This is topic Why coyotes scat mark? in forum Predator forum at The New Huntmastersbbs!.
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Posted by stevecriner (Member # 892) on April 16, 2008, 07:10 PM:
This was brought up in another forum and I would like to hear some views from some of the others. Whether it be out of spite(like at a trap set or old stand) or for territorial(road and trails) purposes,Im looking forward to the replys.
edit: for this pic from one of my articles, thought it fit,lol.
[ April 16, 2008, 07:19 PM: Message edited by: stevecriner ]
Posted by Rich (Member # 112) on April 16, 2008, 07:45 PM:
In the case where you find where one coyote stopped to poop, I don't think it means anything other than the bugger just plain had to poop. I think the photo above is just that. What really perks my interest is when I find a spot where there is quite a large pile of poop. Old poop that has already turned white, and fairly fresh poop on top. I usually find these at an intersection of trails, and every coyote that comes by either poops or pees there to mark it as his territory. Mighty fine place to set a few traps don't ya think? Now when a coyote digs up my trap and poops on it, I think he is grinning and giving me the one finger salute.
Posted by Rich Higgins (Member # 3) on April 16, 2008, 07:50 PM:
Hey Steve. Besides the obvious reason that sometimes they just have to poop, the reasons are just about as diverse as everything else about coyotes.
Scat deposits and urine marking have more than one function. I call them graffitti because they can be territory boundary markings or they can just be a "Kilroy was here" social kinda thing or as Ralls, Kleiman and Ewer, independantly, in three seperate studies, concluded that scent marking is often only incidental to territorial marking, that the primary purpose is to provide the resident coyote with a familiar odor in order to increase it's sense of security. I have lots of video of coyotes coming in close, confused by sights, scents and sounds that they don't understand and squatting and dumping. I have a short video clip of a fellow that used to post here as wolverine@work that shows him kneeling down beside his truck that we had parked next to a right of way fence and explaining to the camera that when we returned from a stand we found the still steaming pile three feet from the truck door. Tyler and I have had coyotes approach our stand from behind, on our entrance trail, and leave a steaming pile in view of us. Some of these incidents have to be territorial markers and some are probably morale or security boosts,
Joe Melton, who was on the AZG&F Commision and did the trapping for the depts. biological studies told me that coyotes that come across scat that has the remains of food that the coyote knows is available in abundance such as mesquite beans, melons, grapes or carrion will backtrack that coyote to the source and as long as they honor any territory that they enter with a direct line in and out that the resident coyotes usually tolerate them.
Common travel routes near these sources often have large numbers of scat especially if there is a natural corridor such as a road along a canal or mesh fence or other barrier.
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on April 16, 2008, 08:58 PM:
MY theory is that a coyote dumps on a road, or two track with a lot more frequency than random, just gotta go. A coyote has a sense of a road as an entirely natural feature of the environment. Roads have always been there, as far as they are concerned. They use roads and they know and understand that humans use them, too. My opinion is that they consider a road to be a natural feature and a possible natural boundary, just like a creek or a wash or a crop field...any thing. It simplifies things. Why have his territorial boundary fifty feet along the side of the road when the road is so much more observable and convenient? Makes sense to me. Not always, but frequently. And, I think they are much more inclined to leaver a scat right in the middle of that road as a visual statement. Sure, they have a good nose and leave urine scent posts many other places, but I see too much scat on roads that I believe it's deliberate.
Good hunting. LB
Posted by RagnCajn (Member # 879) on April 16, 2008, 09:05 PM:
Back in the days before Computers and I was just looking for a way to extend my hunting seasons, I had a wild thing happen regarding coyote poop. I was hunting a property that I began my coyote calling experience on. I was driving down one of the levees going to my next set/setup/stand/blind. As I was traveling about 30 MPH, I noticed a coyote running between the levee and the river. I sped up to get closer and was trying to figure out how I could get a shot at him, as he was traveling on the right side of the truck. As I closed the distance and began to retrieve my rifle so I could shut down, dismount and take the shot, he crossed the levee and began an allout run across the 60-80 acre pasture out my left window. I got shut down, stuck the rifle out the window and began to take a lead for a running away shot. He slammed on the brakes and hunkered up about 150 yards out to take a dump. The 25 grain bullet from my 17 hit him through the spine in mid dump. I have often wondered since the internet began to enlighten me: Was he marking his retreat or did I run the crap out of him?
