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Author Topic: new old timer ? Richard Grantham Knows what it's all about Member # 107 posted February 16, 2003 05:00 PM                   Hi to everyone, Rich Higgins referred me over from PM, this looks much more to my taste. Leonard if this is too commercial wipe out url and let me know, if my url is missing heres my (resume ?) I,m 69, make calls, won 2nd in Arizona state,2nd in Arizona Varmint Caller contest, and missed 3rd place in call off for World contest- all in the 60s. Still like coyote calling better than almost anything!!! I never had any problem calling coyotes, predator masters forumn has some of the dumbest comments and I did,nt like Cronk making calls and being the one to edit post, seems like if I did,nt advertise ???? Enough griping, I,m going to try howling next, my experience always was if a coyote howled at me I figured he had been called and shot at- so I move to next stand- maybe I missed something and sounded like a coyote? I welcome email and comments, shoot a 223 now but leaning toward cameras for my old age . Richard Grantham Schertz, Tx barber@axs4u.net my calls Posts: 44 | From: Schertz, Tx | Registered: Feb 2003  |  IP: Logged Leonard HMFIC Member # 2 posted February 16, 2003 05:42 PM                       Unfortunate circumstances for you, although I'm sure Rich tries to be as objective as possible. I think he's working with some family issues, and I wish him all the best. Welcome to the New Predator Masters, Richard. By the way, I know the registration is confusing, and if you intended to have your screen name shown as barberx, we will have to make a few corrections. If it's not a problem, that's okay, too. As long as you contribute, you can get as commercial as you like. So far, there is wide latitude. I hope it continues. Good hunting. LB -------------------- EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All. Don't piss me off! Posts: 32372 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003  |  IP: Logged 20t-n-t Knows what it's all about Member # 46 posted February 18, 2003 12:40 AM                    Welcome abord the New Huntmasters BBS, Richard Rich is sure packin a load over there and Is a good guy, sorry to read about you mixin it up over at PM. This is a good BB and you will find that most everyone is fair minded. Get with Rich Higgins and get one of his video's you'll learn alot about the vocal end of howling and what not to do just by watching. I been howling for many years and That tape taught me things I never knew. Glad you found your way here. Smote the Yote Slydog -------------------- Teach a kid to hunt and fish and feed them for a lifetime...... Posts: 245 | From: Boise Idaho USA | Registered: Jan 2003  |  IP: Logged Richard Grantham Knows what it's all about Member # 107 posted February 18, 2003 05:38 AM                   Sly-dog, thanks didn,t mean to imply anything about cronk really just letting it out. I,m on to Rich Higgins, he is going to make me a howler in exchange for my calls and we are planning on hooking up this spring when I get back out to Arizona. Wish they had video cameras back when I was really active- I could have made some good ones. Richard Grantham barber@axs4u.net web page Posts: 44 | From: Schertz, Tx | Registered: Feb 2003  |  IP: Logged Wiley E Knows what it's all about Member # 108 posted February 18, 2003 08:26 AM                    Welcome Richard! A bit of advice, Rich Cronk is a good guy if you get to know him. Yeh he gets cranky once in a while just like most of us do. After having the time to think about things he usually comes around. Computers are a terrible form of communication to base judgement of people on. You have no tone of voice and no facial expressions. I have had many people tell me that if they didn't know me personally, they would never know that I was Wiley E. I don't pull punches on a computer screen when I would probably use more tact in person. I try never to focus on WHO is saying something but rather WHAT THEY SAID. I can't remember from one day to the next WHO I respond to as much as I remember WHAT I responded to. Welcome Richard! ~SH~ Posts: 853 | From: Kadoka, S.D | Registered: Feb 2003  |  IP: Logged onecoyote Knows what it's all about Member # 129 posted March 05, 2003 09:20 PM                   Richard, I sure like to see oldtimers in the sport. To many have gone there way and not related some of the history of the sport, I'll bet you can