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Author Topic: Coyote hunters
earthwalker
Cultural Editor & middleweight arm wrestling champion/Intermountain Region
Member # 4177

Icon 1 posted January 06, 2019 08:24 AM      Profile for earthwalker           Edit/Delete Post 
The flood gates opened up.
Seen 2 trucks trying to either call or drive by shooting yesterday. And where one had actually parked and walked into a good spot. Didn't see any drag marks or blood.
Coyotes each day are going past prime now.
Nothing to do in this country but go shoot coyotes.

See so much of these people calling and knowing nothing at all about what they are doing wrong other than educating coyotes. They won't walk, park with vehicle in site of calling area. Driving through calling area then trying to call it. Playing the ever wore out FoxPro dying rabbit blues. Then can't figure it out.

They have a coyote contest down in one town. But it's more of a killing contest. You can call, drive by shoot. Greyhound and even snowmobile hunting/running down. Where is the contest and experience in these contests?
One reason I don't believe in these contests or budding/party calling.

But still learning a lot and figuring things are at a faster pace now.

I guess just a little annoyed at the so called sportsmen now days and venting. Thanks for putting up with me.

[ January 06, 2019, 08:26 AM: Message edited by: earthwalker ]

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You are never lost if you don't care where you're at.

Send rain and snow please! Send Lots of RAIN!
No lightning please

Posts: 472 | From: Intermountain region | Registered: Jul 2012  |  IP: Logged
Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2

Icon 1 posted January 06, 2019 10:23 AM      Profile for Leonard   Author's Homepage   Email Leonard         Edit/Delete Post 
It's a big tent.

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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!

Posts: 26074 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003  |  IP: Logged
Lone Howl
Free Trial Platinum Member & part-time language police
Member # 29

Icon 1 posted January 06, 2019 10:48 AM      Profile for Lone Howl   Author's Homepage   Email Lone Howl         Edit/Delete Post 
One reason game cops aint liking coyote hunters around here is that there is a faction that runs them down with pickups or buggys. They tear up shit and act like a bunch of idiots so we all get a bad rap. It has also lead to guys locking gates and putting up access barriers.

Mark

[ January 06, 2019, 10:48 AM: Message edited by: Lone Howl ]

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www.varmintsinc.com

When tyranny becomes law, rebellion becomes duty.

Posts: 2019 | From: Porterville Kalifornia | Registered: Jan 2003  |  IP: Logged
NVWalt
Knows what it's all about
Member # 375

Icon 1 posted January 06, 2019 12:30 PM      Profile for NVWalt           Edit/Delete Post 
It's not new at all. Over the last 20+ years I have been watching this happen in Nevada,Utah and Wyoming. Everywhere I went. And I am sure that isn't the only place. I, in particular, blame Foxpro and the coyote hunting shows. All you need is a Foxpro and a gun and watch a few shows like Coyote Country add nauseum and you are instantly a qualified coyote control agent or wanna be coyote hunter. Sign of the times as far as I can tell.
Sighhhh I do miss those old days when if you did run into a coyote hunter out in the brush you mainly were interested in what brand of mouthcall and or howler he was using. Not what hundred number he happened to fool a pup with on his Foxpro.
Like I said it's a sign of the times.
Kinda like a flyfisherman that doesn't tie his own flies. Or a so call shooter that doesn't reload. But they learned it all on those stupid tv shows and on line..
End of rant on my part for now anyways!!!

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I love beautiful women,fine wine and poking dead things with a stick.

Posts: 268 | From: Tellico Plains, TN | Registered: Aug 2004  |  IP: Logged
Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2

Icon 1 posted January 06, 2019 12:49 PM      Profile for Leonard   Author's Homepage   Email Leonard         Edit/Delete Post 
The above is very true and I don't have a solution. All I can do is shrug and think about the good old days. At one time, in my club, you could get disqualified if they discovered a tape deck in your vehicle. One that was capable of playing Johnny Stewart 8 track tapes. The purity angle. Then enforcement got it the way, you can't police ethics, etc. BTW they are effective.

The main thing is, rather than a very effective tool, used properly, the electronics allowed entry to a bunch of people that had bypassed the skill steps, for lack of a better word.

