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Author Topic: 22 CM
CrossJ
SECOND PLACE: PAUL RYAN Look-a-like contest
Member # 884

Icon 1 posted July 23, 2018 04:37 PM      Profile for CrossJ   Email CrossJ         Edit/Delete Post 
quote:
Just kidding, don't take me serious, you fellas that jumped on board. Geordie? lol
No worries Lb, I never take you seriously! LOL!

I get your points, and I agree, but the truth is, its kinda fun. I mean heck, gun smiths and machinists need work too! Its kinda like auto racing (which doesnt interest me) in that a lot of things are learned in those extreme conditions that benefit those of us less extreme. I dont think many experienced coyote hunters are going to build a fast twist long range rig as a primary hunting rifle. I do believe that getting out and banging steel consistently at long ranges makes a person a better shooter, at least in certain disciplines.

The whole deal is similar to raising boys. They do things the way they want regardless of what you tell them....eventually they figure out that maybe the old man was right. In the mean time just nod and smile.

Maintain

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A friend will help you move. A good friend will help you move a body.

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Eddie
Knows what it's all about
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Icon 1 posted July 23, 2018 05:12 PM      Profile for Eddie   Author's Homepage           Edit/Delete Post 
I'm one Okie that is still shooting a 22-250.
Awhile back the 204 was the next big thing, then came all the 17 teens. Now you got 22 CM.
Never got into the long range shooting, hell where I hunt a 200yrd shot is long one.
Not telling what these guys will be shooting next year. I think AP made the right call going back to the 243, he already had the bullet and load worked up and it was doing what he wanted so why change.

Posts: 275 | From: Oklahoma | Registered: Feb 2013  |  IP: Logged
Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2

Icon 1 posted July 23, 2018 06:13 PM      Profile for Leonard   Author's Homepage   Email Leonard         Edit/Delete Post 
I agree with that, mostly. But I'm looking at it from the perspective of been there, done that. I've built my share of rifles. It was real important, too. The wait was intolerable. And the quest, anticipation, the thrill, (if that's the right word?) of working up a load and plotting the accuracy and velocity. Yes, it was exciting, almost consuming and always seemed to take too long, inception to completion. After a while....well, I guess I either got my fill of exotic ultra performance chamberings. That nobody else had, of course. well, not unique, but uncommon. I'm not an actual trailblazer like Fred. But, not knocking trailblazers. There are just too many solutions to reinvent the wheel unnecessarily.

I know everybody has an idea, 17's, screaming 22's and about a million overbored excess capacity cartridges nobody ever heard of. I knew a couple guys in San Gabriel Chapter, one guy said he was a rifleman. they hunted out of a Ford station wagon. He had a seat mounted on top of the tailgate, and the older guy drove. But, he used target rifle chambered in 300 Win Mag. This was very unusual in the 1960's when everybody else was using calibers more suited for prairie dogs; you know, varmints?

in our club, between 50/75 members, they were getting into target barrels and sometimes, bench rest calibers, for the accuracy potential. This was before I had heard much about custom bench rest actions. Anyway, we had a member that was a bench rester and knew what was needed. He built several rifles for me, a lot faster than sending all the parts to a gunsmith in another state. But, my first dream rifle was built by P O Ackley himself. The only thing he got wrong was somehow lost the rings I sent him, some real fancy Conetrol rings, but I loved that rifle, chambered in 25'06Ackley, thumbhole laminated stock. Honest to God, half inch 200 yard groups! I really felt that I couldn't miss with that gun. It was stolen, New Year's Eve 1974. Never saw it again. I also lost my first varmint caliber then, a 6mmRemington that I bought as an interim while waiting for that 25'06 from Utah. Hmm? Just happened to think, I've had 3 25'06's and 3, 6mmRemington's. That 6mm Remington, no flies on that cartridge, always preferred it to 243W.

To demonstrate how far the needle has swung the other way, my current daylight coyote rifle is a 22-243 Middlested that I got in an estate sale from a man that died but he was a considerable marksman and had documented every shot like some of the military types do. Anyway, I wasn't worried, it's a good sound rifle, shoots very good and I didn't have to wait a year before shooting it. It came with two barrels, I've never even screwed the other one on, but it's in 22-250 Ackley. If accuracy ever falls off, I'm back in business in 20 minutes. I think I made a good deal....and that's where my head is at, building custom rifles, these days.

Down Memory Lane with LB

Good hunting. El Bee

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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!