tell some good stories. You've seen this sport go along way over the years and it's good to have you in our forum. There are other forums out there Richard, I'm not going to put any of them down. I well say this much.....I don't think you are going to find more knowledge in a grope of guys then you well here. Welcome and Good Hunting -------------------- Great minds discuss ideas.....Average minds discuss events.....Small minds discuss people.....Eleanor Roosevelt. Posts: 893 | From: Walker Lake Nevada. | Registered: Feb 2003  |  IP: Logged Lone Howl Free Trial Platinum Member & part-time language police Member # 29 posted March 05, 2003 09:45 PM                    Hi Richard! Welcome. -------------------- When tyranny becomes law, rebellion becomes duty. Posts: 2083 | From: Texas | Registered: Jan 2003  |  IP: Logged UTcaller NEVADA NIGHT FIGHTER Member # 8 posted March 06, 2003 08:01 AM                    Richard,welcome to HuntMasters,good to have you.If you are looking to use howling with your calling you are hooked up with the right guy.Rich Higgins knows howling.He made me a howler a while back and they are great.Again good to have you and hope to learn some good stuff from your years of experience.GOOD HUNTING Chad.... Posts: 1708 | From: Utah | Registered: Jan 2003  |  IP: Logged Rich Higgins unknown comic posted March 06, 2003 07:44 PM              I'm really looking forward to meeting and hunting with you, Richard. BTW all. Richard used to hunt with the legendary Bill Dudley in the early 60s when they both worked at Luke AFB. He placed high in the contests and racked up some incredible numbers, like 25 coyotes in one day. It will be interesting and informative to call in some of your old areas and see the difference between now and then. We'll even drag Jay Nistetter along. Might be tough to do. He doesn't like calling much. I received both of your calls, thank you very much. The wood is very well figuered, the finish is flawless and the attention to detail is really impressive. I'm a litle surprised that such a simple design can have so many facets. Thanks Richard. Your howler is in progress. IP: Logged Bob in TX Knows what it's all about Member # 66 posted March 07, 2003 07:14 AM                      Hey Richard, I see you are spreading out! When you get a minute shoot me an e-mail. I still need to get together with you to pick-up a call from you. The past few months have been crazy here, but I am starting to catch up. I will chime in about Rich Cronk too. He really is a nice guy. He has to live with the very strick rules over at PM. Good Hunting, Bob Connell San Antonio, TX bconnell@satx.rr.com Posts: 51 | From: San Antonio, Texas | Registered: Jan 2003  |  IP: Logged onecoyote Knows what it's all about Member # 129 posted March 07, 2003 07:41 AM                   Rich, Sam and Bill Dudley were my Idles back in the early 60s. I always wonderd what happend to Bill Dudley, I finally found out a few years ago from Gerry Blair. Anyway...I heard about the secert places these guys had, But I never did find out where they were at the time, I know now hehehe. I always wondered how anybody could get that many animals. I recall a story about a guy named Del Western who hunted the secert place and in 18 weekends of club hunts he and his partner Benny Murray took 264 coyotes, 8 bobcats and 5 grays, not bad huh? I'm really happy to have such a guy like Richard in our fourm Good Hunting. -------------------- Great minds discuss ideas.....Average minds discuss events.....Small minds discuss people.....Eleanor Roosevelt. Posts: 893 | From: Walker Lake Nevada. | Registered: Feb 2003  |  IP: Logged pup Knows what it's all about Member # 90 posted March 07, 2003 09:50 AM                   Welcome Mr. Grantham- a question for you guys that have been calling since the 50 and 60's. Do you think that coyotes are getting smarter to calling? Or, is it that there are so many people out there calling now as opposed to back then. It seems they are educating the coyotes on an almost wholesale fashion. later pup Posts: 213 | From: Oklahoma | Registered: Feb 2003  |  IP: Logged Wiley E Knows what it's all about Member # 108 posted March 07, 2003 10:20 AM                    DanHehehe: "I recall a story about a guy named Del Western who hunted the secert place and in 18 weekends of club hunts he and his partner Benny Murray took 264 coyotes, 8 bobcats and 5 grays, not bad huh?" The secret place huh? LOL! You crack me up! As far as coyotes