Besides the claim that it's not a repetitious sound, or the claim that it won't work, but it does, up to a point. That point was reached many years ago and 101C has been heard by 3 or 4 generations of coyotes, probably more?

I can't help it, I do blame Foxpro for queering coyote hunting as I learned it, in the 1960's. I can't even hazard a guess as to how many more "coyote hunters" are out there...(and I use the term loosely) But just to grab a number out of mid air, possibly a factor of 100? Prove me wrong? There is no question that calling coyotes pretty much originated in California. Yes, you could say that Burnham was calling a bit in Texas, but It really didn't amount to much. Same with Johnny Stewart. The CVCA in southern California really started the ball rolling, and this was before anybody had electronics. Yes, it was revolving around contests, primarily.

I know, I was there.

Good hunting. El Bee

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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!

Posts: 26074 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003  |  IP: Logged
earthwalker
Cultural Editor & middleweight arm wrestling champion/Intermountain Region
Member # 4177

Icon 1 posted January 08, 2019 05:21 AM      Profile for earthwalker           Edit/Delete Post 
It's just the ethic's I see now a days. Which there is none.
Not one of these coyote hunters has or knows any history about coyotes or the hunting of them.

There is a small group of greyhounders here. Then the flood gate that is all of the counties in eastern Idaho that start with a "B". Fondly known as the "Killer B's".

Just such a new eye opening experience. We knew it was out there but to see it first hand is always sad. You would think the amount of money that is spent for weekend fun they would learn how to "do" it right.

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You are never lost if you don't care where you're at.

Send rain and snow please! Send Lots of RAIN!
No lightning please

Posts: 472 | From: Intermountain region | Registered: Jul 2012  |  IP: Logged
knockemdown
Our staff photo editing Guru, par excellence
Member # 3588

Icon 1 posted January 08, 2019 06:06 AM      Profile for knockemdown   Author's Homepage           Edit/Delete Post 
Sure is depressing when blanket statements & sweeping generalities are cast, if only to malign an entire segment of outdoorsmen. And especially so, when they're coming from fellow outdoorsmen...

Or, maybe I'm just not 'experienced' enough to be able to deduce the motives, experience level and personal beliefs of a fellow hunter by simply looking at their vehicle roll across the prairie?

At the same time, and with respect, I can appreciate how the 'elder folk' sometimes have a penchant for 'venting' & mourning the loss of 'the good ol days'. Just sayin, don't use all that knowledge & experience as an excuse to diss someone else, who's likely just trying to enjoy their own version of "the great outdoors". The fact that their version doesn't exactly mirror your own, shouldn't be surprising...

Food for thought?

[ January 08, 2019, 06:09 AM: Message edited by: knockemdown ]

Posts: 2148 | From: behind fascist lines | Registered: Mar 2010  |  IP: Logged
Kokopelli
SENIOR DISCOUNT & Dispenser of Sage Advice
Member # 633

Icon 1 posted January 08, 2019 06:13 AM      Profile for Kokopelli   Author's Homepage           Edit/Delete Post 
Ethics ????
These days technology has replaced woodsmanship and the Polaris has replaced the still-hunting boots.
The new standard is a reflection of the current hunting shows where the hero 'harvests' the BUCK OF A LIFETIME ………. again this week.
It's a brave new world.

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When urinating outdoors, remember to face East, toward Mecca whenever possible.

Posts: 5152 | From: Under a wandering star | Registered: Apr 2005  |  IP: Logged
knockemdown
Our staff photo editing Guru, par excellence
Member # 3588

Icon 1 posted January 08, 2019 06:45 AM      Profile for knockemdown   Author's Homepage           Edit/Delete Post 
Yep, and "all cops are pigs"
And..."all Trump supporters are racists"
And... "(INSERT ANY OTHER flawed circular reasoning)"

Just sayin, you're applying the same 'logic' that the fakestreammedialibtardians use to nurture and maintain a divide amongst our citizens. Funny, that...or sad???

Posts: 2148 | From: behind fascist lines | Registered: Mar 2010  |  IP: Logged
DAA
Utah/Promoted WESTERN REGIONAL Hunt Director
Member # 11

Icon 1 posted January 08, 2019 07:41 AM      Profile for DAA   Author's Homepage   Email DAA         Edit/Delete Post 
They still have hunting shows?