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Paul Melching
Radical Operator Forum "You won't get past the front gate"
Member # 885

Icon 1 posted July 24, 2018 04:55 AM      Profile for Paul Melching           Edit/Delete Post 
I envy you guys ,like Fred and Leonard that really understand what they are doing . I know just enough to be dangerous hence my customizing comes down to working up a load .

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Kokopelli
SENIOR DISCOUNT & Dispenser of Sage Advice
Member # 633

Icon 1 posted July 24, 2018 05:26 AM      Profile for Kokopelli   Author's Homepage           Edit/Delete Post 
Paul, it's a disease that they have building rifles.
Like searching for the Holy Grail or chasing rainbows. Gets into their blood and they can't stop. There's no known cure.
BTW; working up loads can be a 'gateway drug' to building rifles. Be very careful.
Now, if you'll excuse me, I'm in the middle of making eight dozen arrows and need to get back out to the fletching jigs & feather burner. Maybe adjust the forward of center balance just a bit ……...

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And lo, the Light of the Trump shown upon the Darkness and the Darkness could not comprehend it.

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knockemdown
Our staff photo editing Guru, par excellence
Member # 3588

Icon 1 posted July 24, 2018 06:11 AM      Profile for knockemdown   Author's Homepage           Edit/Delete Post 
Geordie...
Since photosuckit shit the bed, I've been using IMGUR
Same premise, upload & add IMG link to body of post. Or, copy/paste a tab after hitting IMAGE button below...

I kinda sorta compare cartridges by capacity. With that in mid, the .22Creed is pretty man ch nipping at the heels of a .22-243Win in boiler room. But, the allure seems to be the ability to chop the barrel down to "can friendly" length, then run a slightly faster burn powder to re-claim the velocity lost. So, ya pretty much got a suppressed .22 cal hotrod that isn't overly long/clumsy with a 6-8" can screwed on....

If I lived in a can friendly state, I might dabble with something like that? But, instead I still run my .22-243AI which runs on super slow burn powder to build speed with mild pressure curve.

Different means to the same end. That being, get a .22cal 75gr bullet running up& over 3500fps. Once you achieve that speed, the fast twist combo is justified as it shoots nearly as flat as a 55@4k to 300, then begins to walk away from there...

Shot my .220REDLINE again at a bunch of chucks over the weekend. 75JLK dope trued @ 3990fps, in the warm temps, and seeing how fast that bullets gets to 500+yds is frickin' UNREAL...

Posts: 2202 | From: behind fascist lines | Registered: Mar 2010  |  IP: Logged
Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2

Icon 1 posted July 24, 2018 06:33 AM      Profile for Leonard   Author's Homepage   Email Leonard         Edit/Delete Post 
And you should talk! "Gateway Drug" sure sounds like eight dozen arrows Don't they have some kind of high capacity restriction in that state? No doubt, an awesome quiver?

edit: Fred, what we need is step by step for idiots who don't know what a tab is? Posting a link is ok I guess, but what me and ko ko don't understand is; how to make the photo appear within the text?

[ July 24, 2018, 06:42 AM: Message edited by: Leonard ]

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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!

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TOM64
Knows what it's all about
Member # 561

Icon 1 posted July 24, 2018 09:28 AM      Profile for TOM64           Edit/Delete Post 
Best thing about the 22cm is you can use the brass in your 22-250ai I've read. Other than that it ain't nothing special, just generally chambered in fast twist barrels. 3500 with a 75 A max? I doubt it.

I'm almost ready to switch back to 55 gr bullets from the 75's. I just haven't seen the big difference.

Posts: 2283 | From: okieland | Registered: Feb 2005  |  IP: Logged
Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2

Icon 1 posted July 24, 2018 12:37 PM      Profile for Leonard   Author's Homepage   Email Leonard         Edit/Delete Post 
There you go! The military wants to penetrate armor plate and decided that the energy or mass of the 75 grain projectile was capable of taking out the Soviet T72. Dream on!

But there may be advantages with a heavy and long bullet while using a much faster twist barrel, for their purposes, perhaps in the SAW squad automatic rifle and flinging the heavy bullet way out there. Fine, for war fighting applications and hitting steel gongs.

I really fail to see where a 75 grain bullet, all things being equal, is superior to a very standard 55 grain bullet for hunting small 25 pound animals. I have always felt that those long boat tail bullets are slower and may not open up the way a 50/55 grain HP will do and we have decades of empirical evidence that demonstrates why we choose this type of frangible bullet specifically for vermin control.

The heavier bullet may show better ballistic coefficient at extended range but who is hunting coyotes 600/800 yards away? And, do they zip through causing runners or do they result in Bang/Flop, which is what most of us are looking for. This macho shit about killing coyotes at extreme ranges is a step backwards for almost all applications. I just don't get it?