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on April 16, 2008, 09:24 PM:
No, that has been observed and talked about. I have killed two coyotes that knew I was there and knew they were in danger, yet took the time to take a shit before hitting the afterburners. Neither of them were able to even straighten up before I hammered them.
I have heard it said that coyotes deliberately defecate before a chase by hounds, and female coyotes are a lot more prone to do it than males. Might have something to do with feeling less sluggish? Makes sense to me?
Good hunting. LB
[ April 16, 2008, 09:24 PM: Message edited by: Leonard ]
Posted by CrossJ (Member # 884) on April 17, 2008, 07:52 AM:
I have seen coyotes 'empty' out when a set of grey hounds was sent. Dont know if they were male or female though.
I like Higgins' statement;
"...... the reasons are just about as diverse as everything else about coyotes.
Scat deposits and urine marking have more than one function. I call them graffitti...".
So yes, I think it is more than a 'gotta go' type thing. What it is, I don't know. Other factors would help determine the meaning of the graffiti. For instance, a fresh pile at a trap set with no dug trap may mean something totally different than a fresh pile at a dug trap.
One morning I found a fresh pile in the floor of my shop....I have wondered the meaning of that one for a while.
Posted by Kelly Jackson (Member # 977) on April 17, 2008, 08:10 AM:
Good topic Steve. I am interested as well.
Posted by JoeF (Member # 228) on April 17, 2008, 08:30 AM:
The house I now live in had been vacant for quite some time except for a brief period right before I bought the place, intermittently occupied before that.
When I first moved in there wasn't a turd in sight, that changed after I started cleaning things up outside and mowing a larger area than the previous owner.
The first "welcome to the neighborhood" sign that I had was a pile in the cat food bowl right outside the front door.
Then piles in the driveway.
The freshest (that I am aware of) occurred one day when I walked to the mailbox and mailed a letter. I returned to the house and a short time later - only a matter of minutes - I heard the mailman stop. I went to get the mail and was rewarded with the sight of a fresh pile at the base of the mailbox centered in a track in the dust I had left earlier. Gross looking, too. Wild cherries...
Coincidence or chance droppings? Amazingly precise placement for that, I think.
I killed the first coyote here on Sept. 28th of that year and I killed either 16 or 18 coyotes within 100 yards of my house the first 3 years I was here. My sidewalk and driveway have been clean ever since.
There is a sunken roadway about a 1/2 mile away that flattens out at the crest of a hill. At the crest the road makes a 90 degree turn and is almost the highest point around, no longer sunken. Two field roads intersect at this point.
This corner is marked almost daily.
Posted by stevecriner (Member # 892) on April 17, 2008, 07:07 PM:
Kelly, I started this after seeing yours at OK's board. It strikes and intrest and I wanted to hear from some of the other seasoned guys that dont go there.
edit:to fix
[ April 17, 2008, 07:09 PM: Message edited by: stevecriner ]
Posted by Kelly Jackson (Member # 977) on April 17, 2008, 07:22 PM:
Good Deal Steve. Me too.
Posted by Rich Higgins (Member # 3) on April 17, 2008, 08:03 PM:
Here's something to ponder. IF coyotes and fox deposit scat in prominant places, (When Scott and I visited Cal in Wy. we saw where the coyotes deposited there scat up high on sage brush and I saw a coyote turd balanced precisely on the lower strand of a barbwire fence here in Az. and one of my favorites, Tyler and I found a fox turd placed smack in the middle of a coyote skull out in the desert) AND some biologists believe that they do this to make it more easily detectable by other coyotes or foxes AND Joe Melton said that coyotes can backtrack the scatmaker to the place of interest THEN I think it's possible to imagine a number of causes and effects just from pooping.
IF they poop to leave a calling card, Kilroy was here, it can possibly be done just to let other coyotes know who is in the area. Other group members can forward track as well as backtrack. One purpose of howling is to announce presence or location. Scat deposits do the same. Elevating them or placing them in prominant places does that more efficiently. Make sense?