I never watched them. But now I don't even get any of those channels, so couldn't even if I was interested.

It's definitely just a different world than it used to be. From my perspective, as far as coyote hunting, things have certainly gotten worse than they used to be.

I just blame it on progress.

Not that it's any harder to kill coyotes than it has ever been. It's not. You think they get pressured now? It's not as bad as it was back when less than 100 coyote pelts equaled a new pickup truck! When I first started going with my Dad in the mid 70's, a coyote was worth about $75 and a new F250 was about $6K. There was some mother fucking PRESSURE on coyotes around here back then! Just think what it would be like now if coyotes were worth $500 each. I honestly don't think they get pounded as hard now, as they did then.

And as far as "ethics", I haven't seen anything at all, to indicate they have gotten any worse? I don't see people doing anything any more stupid, or illegal, or rude, or selfish than what I have always seen. People have ALWAYS been like that. All the absolute worst behavior by any kind of hunters I have ever personally witnessed have all been coyote hunters. Especially contest hunters, going way back to the first time I ever became aware of contest hunting - when I helped a team cheat in the Utah state championship, ha-ha! Have seen much ass hattery, law breaking and just complete ass hole, idiotic, dangerous, illegal actions by contest hunters. But I have seen some of all that by just plain old coyote hunters not in contests too.

But going back to when I started, that's just how it was with coyote hunters. There was MONEY driving it. Always anything they could do to get a leg up on the competition or put a couple more furs towards that new truck. Ethics never seemed to matter to a lot of them.

If anything, my opinion, in terms of percentage of the total population of coyote hunters, ethics have been steadily rising and getting better. I would attribute this to the simple fact that outside of contest hunting, there is no money in it anymore. Used to be big money in it, for everyone.

But the experience, has certainly gotten worse. Simple human population growth is the biggest reason. There are more than three times as many people living in northern Utah than there was when I killed my first called coyote. They all need houses to live in, places to work, grocery stores, churches, roads to drive on. All of the places my Dad and I used to call when I was a kid are developed now. Can't hunt there. Not only can't hunt, but can't escape the presence of people.

Just way more people and lots of development taking away habitat.

I'm not sure if there are more people trying to call coyotes now or not. Used to be, EVERYONE hunted coyotes. Now, that is not the case. But with so many more people, maybe there as many or even more callers now? Not sure. But there is definitely less room to fit them all in.

The places to hunt have shrunk dramatically. Not just from development, but simply the changes in the habitat. Just huge areas west and south of Salt Lake that used to be healthy sagebrush habitat, aren't anymore. Wild horses, fire, cheat grass, climate change. They have transformed vast areas that were just awesome rabbitat back in the day to cheat grass wasteland that doesn't support nearly the healthy varmint population those areas once did. Not even a fraction of the life that habitat used to sustain exists today. What was once a vast area of decent calling, is now a vast area you have to drive through in search of decent calling.

That huge new human population loves to get out and recreate in all that space too. Very few of them are hunting. But they are all blasting around in dirt machines, camping in their 5th wheelers, etc. Free country, good for them, but it does nothing to contribute to a quality coyote hunting experience.

Technology has played a huge role too, of course. I'm not talking about electronic callers - they haven't done anything to effect my hunting that I can see. I'm talking transportation technology, communications technology and location technology. Between vastly more capable and reliable vehicles than the "old days", comms that make even the newest noob feel "safe" no matter where he is and location/GPS tech that allows them to navigate effortlessly, there are just tons and tons of people showing up in places that they never used to when it seemed (and actually kinda was) "dangerous".

Toss in information on places to go they see on the 'net or the 'grams and it's a perfect shit storm of people showing up in masses where there used to never be any. Coyote hunters, both new and old, very much utilizing all this technology too.

My opinion, a "Foxpro" is just ants in the afterbirth and of no consequence in the grand scheme. What's the difference between it and the JS tapes everybody was all playing 40 years ago? Absolutely nothing, far as I can tell.

Coyotes don't seem any harder to call now, than they ever were, to me. Finding places to call has gotten a whole heckuva lot harder though.

