugly critter Fred, yuc
--------------------
futuaris nisi irrisus ridebis
Saepe Expertus, Semper Fidelis, Fratres Aeterni:
Often Tested, Always Faithful. Brothers Forever!
Posts: 1482 | From: flyover country | Registered: Feb 2004
| IP: Logged
|
|
Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
|
posted March 05, 2012 08:13 PM
I think bearhunter is insinuating that Tim Anderson's role is as a question answerer, rather than a question asker. He may be right about that?
Good hunting. El Bee
--------------------
EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 32361 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
| IP: Logged
|
|
TA17Rem
Hello, I'm the legendary Tim Anderson, Southern Minneesota Know it all
Member # 794
|
posted March 05, 2012 10:52 PM
Oh I would'nt say that! I have asked a few questions from time to time, very seldom get a answer or the right one.. Most times I just have to go find the answer on my own.. Maybe thats why I know a little more than some... ![[Wink]](wink.gif)
--------------------
What if I told you, the left wing and right wing both belong to same bird!
Posts: 5613 | From: S.D. | Registered: Jan 2006
| IP: Logged
|
|
Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
|
posted March 05, 2012 11:06 PM
Oh boy.
--------------------
EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 32361 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
| IP: Logged
|
|
Kokopelli
SENIOR DISCOUNT & Dispenser of Sage Advice
Member # 633
|
posted March 06, 2012 01:36 AM
"A light shineth apon the darkness and the darkness could not comprehend it."
--------------------
And lo, the Light of the Trump shown upon the Darkness and the Darkness could not comprehend it.
Posts: 8231 | From: Under a wandering star | Registered: Apr 2005
| IP: Logged
|
|
DiYi
Wears wife's pink panties under his camo for good luck. (yeah, right!)
Member # 3785
|
posted March 06, 2012 05:40 AM
Interesting about the fleas/mites etc in CRP grass.Got to ponder that awhile.
As to eastern Montana,I shot a couple there but no fleas.The guy I was with had em though-and he lurks in the grass a lot.??????
Posts: 623 | From: SoDak | Registered: Feb 2011
| IP: Logged
|
|
the bearhunter
HM PROSTAFF & MIDWEST REGIONAL GURU VOTED MOST HANDSOME MINNESOTAN
Member # 3552
|
posted March 06, 2012 11:02 AM
WRONGO ![[Roll Eyes]](rolleyes.gif) 1 of your DID have fleas (not many) and now i'm on the wifes shit-list. so please send thread,needles and flea spray ![[Eek!]](eek.gif)
edited to add:. Tim, i have not came up with an answer to your post
[ March 06, 2012, 11:04 AM: Message edited by: the bearhunter ]
Posts: 1049 | From: minnifornia | Registered: Jan 2010
| IP: Logged
|
|
Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
|
posted March 06, 2012 11:10 AM
You guys might be logging too much time in the cab together?
Good hunting. LB
--------------------
EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 32361 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
| IP: Logged
|
|
TA17Rem
Hello, I'm the legendary Tim Anderson, Southern Minneesota Know it all
Member # 794
|
posted March 06, 2012 12:29 PM
quote:
You guys might be logging too much time in the cab together?
LMAO... ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
As far as not seeing any fleas on some animals I'm not sure you looked hard enough.. It seems that all the coyotes or fox I get either here or in the Dakotas and skin them out they seem to have a few fleas with some haveing more than others...
Coyotes around prarie dog towns have them as well and these fleas seem to be a whole lot meaner than the ones I find in other areas...
Any way just wonder if others see coyotes with fleas or more of them and what the area is like that has them.. Is there alot of old growth around like CRP and if mangey coyotes are seen or killed is there a relationship with some of the areas I mentioned..
--------------------
What if I told you, the left wing and right wing both belong to same bird!
Posts: 5613 | From: S.D. | Registered: Jan 2006
| IP: Logged
|
|
Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
|
posted March 06, 2012 01:06 PM
I don't recall ever killing a coyote with mange? I think I have "seen" a couple, but never killed one. I do not remember fleas on coyotes, but we routinely bag them and toss them in the lower area, under the floor. Most of our trucks have some type of shell, be it commercial or home made and they all have a wide floor above the wheel wells, and the lower part is for storage, stuff we don't need immediate access. I almost always bag coyotes, I don't need blood and shit in the vehicle since we do sleep in there, when we can.
All those animals get dumped on the ground, at check in, so I would notice parasites in the bag, or jumping off the coyote. And, we reused the bags sometimes. I used to be able to get very heavy plastic bags at work that were used to cover switchgear which are 90" tall and could be 36-48" wide. These bags could hold a dozen coyotes, easily and as long as you kept the opening upright, leakproof. Many times I have napped on top of them, full of coyotes, which can be rather comfy when driving back to civilization.
I would like to know why (seems like?) the northern midwest coyotes have so many parasites, and why the natives talk like Canucks?
Good hunting. LB
--------------------
EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 32361 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
| IP: Logged
|
|
Rich
2,000th post PAKMAN
Member # 112
|
posted March 06, 2012 07:45 PM
"just shot # 100 for the year yesterday and only 2 have has fleas. one from central ND in mid oct and one from easterm MT that was shot yesterday."
-------------------------------------------
Congratulations Bear! That is a good job for certain. I do have one question though. How could you know that those fleas were from MT or North Dakota? The Northern accent or western drawl maybe?
--------------------
If you call the coyotes in close, you won't NEED a high dollar range finder.
Posts: 2854 | From: Iowa | Registered: Feb 2003
| IP: Logged
|
|
|
UBBFriend: Email this page to someone!
Printer-friendly view of this topic