They always poop.
They always do.
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on April 17, 2008, 08:29 PM:
Sure does. As another Guru once said about coyotes, Nothing is graven in stone.
I think fox, (kit and grays) poop on things more than coyotes do? You know, low sparse cover, and then there is a rock that stands out? I tend to see fox scat on those rocks. Judging by the size, I say fox, I don't know if pup coyotes would do that sort of thing?
But, you know, if you have ever taken a dog for a walk, they look for the perfect spot. I just think coyotes see a road and think that's a perfect spot to take a dump. I'm speaking of dirt roads primarily.
Now, what this all means and how to apply it to hunting coyotes? Well, I am observant of coyote scat, make mental notes of where I see it and when I see a lot of it; I like it. As the trappers say; see sign, set trap. See a lot of sign, set more traps.
If I see a lot of coyote poop in the two tracks, I am very encouraged and want to hunt right there.
The only caviat. You don't know if they are marking their after dark hunting grounds, or their bedroom locations?
Good hunting. LB
[ April 17, 2008, 08:31 PM: Message edited by: Leonard ]
Posted by Rich Higgins (Member # 3) on April 17, 2008, 08:54 PM:
Well Leonard, my best guess is that their bedroom isn't in the middle of a two track. ![[Smile]](smile.gif)
But, you know that they travel the easy routes, two tracks, cow paths ,dirt bike ruts, and paved roads like the one in Steve's pic. As mentioned before the animations show coyotes following other coyotes trails so it's no surprise to find several scats in certain areas. Probably for the same reason that they poop in intersections, because they cross trails, more cross trails at intersections more scat. Which is why you like to call near those areas. But the same applies to Steve's pic. Why would the coyote lay the scat in that particular place. Possibly it crossed the trail of another? Possibly a coyote it was tracking turned off there? Either way, you know that a coyote was at that location and may still be within hearing and if the coyote left it as a comminque it expected something to be in the area to get the message which makes for a fairly high confidence stand in the general area. waddaya think?
They always poop.
They always do.
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on April 17, 2008, 09:15 PM:
Well, I think you took me too literally. I meant close by, adjacent, that type of thing, and I had in mind, crossing the roads not using them as paths, which they do all the time, but I see more coyotes crossing the road in washes, than using it as a path. I believe in some areas there is a distinct difference between hunting grounds that they use at night, out in the flats, and in the morning they are headed up an arroyo to sack out at the base of the foothills where there is a lot more cover.
Good hunting. LB
Posted by RagnCajn (Member # 879) on April 17, 2008, 09:32 PM:
All this knowledge on here and I, a nobody in the coyote field has to come up with an answer on Steve's Picture.
Any self respecting Coyote Scatologist knows that poop in the picture came from a Female coyote in Estrus.
She didn't want the high grasses tickling her pooty poo.
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on April 17, 2008, 09:37 PM:
Thats a heck of an astute answer for a rookie! I like it.
Good hunting. LB
Posted by RagnCajn (Member # 879) on April 17, 2008, 10:20 PM:
Why thank ya Leonard. Maybe one day I can be BonaFide too. Maybe we can get Lance to write an article about high Grass Poo evasion tactics employed by Female in Estrus Coyotes for Scott to critique.
On edit: Oh Crap, literally, I just had a brain fart and thought of something that may revolutionize the calling industry. It is not an estrus chirp that has been heard, It is the sound of an estrous female that did not find the road. That is the sound of her giggling as the high grass tickled her when she squated.
[ April 17, 2008, 10:23 PM: Message edited by: RagnCajn ]
Posted by Okanagan (Member # 870) on April 18, 2008, 05:17 AM:
Interesting topic and I've learned from you all.
I have one anecdote to add to the pile. When I first started calling coyotes I had one charge to within a foot in tall grass where I was mouse squeeking. It scared both of us and I missed a bow shot at the departing critter.
Exactly one week later I hunkered in the same spot and called with the same sound. I heard small sounds of something circling in the grass but nothing definitive to me. After 20 minutes I quit and headed down the trail I'd used on approach. 40 yards from where I'd hunkered to call was a pile of coyote droppings steaming in the cold morning air, dead center in a boot track I'd made on the way in.