Progress.

- DAA

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"Oh yeah, they're gonna talk to you, and talk to you, and talk to you about individual freedom, but they see a free individual, it's gonna scare 'em." -- George Hanson, Easy Rider, 1969.

Rocky Mountain Varmint Hunter

Posts: 2637 | From: Salt Lake City, UT | Registered: Jan 2003  |  IP: Logged
DiYi
Wears wife's pink panties under his camo for good luck. (yeah, right!)
Member # 3785

Icon 1 posted January 08, 2019 08:39 AM      Profile for DiYi           Edit/Delete Post 
Yes DAA nailed it.And thanks Fred.
Posts: 583 | From: SoDak | Registered: Feb 2011  |  IP: Logged
UTcaller
NEVADA NIGHT FIGHTER
Member # 8

Icon 1 posted January 08, 2019 08:59 AM      Profile for UTcaller   Email UTcaller         Edit/Delete Post 
Very well said Dave. I can’t think of one damn thing I disagree with in your assessment.

Good Hunting Chad

Posts: 1495 | From: Utah | Registered: Jan 2003  |  IP: Logged
Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2

Icon 1 posted January 08, 2019 09:01 AM      Profile for Leonard   Author's Homepage   Email Leonard         Edit/Delete Post 
That's what they call Noir in France. When I blame "Foxpro" I'm using it as a generic that includes Johnny Stewart, any electronic machine, digital or tape or chip. Anything besides a hand call. But then again, Foxpro is guilty of something, like making anybody a coyote hunter. Another thing. City coyotes may be harder to call and then again, depending on time of day, well, you never know?

Then, of course, I think of the rancher with 200 Angus and scattered on several separated pastures. This guy swore up and down that the coyotes weren't "hunted" on his land. I think he defined "hunting" as watching Kelly make a stand on Furtakers. By that yardstick, his coyotes weren't "hunted". But, every time he drove up on his "girls", he would put his Foxpro on the hood of his pickup while he fed his cows. And any coyote hankering for a colostrum or two would run the other way just as soon as he heard "Lightning Jack". And, he would unlimber his AR and let fly 5 or 6 rounds at a coyote running full blast, and seldom did he connect. But, for his definition, his coyotes weren't hunted because he didn't sit a stand beside a bush like on TV. However, every single coyote we saw on his property was running the other way, not to mention that he had given his lawyer permission to swing a spotlight all night, the night before we got there. But, this guy seriously thought his coyotes were unhunted behind locked gates, as shown on TV. That was some of the hardest hunting I've ever experienced and it was pure luck rather than skill that we managed to kill 2 in a weekend. All I'm saying is there are different yardsticks and

As a general rule, hunting coyotes ain't like it used to be. I think I can say that without fear of contradiction? I also know that the words "coyote hunt contest"and "ethics" belong in different worlds, but before the money got in the way and corrupted contests just like bass tournaments, we felt that we had a few ethical standards, at least to our mind, and anyway, we tried. Of course, if something can be fucked up, it eventually will be fucked up.

All that being said, I really do miss the good old days.

Good hunting. El Bee

edit: I remember, one year the huntmaster of CSVCA added a cash prize for the top ten. I remember winning $7 for finishing seventh, (I think?) a 1 year experiment and we never did it again, went back to belt buckles and trophies. So, "we" didn't corrupt contests, back in the good old days.

[ January 08, 2019, 09:10 AM: Message edited by: Leonard ]

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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!

Posts: 26074 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003  |  IP: Logged
knockemdown
Our staff photo editing Guru, par excellence
Member # 3588

Icon 1 posted January 08, 2019 10:03 AM      Profile for knockemdown   Author's Homepage           Edit/Delete Post 
Contests have indeed evolved into $$$ generation for the host(s). Whether a % of proceeds go to a charitable organization, possibly a sick or disenfranchised person/family, or even to help fund the local volunteer fire dept., $$$ prize $$$ drives the participation. And that % drives the effort to promote & host...

There always gonna be cheats who try to buck the system, but most hunters in ones I go to seem to sign up for the right reasons. And it seems that words gets around bout some of the (very few) bad eggs, and they're subsequently blackballed from entering...