getting smarter to calling over the years, that's an easy one. APPROXIMATELY 60% of most coyote populations are young of the year that have never heard a call. Pups are not born with a fear of calling. But then again, I have only been calling since the early 70's so what would I know. LOL! ~SH~ Posts: 853 | From: Kadoka, S.D | Registered: Feb 2003  |  IP: Logged Richard Grantham Knows what it's all about Member # 107 posted March 07, 2003 11:05 AM                   Thanks, guys. The post about Del Western is off a little, believe it or not him and Bennie called in and killed 495 coyotes, 10 bobcats, and 6 foxes, and was the Arizona Field champion> this was the same time I was in second place with 194 coyotes, 20 bobcats, and 5 foxs. Del was a self employed farrier ( horseshoeing)so maybe just had more time off, mine was on weekends only. As for secret places I never saw Del or anyone else while calling, so must have been several SECRET places :>) On educated coyotes I do believe a coyote called and shot AT might be educated a little, doubt if that could be passed on to pups. I think just more people in general and less wildlife. My thoughts . Richard Grantham barber@axs4u.net web page Posts: 44 | From: Schertz, Tx | Registered: Feb 2003  |  IP: Logged coyotebuster Knows what it's all about Member # 131 posted March 07, 2003 12:42 PM                   495 plus 16 other crittres? thats incredibul, in 18 weekends that is 14 animals per day! you didnt do bad either you got over 6 per day. how come you guys dont' still crank out numbers like that? how come NOBODY does? Posts: 21 | From: Rolling on the floor, laughing at PETA'S ignorance | Registered: Feb 2003  |  IP: Logged coyotebuster Knows what it's all about Member # 131 posted March 07, 2003 12:46 PM                   rich higgines, wiley, rich cronk, onecoyote whats the best you guys ever done in a single day? Posts: 21 | From: Rolling on the floor, laughing at PETA'S ignorance | Registered: Feb 2003  |  IP: Logged Wiley E Knows what it's all about Member # 108 posted March 07, 2003 04:09 PM                    Coyote Buster, That is a no win question in this crowd. If I answer it, I may be accused of bragging. If I don't answer it, I may be accused of hiding something. Numbers are subjective to the areas they represent and a poor means of evaluating a persons abilities. Numbers only tell you something if you know the circumstances that surround those numbers. To take big numbers you need to have big numbers. Anyone can be a hero when you have lots of coyotes and excellent calling conditions. I am as impressed with the ADC guys that have the ability to call and kill a rogue pair of sheep killers in the summer as I am with those who kill over 10 coyotes in a day in heavy coyote populations in the winter. If you have to know the answer, send me a private email and I will answer your question as it relates to this area. ~SH~ [ March 07, 2003, 07:57 PM: Message edited by: Wiley E ] Posts: 853 | From: Kadoka, S.D | Registered: Feb 2003  |  IP: Logged onecoyote Knows what it's all about Member # 129 posted March 07, 2003 05:07 PM                   It's simply impossible for one or two guys to kill that many animals, it just can't be done. Somebody had to say it, so I did hehehe, Good Hunting -------------------- Great minds discuss ideas.....Average minds discuss events.....Small minds discuss people.....Eleanor Roosevelt. Posts: 893 | From: Walker Lake Nevada. | Registered: Feb 2003  |  IP: Logged Rich Higgins unknown comic posted March 07, 2003 05:30 PM              I killed a coyote once. Well, I did. I think I hurt one's feelings once, too. I'm not too sure what I was saying on the howler. Back then I didn't speak coyote fluently like I do now. IP: Logged 22-250 Knows what it's all about Member # 36 posted March 07, 2003 06:31 PM                   How is it that in the good old days people could shoot 14 or even 6 coyotes a day for 18 weeks? Do you really think anyone would believe these wild stories? Rich Higgins coyote howling photo is more believable than these stories. Leonard, you were wrong. I could not bag that fifth bobcat. Got five grays on the last day of the season. One double and my first triple. But I could not call a cat to save my life. -------------------- The coyote is a living, breathing allegory of Want. He is always hungry. He is always poor, out of luck and friendless. The meanest creatures despise him and even the flea would desert him for a