Posted by Rich Higgins (Member # 3) on April 18, 2008, 06:26 AM:
Okanagan, that is why we call the same areas with the same sound but we place our shooter straight downwind BEYOND a ridgeline or mesquite tangle that the coyote WILL use to get downwind without exposing itself. If possible though we will change the stand location just a little and use all of the sounds that we use in a different sequence.. The computer animations of the gps collared coyotes that we called to showe that they always investigated the calling spot later. It also revealed that when we left the calling area the coyotes followed us out and we didn't have a clue that they did so.
Posted by Rich Higgins (Member # 3) on April 18, 2008, 06:33 AM:
Randy, I don't know if your pooty poo answer solves that puzzle or not but it certainly was fine snake oil. You may not be fide yet but you are definitely bona.
Posted by R.Shaw (Member # 73) on April 18, 2008, 07:12 AM:
My thoughts are a lot like Leonard's. Find a bunch of turds on a short stretch of road and make a stand. I have high confidence under these situations.
I think they smell something different that triggers the bowel movement. It could be where another coyote has left scent from it's body, piss, or turd. It could be from a human or from lure at a trap. None the less, they feel the need to take a crap. Kinda like a hot cup of coffee in the morning or a fresh dip of tobacco.
When you have a dug-up trap with turd, who is to say which event occured first? And when the turd is on the sprung trap, could the trap already have been sprung when the coyote came along?
Randy
Posted by Okanagan (Member # 870) on April 18, 2008, 07:59 PM:
Rich, that coyote taught me more about changing sounds, locations and times than any other single critter in my life. I called him four times that I saw him over two years. I was going to grad school at the time and he was giving me grad school tutoring on the side in coyoteology. He was big and unusually dark, so easy to pick out when he was with other coyotes or recognize alone. His reponse/reaction to my calling was different each time as he learned more. I could have killed him easily with a rifle three of the times but he seemed to know bow range.
I have heard animals following me sometimes, faint sounds in dry grass, crusted snow, etc. Sometimes it is a cougar and I can find tracks to verify it, but more often I find fresh coyote tracks if there is a tracking surface. Your collared tracking study is fascinating to me, confirming much of what I'd suspected but didn't know.
IMO they are smart and curious, and those two factors account for a lot of their behaviors. From high glassing spots I've watched them sneak up to golfers and watch them without being seen, and watched one circle an elk hunter on his stand. He never knew the coyote was there.
I watched one coyote trot to the point of a ridge sticking into a housing tract and bark or howl at dawn, apparently just to get every dog in a half mile radius to bark at once. He would sit there with his head cocked to one side listening till the dogs finally quieted down enough to hear him, then bark to set them off again. If that wasn't for pure fun, I have no idea what it is about but have seen similar from coyotes in two countries.
They are the most interesting animal I know.
Posted by smithers (Member # 646) on April 19, 2008, 09:01 AM:
Steamers and pee'ers. Some shit on the way in and others stare at you and pee.
Extreme excitement can sometimes trigger the urge to pee or poop.
Most of the scat I find looks more "placed" than random. I believe that most turds have a meaning, it's more than, Gotta go Gotta go.
Most everything that animals do is for a reason, inborn or learned behavior. Why would crapping be any different.
Racoons relieve on fallen trees and deer dump in their beds, bears shit in the woods and birds on our heads.
As far as Steve's picture goes. There could have been a deer or squirrel that was mashed on the road and the the coyote liked the stench of rot and poo'ed in that spot. Who knows?
[ April 19, 2008, 09:10 AM: Message edited by: smithers ]
Posted by Okanagan (Member # 870) on April 19, 2008, 09:17 PM:
Rich, I should have added that I am envious of all the coyote watching and coyote studies you get to do. They are a fascinating critter.
[ April 19, 2008, 09:17 PM: Message edited by: Okanagan ]
Posted by Rich Higgins (Member # 3) on April 20, 2008, 07:40 PM:
Okanagan, here's one you will enjoy pondering.