Can see that some contests have adopted 'stringer weights', instead of outright body count, as a means to level the playing field for those who have limited ground to access. IMHO, smart move to keep participation appealing, as ya only need a couple coyotes to be in the running. And, big dog & big cat is always up for grabs...

So long as rules are in place to maintain a semblance of fairness, the whole enchilada is a friggjn pisser! Just gotta make sure you're having fun, and don't take yourself too seriously, cuz we all know how coyotes can make fools outta anyone! That's what keeps us chasing em...

Posts: 2148 | From: behind fascist lines | Registered: Mar 2010  |  IP: Logged
Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2

Icon 1 posted January 08, 2019 10:26 AM      Profile for Leonard   Author's Homepage   Email Leonard         Edit/Delete Post 
You are pulling my pants down, Fred. You know, "knows it all and done it all"? What the hell is "stringer weights"?

We wait with minnow on lip.

(baited breath)

edit; oh, and that $7 I won was before you were born, Junior. (just kidding)

[ January 08, 2019, 10:28 AM: Message edited by: Leonard ]

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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!

Posts: 26074 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003  |  IP: Logged
knockemdown
Our staff photo editing Guru, par excellence
Member # 3588

Icon 1 posted January 08, 2019 11:13 AM      Profile for knockemdown   Author's Homepage           Edit/Delete Post 
Lol, sorry!
Instead of awarding finishing order by number of dead bodies, most to least, a given number of coyotes is established as your stringer, and the heaviest total weight of your stringer is what determines the winner...

If the stringer is set at four coyotes, then any team who kills four coyotes has a shot at winning with the combined weight of those four.

Naturally, if a team kills more than that, they're afforded the luxury of picking their heaviest four coyotes to serve as their total weight. So, there is still motivation to kill big numbers to have your pick. While at the same time, doesn't shut the less prolific killing teams from having a fighting chance at taking home a prize...

Makes sense to me!

Posts: 2148 | From: behind fascist lines | Registered: Mar 2010  |  IP: Logged
knockemdown
Our staff photo editing Guru, par excellence
Member # 3588

Icon 1 posted January 08, 2019 11:18 AM      Profile for knockemdown   Author's Homepage           Edit/Delete Post 
Just think if you were Joe average hunter, without a ton of land to hunt...and contest stringer was three coyotes. Heck, that's not too far a stretch to think you could kill three in a day. So, why not throw yer hat in the ring???

Whereas, absent a set stringer... if ya knew a couple teams entering were ringers with good ground secured and a legit chance to haul in double digit numbers, would ya be so quick to wanna pay your entry fee?

Prolly not!

Posts: 2148 | From: behind fascist lines | Registered: Mar 2010  |  IP: Logged
Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2

Icon 1 posted January 08, 2019 12:19 PM      Profile for Leonard   Author's Homepage   Email Leonard         Edit/Delete Post 
OK thanks. Just a gimmick. As near as I can tell, 4 coyotes weighing 80 pounds would lose to 4 coyotes that weighed 81 pounds? BFD.

I have never been in favor of anything like big dog and little dog, or any yardstick except number of dead coyotes, of any size.

What queers the whole deal is the locked gates, prime unhunted country and that does not even the playing field.

We never had a problem that way because everybody out here hunts public land, be it BLM, National Forest, state trust but nobody hunting behind locked gates.

Therefore, it's all bullshit, these days. There's always some angle some advantage that somebody tries to take advantage of, even if it's using a REDLINE. (just kidding, Fred)

Who the fuck dreamed that one up? stringer? Our coyotes averaged 25 pounds and yours were only 24.5 and you are in last place, a loser!

Oh, I know there are people that put great stock in killing big dogs, or old dogs with their teeth half way worn down. I guess pups are gullible? Yes, they can be, and they can also be extremely shy and wait in the bushes while the big dog runs in. Yes, sometimes. That's like awarding an extra point for a white tip. That one went over like a lead balloon at St Francis. Fact is, many years ago, it was kind of rare to see a white tail, now they are sorta common. Maybe we should have stringers of all dumb female coyotes? Whatever.

