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Author
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Topic: Realistic Expectations
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Lonny
PANTS ON THE GROUND
Member # 19
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posted December 11, 2003 02:55 PM
In the area you do the majority of your calling how many predators can you realistically expect to kill (if any) on the average day?
I know everyone expects to kill one or two every stand. When you read the magazines and watch the videos it would be easy for a guy just starting out to think that killing several animals a trip would be a real possibility.
Posts: 1209 | From: Lewiston, Idaho USA | Registered: Jan 2003
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Krustyklimber
prefers the bunny hugger pronunciation: ky o tee
Member # 72
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posted December 11, 2003 03:38 PM
Good topic Lonny,
On most stands I have learned not to expect anything... I still find myself hoping, but any expectations are long gone.
How many predators do I realisticly think I am going to kill in a day, a week, or a month of stands?
ZERO! I have a good grip on reality! (at least as far as this is concerned)
I am gonna be just as suprised as you all are when I finally get one. ![[Eek!]](eek.gif)
How many tracks might you guys see in an average day, and of what kind?
We had a fairly average day Monday... we cut about a dozen sets of bobcat tracks, two sets of cougar tracks, and one poor lone coyotes tracks, in a two day old snow.
Jeff 
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Think about how stupid the average person is, then realize that half of them are stupider than that!
Posts: 1912 | From: Deep in the Blue Ridge Mountains of Virginia | Registered: Jan 2003
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Norm
Knows what it's all about
Member # 240
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posted December 11, 2003 03:42 PM
Lonny, in the areas I call, I feel lucky if I call in 1 coyote per 3 stands; I feel lucky if I get a shot at 1 coyote per 3 called... that is just my expectations such that I can watch the video's and wished every coyote called, stood still and broadside to me so that I could shoot at them.
What ever the correct statistics are, would be great information for the video makers to communicate such that the person who has never done this before won't get discouraged by the fact that not every sound they make results in a coyote coming in to the call and being shot...
This is going to be an interesting thread...
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Carpe Diem
Posts: 778 | From: Phx AZ | Registered: Oct 2003
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted December 11, 2003 03:56 PM
Yeah, I wonder what kind of replies we will be getting, myself.
It really ........DEPENDS!
It depends on the season, the time of day, the part of the country, the type of cover you are hunting, and the methods, calls, etc. that you employ. Plus a bunch of other variables.
However, in a single morning, anywhere in the western United States, you could expect to call, at least one coyote. Especially this time of year.
Krusty, you have to work on your attitude. Don't give up, and don't decide that you won't see anything before you leave the house. If you have sign, you can call 'em. You have had a string of bad luck, but that has not a thing to do with the next stand you make. Now, go out there and slaughter a few!
Good hunting. LB
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 32363 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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varmit hunter
Knows what it's all about
Member # 37
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posted December 11, 2003 04:16 PM
What are you're best expectations?. What are you're highest odds?. When are you're best chances?.
You're next stand.....
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Make them pay for the wind.
Posts: 932 | From: Orange,TX | Registered: Jan 2003
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brad h
Knows what it's all about
Member # 57
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posted December 11, 2003 04:33 PM
Realistically, 1 per day. After a quick look at stuff I call, and the amount I have access to, one would think four or five would be reasonable.
They're here, but the numbers are kept down. Plenty of tracks, It seems to be a matter of being there on the right day, and getting close enough besides. The ones that are here have the run of the place.
When I call all day and don't see a thing, I can usually count on seeing one come in at sun down, and hell bent at that.
Brad
Posts: 346 | From: Glendive MT | Registered: Jan 2003
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Krustyklimber
prefers the bunny hugger pronunciation: ky o tee
Member # 72
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posted December 11, 2003 05:36 PM
Leonard,
Actually my attitude must not have come out right in print... I am not discouraged, and I certainly am not going to give up. ![[Wink]](wink.gif)
I have really had much better days hunting, since I stopped expecting anything to show up. Now I just enjoy the fact I am not at home "mowing the lawn" or doing some other chore.
Like I said I never leave the house without the "hopes" of seeing, and maybe even shooting at, something... I just got sick of expecting it to happen and then being bummed out that it did not.