Mike's student located an alpha male with the VHF antenna. Because of terrain we couldn't approach the coyote except straight downwind. Because one of the objectives of the student's study was to see how coyotes utilize their territories in response to human intrusion, we decided to go ahead and make the approach and then howl and call to the coyote even though his nose would have already told him everything about us. We crawled the last few feet to a rock rim and as soon as I made the first sound the coyote took off at a run crosswind. When the coyote hit the parked truck's downwind it stopped and remained there for the 20 minutes that we invested in the stand. When we drove away in the truck the coyote followed. The coyote followed us several miles, matching our 15 mph speed, completely crossing the neighboring territory, waiting while we made a stand there, and then continuing to follow us into the next territory. When we ended that stand the student couldn't locate the coyote again.
The truck is the same one the student drove into the study area once a week to locate and kick the coyotes up for the sattelites to interrogate.
Posted by Okanagan (Member # 870) on April 21, 2008, 08:58 AM:
Thanks, Rich. That is an amazing account. Phenomenal.
I've always wanted some magic device that would show me where certain kinds of animals are in a vast valley, even for 30 seconds. Even one such display would give a ton of info about numbers, patterns and distribution. That's a hoot to be calling and GPS tracking collared coyotes. Amazing what you've learned already.
Here's a routine coyote activity that I don't know the whys of: random or on purpose, but I think purposeful. I followed a coyote's tracks for over 8 miles one morning up a logging road from near a valley bottom up to a deer wintering area. That upper elevation on the break of a forested plateau had received freezing rain that night that had put a heavy crust on the knee deep snow. I was on cross country skis.
My assumption is that the coyote knew somehow that suddenly deer were easy pickings in those conditions, so he left off mousing in the valley and trotted up for some venison. As you know, in those conditions deer break through the crust and coyotes run easily on top, level with the deer's neck and body.
My assumption may be wrong about why he made the trip, but his timing was impeccable. If my guess about his motive is right, then I'm curious how he knew conditions had changed at higher elevation. In the valley where he started from, the shallow snow was soft with no crust.
Forgive me if I've posted this story before. I can't remember one way or the other but don't trust my memory.
[ April 21, 2008, 09:03 AM: Message edited by: Okanagan ]
Posted by Rich Higgins (Member # 3) on April 21, 2008, 06:43 PM:
Len, I don't have a clue how they know to exploit conditions that exist at long distances. A predator biologist with AZG&F told me that one tagged coyote traveled 75 miles to Anderson Mesa when the antelope began fawning. That's too far for vocalizations to alert them and it was too soon for the coyote to backtrack scat deposits. The biologist didn't have a clue either.
When I lived in Utah stories were common every winter about coyotes trotting on crusted snow alongside floundering deer and eating them alive.
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on April 21, 2008, 06:51 PM:
Higgins, you lived there, too? Staying one step ahead of the law, eh?
(didn't know I spoke Canadian, did ya)
Good hunting. LB
PS Read your email! I need that info before ten, tomorrow morning.
Posted by Wiley E (Member # 108) on May 02, 2008, 03:54 PM:
In a coyote's normal activities they usually mark certain spots or locations with droppings and urine. That's well known and documented. What's not well known is why. I don't believe they think to themselves, "gee, I need to wait until I hit the road to piss or deficate so another coyote knows I'm here". I think it's more of a reaction to other odors at certain locations that excite them causing them to unload. This reaction could be caused by other animal odors or a multitude of odors at a certain spot such as oil products used in asphalt. This turd marking in turn creates the situation where they can idenfify eachother. I prefer to believe urine and defication marking is an instinctual reaction to a particular situation which benfits their territorial instincts.
Droppings last much longer in some places than they do in others. Rain, insects, vegetation (rabbitat), and diet all play a role in how easily detectable droppings are and how long they last.
Many times I have seen coyotes unload before running from vehicles, dogs, snowmobiles, or airplanes.
Why do dogs piss on tires or fire hydrants? Because another dog pissed there first? Some dog had to be the first one to piss there for some reason. With tires I'd guess it's the odor retention of petroleum products used in the tires. With hydrants, I'd guess it's the heigth. Who knows why they use them? Just know they do.
