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Author
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Topic: Your thoughts on coyote /prey densities
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Steve Craig
Lacks Opposable Thumbs/what's up with that?
Member # 12
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posted January 04, 2004 07:00 AM
Something I have noticed over the years, and just wanted to throw this topic out to you all.
Areas with low rabbit numbers, the coyotes tend to work the stand with more caution. They still respond, but not aggressivly. Whereas areas with higher rabbit numbers, the coyotes are much more aggresive and will run over you. Just wanted to know if I am the only one noticing this reaction?
Steve
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Yes, we did produce a near-perfect republic. But will they keep it? Or will they, in the enjoyment of plenty, lose the memory of freedom? Material abundance without character is the path of destruction. - Thomas Jefferson
Posts: 442 | From: Cottonwood,Az, USA | Registered: Jan 2003
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Rich Higgins
unknown comic
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posted January 04, 2004 07:56 AM
Steve, I do not see this because I howl at the beginning of every stand, before any distress sound, and coyotes approach the stand much more cautiously and deliberatly if they believe an unidentified coyote is present.
I can believe that coyotes that reside in areas with high rabbit densities will hear the real live distress very often and when they hear the memorex version the Pavlovian reflex will kick in immediately.
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Curt2u
Knows what it's all about
Member # 74
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posted January 04, 2004 08:24 AM
Excellent topic Steve. The area I hunt is a cookie cutter example of what you just described. Close to where I live there is a very low rabbit population. The coyotes don't depend on the few that are here for a food source. Another area I hunt has quite a few rabbits and that is where I notice that most of the time a coyote shows it is a hard charger. I notice a big difference in aggression between these two areas. Certainly not disputing what Rich said but I howl at the beginning of the stand and seem to still have them come in more aggressive in the high rabbit population areas. To the point where they are tough to stop for a shot.
Take care, Curt
Posts: 236 | From: NW | Registered: Jan 2003
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onecoyote
Knows what it's all about
Member # 129
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posted January 04, 2004 08:58 AM
Steve, I don't know if I can buy that idea. I've hunted places in Mexico that has no rabbits to speak of and the place was loaded with coyotes that responded ASAP because they were real hungry. I've seen it in Nevada where the rabbits were so thick they'd cover about every sq foot of land, but no coyotes? I think the coyotes were all full of rabbits lol. Good question, but I don't think anyone really has the answer, Good Hunting
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Great minds discuss ideas.....Average minds discuss events.....Small minds discuss people.....Eleanor Roosevelt.
Posts: 893 | From: Walker Lake Nevada. | Registered: Feb 2003
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Cdog911
"There are some ideas so absurd only an intellectual could believe them."--George Orwell.
Member # 7
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posted January 04, 2004 09:29 AM
[ February 20, 2004, 02:39 PM: Message edited by: Cdog911 ]
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I am only one. But still, I am one. I cannot do everything, but still, I can do something; and, because I cannot do everything, I will not refuse to do something that I can do.
Posts: 5440 | From: The gun-lovin', gun-friendly wild, wild west | Registered: Jan 2003
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Terry Hunter
Knows what it's all about
Member # 58
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posted January 04, 2004 11:02 AM
In my state we have rabbits every where you walk.Sometimes the coyotes are 50 yards away before you stop blowing the call and sometimes they hang up hundreds of yards away.
Posts: 132 | From: N. Middle Tennessee | Registered: Jan 2003
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted January 04, 2004 12:32 PM
Yo would think that I might have some clear idea of the relationship between coyotes and jackrabbits, but I don't.
I see a lot of coyotes in places where there doesn't appear to be many rabbits, and I see places where the rabbit population is extremely high, and I don't see many coyotes?
What it says to me is that high rabbit populations generally mean poor predator hunting. On the other hand, if I don't see a single jackrabbit, it doesn't bother me. As long as I'm getting responses, and other sign says that I have coyotes in the area.
I don't understand the relationship as well as I should. Melons, grapes, mesquite beans, etc. There's a lot of stuff to eat, if you are as resourceful as a coyote.
But, again, I don't think it's as simple as more rabbits, more coyotes; less rabbits, less coyotes.