If I had given up, I would have stopped carrying a gun, or stopped going altogether.
And I wouldn't call 170+ stands, over a stretch of almost 18 months, a string of bad luck.
If I had bad luck I woulda missed a few by now... I have no luck at all! LOL
But that's not to say I don't thoroughly enjoy myself out there, and I am getting better at this every stand.
Many skills are needed, to successfully call in and kill a predator, most people come into it with some of those skills from other forms of hunting.
I did not start this predator hunting with any of these special skills, the closest I come to being skilled, is being an average shooter with fairly good vision.
It's gonna take time to develope these skills, and I am not going to beat myself up pushing for results that are beyond my means.
It'll happen, when it happens...
The first coyote is beginners luck,
The second one is merely a coincidence...
It's not until the third one that you can say you had anything to do with it!
Jeff
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Think about how stupid the average person is, then realize that half of them are stupider than that!
Posts: 1912 | From: Deep in the Blue Ridge Mountains of Virginia | Registered: Jan 2003
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albert
Knows what it's all about
Member # 98
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posted December 11, 2003 06:15 PM
Leonard is right with it "depends". Time of year, location, weather all play a factor. Expierence also plays a big factor. Has I have gained expierence my expectations have gone up. I used to be that I hoped to see three in a day now hunting that same area I expect to kill more that that. I hunt differently when I am by myself or with someone else. Hunting by myself in a full day of hunting I expect to kill about three, less that that I start to ask myself what I am doing wrong.
I have a buddy Floyd when we get together it's not a relaxing hunt. We go out on a mission, and that is to kill as many coyotes as we can. We know the area we hunt real well, we know where the best stands are. We might make two or three stands that are new to us in a day of calling. We kill a lot of coyotes. We average better than a coyote killed every hour of hunting. That average is over three years and 12 days of hunting. (we live three hours apart so it's tough to get together). I suspect if we got together more often our numbers would drop as it is we are able to take the cream of the crop. We have a lot of fun.
I have come to the conclusion that I live in one of the best places in the world to hunt coyotes. I have to believe that we have a better than average coyote population.
Edit: I rechecked the numbers every year we always have had one poor day this will stretch our average out to about one killed every 1.25 hours.
Hey Leonard when are you going to come up and get that wolf?
[ December 11, 2003, 06:25 PM: Message edited by: albert ]
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for what it's worth, eh!
Posts: 195 | From: Parkland, saskatchewan, canada | Registered: Feb 2003
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illinois farm boy
Knows what it's all about
Member # 250
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posted December 11, 2003 06:40 PM
it's all numbers game the more you go the more chances are that you will see one. i live in southeastern illinois lots of people and lots of houses and pets. if i see a coyote 1 in 10-15 stands that is good. may see one 2-3 stands in a row if that happens you know it'll be a while before you see another one. my brother and i have been doing this for about 20 years have called in a lot more than we have killed. don't have much luck with electronic stuff better with mouth calls. if we get a snow with a full moon we go like crazy at night no lights that's the best time for us thanks gary decker
Posts: 14 | From: illinois | Registered: Nov 2003
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Tim Behle
Administrator MacNeal Sector
Member # 209
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posted December 11, 2003 07:30 PM
I expect to kill a coyote on every stand. Just because it is rare for me to call someplace I don't think I will see anything. If an area doesn't look good, I keep going until I find someplace that does.
This year, numbers are down, not real sure how many stands I make between coyotes, but it's a lot more than I'd like to.
I only get a shot at a little under half of the coyotes I call in. If I kill half of what I shoot at, I'm happy. Most days I will go out, make 3-4 stands, then go home. Weekends I will call until about 11. If I kill two coyotes, I will go home early most days.
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Personally, I carry a gun because I'm too young to die and too old to take
an ass kickin'.
Posts: 3160 | From: Five Miles East of Vic, AZ | Registered: Jun 2003
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Pete in Idaho
unknown comic
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posted December 11, 2003 09:40 PM
High coyote populations can dissapear in a hurry.