I will say this, sometimes it seems you can't call and kill anything but dog coyotes, they seem to run in streaks? Other times, who cares? Of a pair, which one will be leading, and get shot first? I don't keep meaningless statistics like that. But, I have noticed strings of males, and sometimes, a preponderance of females. BFD

Good hunting. El Bee

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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!

Posts: 26074 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003  |  IP: Logged
knockemdown
Our staff photo editing Guru, par excellence
Member # 3588

Icon 1 posted January 08, 2019 12:54 PM      Profile for knockemdown   Author's Homepage           Edit/Delete Post 
Like I said, the "heaviest 3" or 4, or whatever, is becoming more the norm. Least for the Okie hunts, it is. And, makes sense, from the participatory standpoint...

Course, we all have the choice to enter, or not. Remember, for every team that's dead set on winning, there's prolly another Pop & Son team (or the like) who's just happy to enter and take part in the festivities. So, if ya give those teams a semi realistic path to winning something, then you're gonna make for an all around better contest. More teams, more excitement, bigger payout, and a larger Vig for the promoters to walk away with. Not hard to see whyt this format is gaining popularity...

Also, beats staying home to watch football!

[ January 08, 2019, 12:55 PM: Message edited by: knockemdown ]

Posts: 2148 | From: behind fascist lines | Registered: Mar 2010  |  IP: Logged
Ariel Perez
Knows what it's all about
Member # 4678

Icon 1 posted January 08, 2019 01:39 PM      Profile for Ariel Perez   Email Ariel Perez         Edit/Delete Post 
I’m not a big fan of big dog or the heavy 7 types of contest. I get that it levels the playing field and makes it more appealing to the average joe but now we are starting to sound like a bunch of liberals catering to the teams that don’t put in enough work or preparation.

By no means am I saying I’m above the average joe but why should we cater to the father/son team who is doing it for fun when team all star have been putting in their homework to make sure they are killing double digits??

I know every state is different but the excuse of not having enough land or property to hunt is a lousy excuse. Some guys decide to use their free time to scout and prepare for a hunt and find new land to hunt or whatever it may be, while others just wing it and expect to kill double digits but then get bent out of shape when they only kill 4 and somebody shows up with 15.

The Texas championship does a 12 coyotes limit, first to kill 12 wins and I like that idea otherwise the numbers would be in the mid to high 20’s I’m sure.

Anyhow like I said before I’m not a big fan of those kinds of hunts, I have never entered one and I probably never will. Leonard kills 15 coyotes and I kill 4 monster males and I win?? No sir I’ll pass

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AP

Posts: 53 | From: South/eastern Az | Registered: May 2016  |  IP: Logged
knockemdown
Our staff photo editing Guru, par excellence
Member # 3588

Icon 1 posted January 08, 2019 03:49 PM      Profile for knockemdown   Author's Homepage           Edit/Delete Post 
quote:
By no means am I saying I’m above the average joe but why should we cater to the father/son team who is doing it for fun when team all star have been putting in their homework to make sure they are killing double digits??
Why....really?

Who's $$$ do you think the better teams stand to win?

Do you think teams would enter a contest, just to win back their own entry fee? Course not, so the extra $$$ gotta come from somewhere...

Simple fact is, without those Pop & son teams, lotsa contests would fall flat on their face, for lack of participation.

Lack of participation = small purses

Small purses = lack of interest

And, downward goes the spiral....

Please know, when I go out there, my partner has PLENTY of private ground for us to hunt, and if the coyotes wanna show up, we're gonna mop em up. Just sayin, my point of view is one from a team that'd benefit MORE from the max. dead body count style of scoring....

All I'm doing is sharing what's happening, and why. Simply re-stated, contest hunts have become a fundraising event as much, or more than anything.

Sure, belt buckles still have merit, but lotsa recreationally minded teams just ain't gonna enter a contest where they've only got a snowball's chance in he!! of killing more coyote than some 'big name' entrants who've got ranch after ranch after ranch locked up for themselves. As explained, this very factor is what drives the change, because that's exactly what happened to catalyze changing to "heaviest #" scoring platform...

quote:
Leonard kills 15 coyotes and I kill 4 monster males and I win?? No sir I’ll pass

Believe me, if someone rolls in with a haul like that, they will have earned the respect of every team there. Even if they still got milk on their lips...