I have been using a moderately heavier coyote bullet for decades myself. Yes, it was a little accidental because when I had my first 22-250Ackley built, I tried 55 grain bullets and got them almost to 4,400 FPS while pressure testing before backing off to an accuracy load of 4200fps. I sure thought I had the answer but those Burger bullets were vaporizing, not at the muzzle but past 100 yards, more or less.

So, I decided to go with a heavier bullet, the 65 grain and used it for many years. Best of both worlds, as far as I could see. I still got over 3900fps and it killed superbly without blowing up inside. My practical long range self imposed limitation is and has always been under 500 yards. Beyond that, you can't find them and for contest hunting, if you can't recover them, you are wasting time and money.

But, now we have the 22 Creedmore, I don't believe in a faster twist than is necessary, I think it's hard on barrel life and I'm too damned cheap to be screwing new barrels on every season....or living with degraded accuracy.

All in all, I don't know what all the shouting is all about? I think they are expanding on a theory to a point beyond usefulness and practicality. Until they can train coyotes to stay in pastures and not be milling around too much or teach them to dig burrows and sit there like a 25 pound prairie dog, I can't see where a 75 grain bullet @3500fps is an advantage? I have a hard time believing it was Okies that thought this up, the new 22CM? Must have been dreamed up by some Liberal back east that figured it all out on paper? I mean, a software program, no doubt.

Put me down as skeptical.

Good hunting. El Bee

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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!

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Kokopelli
SENIOR DISCOUNT & Dispenser of Sage Advice
Member # 633

Icon 1 posted July 24, 2018 01:18 PM      Profile for Kokopelli   Author's Homepage           Edit/Delete Post 
Awesome quiver ??
My bowquiver holds an even dozen. More than that and the weight change from full to empty affects the tune of the bow & arrow flight.
I usually load up with 8 shooters and 4 stumpers. The stumpers are for warm-up shots, practice shots and anything else where an expendable arrow is called for. The shooters ………. thems the good ones for the big critters.

BTW; Package on the way. Probably Friday. Do not open until Xmass.

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And lo, the Light of the Trump shown upon the Darkness and the Darkness could not comprehend it.

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knockemdown
Our staff photo editing Guru, par excellence
Member # 3588

Icon 1 posted July 24, 2018 01:24 PM      Profile for knockemdown   Author's Homepage           Edit/Delete Post 
How to use IMGUR
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DAA
Utah/Promoted WESTERN REGIONAL Hunt Director
Member # 11

Icon 1 posted July 25, 2018 04:50 AM      Profile for DAA   Author's Homepage   Email DAA         Edit/Delete Post 
Geordie, Fred,

What IS the capacity of the .22 CM? I have not paid much attention, have no grasp on the facts. I mostly skip any talk of it on the 'net, for obvious reasons.

But when I do read about it, I sometimes read it's in the same class as the .22-243, but I also sometimes read it's got capacity near identical to the .22-250AI.

It sure as hell can't be both. Do you guys know?

If it's really running 75's at 3500 in hunting length barrels, I'd think it has to be closer to .243 capacity. Because the .22-250AI can't do that shit. Not even. I was running them that fast in a 29" barrel. But my current .22-250AI is a 27" and a 12T, so 75's not an option, but I can tell you, no way in hell it would run 75's that fast and not wreck primer pockets in one, two loadings.

So, I'm curious? Either it's got .243 like capacity, or it's magic if it's .22-250AI capacity and really running those velocities?

- DAA

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"Oh yeah, they're gonna talk to you, and talk to you, and talk to you about individual freedom, but they see a free individual, it's gonna scare 'em." -- George Hanson, Easy Rider, 1969.

Rocky Mountain Varmint Hunter

Posts: 2676 | From: Salt Lake City, UT | Registered: Jan 2003  |  IP: Logged
Ariel Perez
Knows what it's all about
Member # 4678

Icon 1 posted July 25, 2018 05:30 AM      Profile for Ariel Perez   Email Ariel Perez         Edit/Delete Post 
https://www.primalrights.com/library/cartridge-guides/22-creedmoor

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AP

Posts: 60 | From: South/eastern Az | Registered: May 2016  |  IP: Logged
Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2

Icon 1 posted July 25, 2018 08:01 AM      Profile for Leonard   Author's Homepage   Email Leonard         Edit/Delete Post 
I looked at the link: I can't get serious reading stuff like this:

quote:
I have been shooting 22 Creedmoor since 2014 and have pressed it into service as my primary coyote hunting cartridge. The tough northern coyotes we hunt have a reputation for taking some vicious hits and then just getting back up to run off. This is something that plagued me with the traditional 22-250 and caried over into the 22-243win I ran prior to switching to the 22 Creedmoor. Even when using the venerable mainstay 52gr SMK at 4100fps from the 22-243, it was not uncommon to have squarely hit coyotes get knocked down and then run off to die 150yds later. No doubt running a heavier bullet with both the aforementioned cartridges could have eased my troubles, but I was quite interested in the Creedmoor and wanted to try it out.