I've seen it go from extremely good to very poor twice. Once around Goldfield, Nev. in the late 60s and here around Lewiston about 10yrs. ago. In the late 80s & early 90s it was not trick to slip out and call 4 to 6 dogs in a morning, maybe killing 2 or 3. In 2yrs. the roof fell in, so to speak. Now an experienced caller may_____ call and kill 1 in a morning.
Last night I was telling Lonny about a fellow I hunt with some. A good caller, careful hunter who pays attention to whats going on around him, and a good shot. This fellow (Dick) hunt 3 days a week as he is retired. Last couple of years he has averaged 25 coyotes through the winter.
Lonny, Dick, and I are all waiting for the coyote population to pick-up in central Idaho.
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Rich Higgins
unknown comic
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posted December 12, 2003 05:27 AM
Pete, I've seen populations ebb and flow in three different states. I called in 13 coyotes by 11:00 AM with Jay Nistetter west of here Aug. a year ago. That wasn't unusual. This past Sept. didn't call one all morning in the same place. I went through a very dry spell for 2 months here. Calling in proven well producing areas and would blank. Seem to have got my Mojo back. Coyotes are coming in again.
Because I know coyotes should be in the area and should be able to hear me, I expect one on every stand. During my dry period I sometimes just went through the motions without putting any "soul" into the stand. Now that they are running in again I put everything I have into each stand and constantly remain alert and expectant as I constantly scan for shapes, color and movement.
That's what I consider a reasonable expectation now.
Maybe that's what Mojo is.
It will all change again. I hope it won't for a long time.
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Greenside
seems to know what he is talking about
Member # 10
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posted December 12, 2003 06:42 AM
On average, I would say I shoot a coyote on about every 4th or 5th stand. Doesn't seem to make much difference if I'm hunting locally, where I might be able to only make 10 stands a day, or when I go west where I might be able to make 20-25 stands in a day. Over time it just seems to average out in that range.
In my years of calling,he worst streach I've had was 27 consecutive stands without seeing or even hearing a coyote. That was a real test to my confidence.
I think on average I shoot a high percentage of coyotes that come to the call. Maybe 80-85% or higher. Setups are real important to me and I put alot of time and effort in putting myself in position to get the job done.
Dennis
Posts: 719 | From: IA | Registered: Jan 2003
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Locohead
World Famous Smoke Dancer
Member # 15
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posted December 12, 2003 11:04 PM
I'd say maybe an average of 1 coyote to every 3-4 stands in my areas. Un-called areas can produce 6-7 coyotes in 10 stands. But I have to travel atleast 2 hours in any direction to get to really good coyote territory! I've called the mountains around here and only see a coyote about once every 8-10 stands, maybe only one to every 10-12 stands. ![[Confused]](confused.gif)
What do you think Barry?
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I love my critters and chick!!!! :)
Posts: 2219 | From: CO | Registered: Jan 2003
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted December 13, 2003 07:28 AM
Welcome to Illinois farm boy. Glad to have you on board. Hunting at night without a light, eh? I'll have to try that, sometime.
Good hunting. LB
Let me add a few thoughts on this subject, if I may?
Quantifying your responses is hard enough, but have you noticed that it runs in streaks, as well?
I have hunted at night, as a "for instance", and can blank for four hours straight. Then, I get a window of opportunity, and coyotes are everywhere! No, it's not because I've suddenly hit a goldmine. It's because they run in streaks, completely unpredictable. Then, like a door closes, can't buy another coyote for the rest of the night. It can work the same way during day stands, if conditions hold all day, ie: doesn't warm up.
So, how do you average ten empty stands followed by ten productive stands followed by ten unproductive stands? Yeah, I know that's one out of three, but it doesn't seem to tell the whole story, does it? LB
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 32363 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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Steve Craig
Lacks Opposable Thumbs/what's up with that?