I think it becomes a chain reaction. A coyote stalls out time at a certain spot he feels comfortable then marks that territory because he happens to be there. Certain locations are used a lot more than others. Another coyote comes along and smells the previous coyotes and marks the same spot starting a chain reaction.
I know that when I rock M-44s in, the rain will wash lure odors into the soil. Coyotes come along and start pissing on the rocks and grass then the cattle won't eat the grass allowing it to grow higher which makes it even more visible than the surrounding grass. Pretty soon virtually every coyote that comes by has to piss there making it more attractive with each deposit due to the visual and odor attraction. Eventually it becomes a place that very few coyotes won't stop and urinate and/or deficate.
I believe too, as Joe Melton explained, that coyotes can track coyotes to certain food sources based on their droppings but I don't believe other coyotes are more tolerable if the intruding coyote makes a straight line approach. Territorial resident coyotes either tolerate other coyotes or they don't. Tolerance for intruding coytoes depends on coyote population, habitat, time of year, human disturbance, and prey availability not on whether a coyote approaches in a straight line and leaves or whether he runs all over hell. A straight line approach and exit would serve to make the intruder less detectable, not more tolerable.
Canines have an anal gland on each side of their anus that excretes anal gland cream on their droppings as they deficate creating an individual odor. This is what trappers use to make gland lure. I'm sure some of you have had an unfortunate incident while skinning coyotes that led to a gland spurt in the face. If you haven't, you haven't skinned many coyotes. I believe this is the primary reason why dogs sniff eachother's asses. There is no question that anal gland secretions are key in identification. The question is, what can they learn from that whiff?
~SH~
Posted by Tim Behle (Member # 209) on May 02, 2008, 04:42 PM:
Scott,
I'm sure that you have tried it, but am curious to the results in your area.
Have you ever made a post set, using only your own piss?
Posted by Cdog911 (Member # 7) on May 02, 2008, 08:35 PM:
Tim,
I spoke with a guy this year that used his own urine simply because he ran out of the right stuff. LOL. He said he did manage to catch a coyote there.
Never used my own for trapping, but there was this one time I was trying to draw a pin on a nice buck but that bastard would never show in the light of day. He had a decent scrape line running through the timber I was hunting, and one good scrape not ten yards from my stand. Heading home one night, I stopped and "marked" my territory out of frustration. The next day, that scrape was about three times bigger and it looked like someone had lobbed a grenade into the middle of it. So much or all human scent being aversive in all cases.
Posted by Wiley E (Member # 108) on May 04, 2008, 02:06 PM:
No Tim, can't say I ever used my own urine to trap a coyote but I do not believe that human urine causes the same concerns to SOME coyotes that human scent does.
~SH~
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on May 04, 2008, 06:08 PM:
Scott, there is a very interesting question, just touched upon. The relationship to scent and the situation. I have hunted around 1ndian villages, Mexican, etcetera. Coyotes totally ignore human scent, scavange around dumps, trot through back yards all the time. I think it has something to do with calling or howling.
I have seen a coyote trot across the road, I'm pulled over and parked, he's downwind and doesn't react, at all. Same situation, but I am on stand, the coyote crosses in front of the vehicle, ignores it and tries to get downwind of the sound; then he gets a snootful of human scent and he turns inside out. So, what's the difference? Every time? Not necessarily, but undisturbed, I don't notice that a coyote gives a shit about human scent.....most of the time.
You mentioned once, that it might have to do with the freshness of the scent? I'm thinking it is more nuanced than that; like everything else about coyotes.
What do you think?
LB
Anybody?
[ May 04, 2008, 06:08 PM: Message edited by: Leonard ]
Posted by TA17Rem (Member # 794) on May 04, 2008, 07:00 PM:
I think a coyote slowly gets used to human scent as he works his way closer to houses and such. And over time he relizes the danger level is low and he comes in to the yard and gets what he wants. But when you are out calling the scent of a human is where it should'nt be, out of place so to speak, and this is what trips his alarm and tells him to get out of there.
I have called in some areas where the coyotes do go up to the ranchers yards and mouse around or play tag with the ranchers dog. And in these same areas i have had coyotes come in down wind and not showing a whole lot of fear of my scent if he is indeed picking it up from down wind..