Good hunting. LB
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 32361 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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Terry Hunter
Knows what it's all about
Member # 58
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posted January 04, 2004 02:54 PM
In my part of the country coyotes catch many more mice than rabbits.
Posts: 132 | From: N. Middle Tennessee | Registered: Jan 2003
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Rich Higgins
unknown comic
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posted January 04, 2004 04:31 PM
A couple of years ago I talked to the supervisor at the Sun City Country Club about the coyotes that took up residence on the golf course. They live there year round and whelp there pups in the concrete culverts that drain the golf course. The greens are home to hundreds of jacks and cottontails also. He told me that initially they welcomed the coyotes in the hope that they would control the rabbit population. Instead the coyotes walk up to the omni-present doves that sit on the ground in the shade, make a quick short dash and snatch the dove. The super said the edges of the greens are littered with dove feathers and the coyotes are too lazy to chase the rabbits. ![[Smile]](smile.gif)
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Barndog
Knows what it's all about
Member # 255
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posted January 06, 2004 11:25 AM
I've noticed just the opposite as cdog, when food becomes scarce, coyotes will group to take down larger prey such as large sheep to small calves. It seems when there are plenty of rabbits and mice, the livestock are less likely to become prey. I once counted 13 coyotes in a pack in southern Utah just north of St. George.
Posts: 185 | From: Idaho | Registered: Dec 2003
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Thumper
PAKMAN
Member # 174
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posted January 08, 2004 10:55 PM
Mr Craig
My obsevations closely mirror yours. I have a couple of large valleys I call that have a lot of rabbits. These valleys also have a large population of eager coyotes. I believe the prey draws a large number of predators so consequently the competion is fierce among coyotes. Anyway, they sure come running to the call.
Posts: 4 | From: Oregon | Registered: Apr 2003
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Steve Craig
Lacks Opposable Thumbs/what's up with that?
Member # 12
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posted January 09, 2004 04:25 AM
All excellent points.
Lance, I like the way you think out loud.
This is interesting to me in that some are finding coyote numbers in rabbit rich habitat as well as coyotes in low rabbit areas. This is what I am finding as well. What I also am seeing is that just as Thumper said. It is HOW they respond to the call in each area. Very aggressive responses in the high rabbit number areas and a more reluctant approach in low rabbit areas. My next question is:
Is it the rabbit population or is it something else causing this? I am talking about only using prey distress sounds on stand, not coyote vocalizations. I aggree with Rich, that when you use coyote vocalizations, you tend to USUALLY get a much slower and less aggressive response in both high rabbit areas as well as low rabbit areas.
Food for thought,
Steve
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Yes, we did produce a near-perfect republic. But will they keep it? Or will they, in the enjoyment of plenty, lose the memory of freedom? Material abundance without character is the path of destruction. - Thomas Jefferson
Posts: 442 | From: Cottonwood,Az, USA | Registered: Jan 2003
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tonlocus
Knows what it's all about
Member # 254
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posted January 09, 2004 05:59 AM
I haven't been doing this very long but I believe a trend is starting to develop. I've noticed that I get more responses to my calling when the scat I find has fur in it. Whether it's rabbit, mouse, prairie dog, or deer. I have very little success in areas where the scat is mainly veggy. Anyone else make this leap or am I drawing the wrong conclusions from this observation.
Posts: 76 | From: Phoenix, AZ | Registered: Dec 2003
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Norm
Knows what it's all about
Member # 240
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posted January 09, 2004 06:42 AM
Tony, I hadn't really paid enough attention to that kind of detail, but I would rather be dealing with a meat eater versus a vegetarian; ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
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Carpe Diem
Posts: 778 | From: Phx AZ | Registered: Oct 2003
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted January 09, 2004 03:36 PM
Tony, if you ask me, it's meaningless. Or maybe I should say that it's seasonal? Or maybe I should clarify that it's regional?
Of course, it's all of the above. I wouldn't worry about it too much, it's just interesting to know when they start munching mesquite beans, etc.
In some areas, they never see the vegtable matter, so it's primarily tarry and/or full of hair.
Good hunting. LB
Good hunting. LB
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 32361 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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