Member # 12
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posted December 13, 2003 07:46 AM
Had the pleasure of hunting with one of the members of this board the last three days and called in 16 coyotes, killing 8. The second day was a bust as we had 30 mph winds. Randy did get some great video footage though. Lonny, I believe that a 50% kill rate is about average, all other things being equal. Killed a couple that had mange, one was a light case , the other was pretty bad.Coyote numbers are down all over, few pups raised in the last 2 years due to drought,parvo,mange,etc., but there are pockets if you know where to look for them. Parvo has all but wiped out the grey fox population in northern Az. All vet clinics are reporting parvo showing up in dogs all around here.The good news: cat numbers are exploding all over! I would be willing to bet that there are more bobcats coming to the call than ever before.
FWIW
Steve
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Yes, we did produce a near-perfect republic. But will they keep it? Or will they, in the enjoyment of plenty, lose the memory of freedom? Material abundance without character is the path of destruction. - Thomas Jefferson
Posts: 442 | From: Cottonwood,Az, USA | Registered: Jan 2003
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purdygood
Knows what it's all about
Member # 186
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posted December 13, 2003 05:58 PM
Where I call and hunt of late I have been averaging 1 coyote for every 4-5 stands during my night hunting ventures.and on my daytime calling it has been a lot less something like 1 coyote every 15 stands.
I have hunted and called(or tried to call) predators for the past 2 years prior to this one,and have improved with each year.It also helps to have a target rich enviroment.I try and learn from my mistakes (and there's a lot of them).
My first year I called i 17 and killed 5.I couldn't have been happier.I lost count of how many stands I made but I kept after it once I got my first one.I knew persaverance would eventually pay off.
My second year at it I trippled what I had taken my first year at it but my average was still about the same.I called in 69 and killed 17.
Thus far this year I have been paying closer attention to my set ups and I done a lot of shooting over the summer.Although I haven't had the time to call as much during the day so I've been doing a lot more night calling and my averages are up( I'm no Q by the way ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif) ).
I also think with each animal you call in you get the opportunity to learn from them ,ie;how they approach a call,their body posture,why they hang up,as each one has their own personality.I am still gaining knowledge as I think I know what they should do.Just when I think I have a good idea they do something different(the learning curve).
My goal for the year is to meet what I done the previous year and maybe add a few more to it.As long as I can learn from my mistakes.My expectations are that I would call in at least one on each trip out and if I happen to get one or more then that is my bonus. There are times when it happens in streaks one right after another for a 4-5 satnds and then nothing for 20 or so.
[ December 13, 2003, 06:03 PM: Message edited by: purdygood ]
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If they run they will only die tired
Posts: 20 | From: Lubbock,Texas | Registered: Apr 2003
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Cdog911
"There are some ideas so absurd only an intellectual could believe them."--George Orwell.
Member # 7
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posted December 14, 2003 06:22 PM
[ February 20, 2004, 02:48 PM: Message edited by: Cdog911 ]
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I am only one. But still, I am one. I cannot do everything, but still, I can do something; and, because I cannot do everything, I will not refuse to do something that I can do.
Posts: 5440 | From: The gun-lovin', gun-friendly wild, wild west | Registered: Jan 2003
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onecoyote
Knows what it's all about
Member # 129
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posted December 14, 2003 07:04 PM
This sounds like an easy one to answer, but it's not. I have seen places in Mexico that I use to get big numbers, then all the sudden nothing. I had a place down by the Colorado river I use to kill a ton of fox then nothing again. Nevada for coyotes was easy for years, now very little. What do I expect when I go hunting? I don't have a clue anymore lol. But I can get 1 or 2 around my house most mornings and If I want a cat, that's not to hard either lol PS, notice I didn't say anything about Arizona ![[Roll Eyes]](rolleyes.gif)
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Great minds discuss ideas.....Average minds discuss events.....Small minds discuss people.....Eleanor Roosevelt.
Posts: 893 | From: Walker Lake Nevada. | Registered: Feb 2003
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Curt2u
Knows what it's all about
Member # 74
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posted December 15, 2003 05:19 AM
It seems to vary. This year it has been about 50%. Sometimes more. Sometimes less. Last year was a different story. For whatever reason it was not very good calling. About 25%. This year I expect a coyote pretty much every stand. It has been much better. One thing I like about coyotes is just when you think you have them figured out, they will humble you again.
Take care, Curt
Posts: 236 | From: NW | Registered: Jan 2003
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