Several years later and the 22 Creedmoor has completely established itself among my 22 cal firearms. The 22-243win and 22-243AI I was shooting have found themselves virtually untouched, while the 22CM has dominated coyotes in a way no other 22 cal has before it. The accuracy nodes are wide and forgiving, the feeding is boringly reliable, and the performance out in the world has been dominating. My main 26" barrel is pushing 80gr Berger's at 3525fps and is relentless inside 800yds.


I think he is saying something close to what I have said, (many times) about the inadequacy of the 223Remington as a coyote cartridge? But, he is claiming a 22-243 and similar are sitting unused because they just can't kill a tough northern coyote!

This is horseshit. I hate to mention the old canard, "if you do your part," however, it's pretty basic. Shot placement has a lot to do with putting them down for keeps, and it's a big hint when he starts throwing around numbers like "800 yards".

The only thing I learned, worthwhile, is that I have been misspelling 22 Creedmoor that past couple of days. The world is saved. A 22CM can actually kill a northern coyote because it can drive an 80 grain bullet from a 26" barrel @ 3500fps, or there abouts, since this isn't rocket science.

I know about magic. Suddenly, a cartridge with minor configuration changes can do miraculous things, because....you know? Everybody feels good about dumping an unwary coyote way out there, when given the opportunity. Way out there could be 400 or 800, what's the difference? A tiny bit of holdover and Bang/flop! Can't be done with a mutt like a 22-243 because you can't even drive 75 grain bullets fast enough, much less 80 grain.

People like to throw around numbers, and data to prove something, Everybody does it. I do it. But when we have used this miracle ever since 2014, it goes to show what a visionary this guy is, smart, good looking, intelligent, nice trimmed beard and sports a silencer on his coyote rig. This guy obviously takes no prisoners. I'd be an idiot not to take his advice and scrap the crap I have been using for the WORLD BEATER 22CM. Might even improve my love life, who knows? But, even if it doesn't, if it solves my 800 yard coyote shooting, it is obviously worth it!

I'll tell you how to do that, quit shooting at 800 yard coyotes, asshole! Maybe the pathetically underpowered 22-250 is still marginally effective within normal parameters that we find on a normal coyote stand? Ask Paul! Sic'em, Tiger!

Good hunting. El Bee

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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!

Posts: 31336 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003  |  IP: Logged
Ariel Perez
Knows what it's all about
Member # 4678

Icon 1 posted July 25, 2018 08:59 AM      Profile for Ariel Perez   Email Ariel Perez         Edit/Delete Post 
Don’t shoot the messenger I’m just relaying some info I have found.

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AP

Posts: 60 | From: South/eastern Az | Registered: May 2016  |  IP: Logged
DAA
Utah/Promoted WESTERN REGIONAL Hunt Director
Member # 11

Icon 1 posted July 25, 2018 09:30 AM      Profile for DAA   Author's Homepage   Email DAA         Edit/Delete Post 
Does he list real capacity?

An 80 at 3500 in a 26" barrel is well beyond the .22-250AI. But I keep reading that the capacity is "nearly identical" to the .22-250AI.

Can't be?

- DAA

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"Oh yeah, they're gonna talk to you, and talk to you, and talk to you about individual freedom, but they see a free individual, it's gonna scare 'em." -- George Hanson, Easy Rider, 1969.

Rocky Mountain Varmint Hunter

Posts: 2676 | From: Salt Lake City, UT | Registered: Jan 2003  |  IP: Logged
Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2

Icon 1 posted July 25, 2018 11:16 AM      Profile for Leonard   Author's Homepage   Email Leonard         Edit/Delete Post 
Ariel Perez, I'm sorry, I don't blame you at all for providing that link. It was sorta informative, but you are not responsible for providing it. I'm probably calling bullshit on the author, not you.

And, Dave. As with the rest of it, the numbers concerned with this Creedmoor are somewhat elusive. What it conjures up for me is a cartridge similar to Fred's Redline but Fred has some solid data and does not seem prone to exaggeration or vagueness.