Posted by Krustyklimber (Member # 72) on May 05, 2008, 12:05 PM:
Leonard,
I once heard the subject you mention, referred to as "the scent of intent", in relation to pheromones and their effect on mating (and aggression/competition for mates).
It was hypothesized, that in an instant a mammal's pheromone output would change based on mood, adrenal levels, and other factors.
They say an animal can "smell fear", so (to me) it's just as likely that they can they also smell indifference, or intent to "attack", and that these scents of intent we're not sensitive enough to notice are easily picked up and interpreted by some canines.
Krusty 
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on May 05, 2008, 01:04 PM:
On one occasion, we had hunted all night and all morning and had set up camp in a secluded spot. Two other guys were milling around, including shooting cans floating in the stock pond, but I had strung up a hammock between a tree and the door handle and had my cap pulled down over my eyes.
I happened to catch some movement or could have been sound, but I looked up and could see a coyote pissing on a tree and scratching with his back feet, or more accurately, I could see the back half of him.
So, I slowly got up and reached for my trusty 6mm and I could see him through brush, in the scope and lip squeaked. He like turned the front of his body and looked right at me and took an 85 grain spitzer in the lower chest.
We were camped most of the afternoon, not quiet at all, eating, talking, taking a leak, etc.
The coyote obviously knew we were there, yet he was bold enough to scent mark within(oh) maybe forty feet of me? So much for a coyote being deathly afraid of human scent. At least in some situations.
I think this is why our friend BS, thinks that coyotes are not afraid of human voices, and he yaks away on stand constantly? It's because he was building fences and working and talking, and the coyote does not feel threatened because he understands the focus is not directed at him. He sees humans, smells humans and hears humans. It's just that BS doesn't understand the difference. Forty-odd years of experience? Could be? Last year it was thirty-odd?
In some cases, any of that type of activity would cause him (the coyote) to get the hell out of Dodge, but a coyote understands when he is the voyeur. Cats are even better at observing, undetected. They never think they are visible, but a coyote knows he can be seen, but is also capable of analyzing a situation and can tell when people are busy doing things unrelated to him and therefore, no threat.
Of course, this theory doesn't work in Kansas.
Good hunting. LB
[ May 05, 2008, 01:37 PM: Message edited by: Leonard ]
Posted by Greenside (Member # 10) on May 05, 2008, 02:17 PM:
I’m going with the freshness theory on the scent. I suspect that in the first twenty four hours that a coyote could tell within minutes of when that scent was left. Big difference in toleration of human scent that was left in the past and a direct shot or snoot full of “right now” human scent.
Has anybody heard that canines can scent differentiate the genetic genome of individual humans? Meaning that they can tell you and me apart but wouldn’t be able to tell identical twins apart by scent once the what they had for dinner wears off
Not sure what to say about the scat marking especially on roads. Doesn’t seem to be a big territorial issue in my area. I see the occasional pile here and there but at the same time in winter tons of tracks in the snow crossing the road with no scat pile. Why do they scat mark a cowpie? I think because it ‘s visual just like the open road and other obvious open places. Very easy for everyone to see. Personally and IMHO, scat marks are nothing more than coyote graffiti, very much the same as
“Kilroy was here” .
Posted by Cdog911 (Member # 7) on May 05, 2008, 04:07 PM:
quote:
Of course, this theory doesn't work in Kansas.
In Kansas, all coyotes are trying to get the hell outta Dodge. All the time.
Theirs is a very stressful existence.
Posted by smithers (Member # 646) on May 05, 2008, 06:10 PM:
I'm pretty glad that my sense of smell was dulled, nearly to the point of non existence, by "evolution".
We'd be walking around gagging every two seconds if we could pick apart and discern all of those smells at once.
Big Eddie with the bologna slices under each arm and gear oil smeared from ass to armpits smells bad enough already...
When a coyote is repulsed by the smell of human odor. Now that's saying something...
Posted by Kelly Jackson (Member # 977) on May 08, 2008, 08:25 PM:
but it would be cool to know which chick was horsin when you walked by ![[Wink]](wink.gif)
Posted by JeremyKS (Member # 736) on May 09, 2008, 06:16 PM:
lol ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
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