velocipede. Posts: 108 | From: Longview, Texas, glad to be gone | Registered: Jan 2003  |  IP: Logged Rich Higgins unknown comic posted March 07, 2003 07:25 PM              Oh come on Tom. You believed the howling picture and I believe the numbers stories. I even believed your scary-ass big coyote photo. BTW, when you going to post that? IP: Logged Q-Wagoner FREE TRIAL MEMBERSHIP Member # 33 posted March 07, 2003 08:35 PM                   What are the rules and regs for the California predator hunts? How are they run and how are they judged? Is it on an honor system? Were the 18 weekend hunts in question on consecutive weekends? Did some of the weekends fall in late July and August when they would be calling in 3 and 4 month old puppies? I am just trying to get grasp here guys. Don’t jump to conclusions and think that I am calling anyone a lire either. I know all about the population densities and all the other factors as well. I am just trying to comprehend 18 weekends with out bad weather? I am VERY skeptical of that clamed and I wont make any bones about it. Were they running a trap line in Mexico??? I am not trying to be difficult just give me something to believe in. Good hunting. Q, Posts: 617 | From: Nebraska | Registered: Jan 2003  |  IP: Logged Jay Nistetter Legalize Weed, Free the Dixie Chicks Member # 140 posted March 07, 2003 09:05 PM                    Let's clear the tally up guys. Danny had it alomst right. In 1961 Bennie Murry and Del Western won the Arizona Field Contest by calling up and killing 264 coyotes, 8 bobcats and 6 fox. No mention was made if they were all gray fox or not. AVCA had year-long calling contests and this was tallied in points and not critters. I think this is where the confusion begins. Some are quoting animals and other seem to be quoting points. You gotta understand these guys too. Several of them had access to the reservations and Del was out calling several days out of the week all year long. It was also nothing to be able to drive for five minutes to a place out of town and call and shoot. They weren't hampered by all the restrictions (and volumes of other callers) that we are today. I'm just a recreational, weekend caller. Back in the 80's if I didn't call in 11 "shootable" coyotes in a day, it was a less than average day. Occasionally I will still have one of those days, but back then it was a commonplace. They had lots of fun back then and sometime were less than ethical in today's standards (especially when pulling some practical joke on other callers). I wish I could print some of the stories. -------------------- Understanding the coyote is not as important as knowing where they are. I usually let the fur prime up before I leave 'em lay. Posts: 1006 | From: Arizona | Registered: Feb 2003  |  IP: Logged Rob Knows what it's all about Member # 75 posted March 07, 2003 09:38 PM                    So what became of Bill Dudley and Del Western. The first call I bought was a Circe and the instuction tape was done by them heck it might have been on a 45 rpm record. -------------------- "Where did all these #$%^&* Indians come from?" Gen. George Armstrong Custer Posts: 224 | From: Clancy Montana | Registered: Feb 2003  |  IP: Logged onecoyote Knows what it's all about Member # 129 posted March 08, 2003 01:16 AM                   Rob, I heard Bill Dudley shot himself in the leg with a 243, bleed to death before he could get to a hospital. More to it then that, but that's all the public needs to know. Del Western.....I have no idea? he'd be real old if he is still with us? Jay, your numbers are RIGHT. Richards numbers are right too, but the numbers he come up with should of went like this....495 predators SPOTTED...264 coyotes killed...8 bobcats killed....5 fox killed...these numbers come out of a artical by Pete Brown in a 1964 outdoor life. Jay, what kind of fox live in southern Arizona, gray fox? hehehe. Q, you're a great one. Trust me buddy these numbers are right and we ain't trapping em. It's a different game now days then what it use to be. I'll tell ya what, I think a guy can still go out and get them kind of numbers if he knows where to go, Good Hunting. P.S. I know where to go, I'm just to old to do it hehehe. -------------------- Great minds discuss ideas.....Average minds discuss events.....Small minds discuss people.....Eleanor Roosevelt. Posts: 893 | From: Walker Lake Nevada. | Registered: Feb 2003  |  IP: Logged

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