[ January 08, 2019, 03:55 PM: Message edited by: knockemdown ]

Posts: 2148 | From: behind fascist lines | Registered: Mar 2010  |  IP: Logged
UTcaller
NEVADA NIGHT FIGHTER
Member # 8

Icon 1 posted January 08, 2019 04:24 PM      Profile for UTcaller   Email UTcaller         Edit/Delete Post 
I definitely see both sides of this issue. We’ve hunted in some of the big contests a few times and I can say they are a lot of fun. I do see the idea that the teams that put in the time and effort should not be penalized for that. But then again what are you proving when you(team A) have the only access to a few ranches that are locked up and hold lots of coyotes and haven’t had any pressure, and go out and kill 20 in a day and a half. And (team B) goes out and scouts the hell out of Public land and find Coyotes but they have been pressured to beat hell and you end up killing 7 or 8 coyotes. Who’s the real Champ here..... I remember Scott Huber saying once, if you really want to even the playing field, have the contest on Public land only and have teams draw areas to hunt. Then let them scout those areas and see who can come up with the most coyotes.

Good Hunting Chad

Posts: 1495 | From: Utah | Registered: Jan 2003  |  IP: Logged
Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2

Icon 1 posted January 08, 2019 04:28 PM      Profile for Leonard   Author's Homepage   Email Leonard         Edit/Delete Post 
I dunno? Lots of ways to look at these things. I'm way past trying to drum up participation by giving somebody a lottery ticket chance of winning by a goofy format.

Besides, I don't think these contests are geared towards a father and son team and artificially tinkering with the rules to give them a chance, to me smacks of catering rather than what I thought was the object, which is skill. Not withstanding all the access considerations and tilting the playing field.

Truthfully, I think it's long past the point where they have managed to fuck up the whole concept. It's not like it used to be in the CSVCA. Crimminy sakes, we were a club, not a bunch of hired guns, total strangers with a single motivation; win the money. No wonder they talk about ethics, nobody has any. I've heard stories about teams pooling animals, stuff like that.

I know one thing, when I first started, I had a lot of suspicion about the guys that were throwing down the big kills. At some point, I got better and understood that those things don't just happen without a lot of work.

I don't know? But fiddling with weighing so many animals, I'm sorry because I don't know what the hell we are measuring anymore?

Good hunting. El Bee

--------------------
EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!

Posts: 26074 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003  |  IP: Logged
Lonny
PANTS ON THE GROUND
Member # 19

Icon 1 posted January 08, 2019 05:18 PM      Profile for Lonny           Edit/Delete Post 
Well said DAA.

I was just getting hunting during those high-price days for coyotes and man that seemed like a lot of money to a kid. I figured if I killed two coyotes I could buy myself a new variable Leupold scope.

Everybody had a coyote rifle and place to take care of hides during that boom.

Honestly, it doesn't bother me a bit if the price of coyote hides is in the tank. When there is money in it things don't get better in my opinion.

Speaking of coyotes being worth something... Is the Utah bounty still in place? Are the deer herds thriving again? That was why the bounty was set up in the first place wasn't it, to save deer?

Posts: 1191 | From: Lewiston, Idaho USA | Registered: Jan 2003  |  IP: Logged
UTcaller
NEVADA NIGHT FIGHTER
Member # 8

Icon 1 posted January 08, 2019 05:53 PM      Profile for UTcaller   Email UTcaller         Edit/Delete Post 
Lonny it’s funny you say that about everybody having a coyote rifle back then. I remember back in the mid 80’s all I wanted was .222 Remington. Seemed like most of the Coyote callers I knew had them. I was shooting my Dads .243 Winchester at the time and was saving all the money I could for that .222. But by the time I had the money saved to buy my gun, a buddy of my dads had been shooting a .22-250 Remington and I saw what he did with it. So I changed my tune and bought a Remington 700 in .22-250 and have been so glad I did. Shot that rifle off and on for damn near 25 years. Then I rebarreled it to .22-250 AI Several years back. Damn I love that rifle.

Good Hunting Chad

Posts: 1495 | From: Utah | Registered: Jan 2003  |  IP: Logged


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