But, as you can guess, even if the numbers about the 22CM are firm and accurate, I still have a problem with:
800 yards
3500fps
26" barrel
80 grain bullets,
you know, truth?

I mean, I can be bullshitted when I want to be, but even if all this stuff was true and accurate, and all the terrible problems with the unused 22-243's gathering dust, I just can't get excited about a problem most of us don't have, but is self inflicted. And, we don't need a miracle cartridge to kill northern coyotes, fer cripe sakes, even a 17 Predator can do it, when we do our part. Oh hell, he's probably a nice guy, and doesn't beat his wife; or his dog? Let's give him the benefit of the doubt. [Razz]

Good hunting. El Bee

PS Ariel, I apologize if I gave the impression that I blamed you for the whole concept. You are blameless and we all appreciate your contribution!

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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!

Posts: 31336 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003  |  IP: Logged
DAA
Utah/Promoted WESTERN REGIONAL Hunt Director
Member # 11

Icon 1 posted July 25, 2018 11:40 AM      Profile for DAA   Author's Homepage   Email DAA         Edit/Delete Post 
I think Greg (the author) is a pretty good guy. Not that I actually know him, but my impressions are over all positive. He's opinionated and willing to wear that on his sleeve. I appreciate that.

Disclaimer - I haven't clicked Ariel's link or read that article. Leonard's quotes, solid hits, beefy chamberings in my book, coyotes getting up and running off, I decided just to skip the whole thing...

Because, as Leonard alluded to, I've killed more coyote than most, as large as anything west of the Mississippi, with a puny .17...

Though, in the interest of full disclosure, I don't shoot as well as I used to and I've come to realize that bullet placement stuff ain't no bullshit. Just always took it for granted, without even realizing I was, that duh, of course you are going to hit them where you want to. Where the fuck else would you hit them??? Now that I don't always hit them where I want to anymore, I've become far more humble in my defense and praise of the .17.

Simply put, I didn't realize how good a shot I used to be, but I sure as heck ain't anymore and it's changed my perspective.

But that .17 is still my main squeeze and run away favorite! I just pass up shots I used to would have taken without any hesitation.

- DAA

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"Oh yeah, they're gonna talk to you, and talk to you, and talk to you about individual freedom, but they see a free individual, it's gonna scare 'em." -- George Hanson, Easy Rider, 1969.

Rocky Mountain Varmint Hunter

Posts: 2676 | From: Salt Lake City, UT | Registered: Jan 2003  |  IP: Logged
Eddie
Knows what it's all about
Member # 4324

Icon 1 posted July 25, 2018 01:59 PM      Profile for Eddie   Author's Homepage           Edit/Delete Post 
Well in went to the link, that's the first bolt gun I have ever seen with the bolt in the stock. What will they come up with next.
I guess I'm to old school. I'll stick with my old 22-250 with 55hp and call them in closer.
Would love to have one of them cans on my rig. Might make my wife happy, she says l'm going deaf. [Big Grin]
I think I got that selective hearing everyone is talking about.

Posts: 275 | From: Oklahoma | Registered: Feb 2013  |  IP: Logged
CrossJ
SECOND PLACE: PAUL RYAN Look-a-like contest
Member # 884

Icon 1 posted July 25, 2018 02:45 PM      Profile for CrossJ   Email CrossJ         Edit/Delete Post 
-69g running just shy of 3600 in 22-250AI
-69g running 3500+ in 22CM
-current 22cm pushing 75eldm at 3520

This is info given to me by a very reputable gunsmith who has shot both calibers. Like I said in first post, I am going off of discussions I have had with individuals when I first heard of the cartridge, I don't own a 22CM. His quote to me when discussing this cartridge was it would perform equivalent to my AI, minus the fireforming. 100fps (give or take) variance between cartridges is a non issue in imo. I have seen greater differances in same rifle, same load, same weight bullet, just different manufacturer. Bearing surface!?!?.....who knows?

My purpose of entering this discussion was to relate experiences of actual users of the 22CM and their comparisons to my findings of my own 22-250AI. The conclusion and consensus I came away with was the 22CM is the double first cousin in performance to a 22-250AI. In other words, its not a magical cartridge like a 6 Dasher for gods sake!

Maintain

P.S. Fred, the gunsmith I mentioned is the guy who built your 223ai

P.S.S. DAA, I asked this individual about brass life on this 22cm running 75's, and his comment was....couldn't tell, he has buckets of hornady brass and hadn't really given it much thought. So who knows, maybe its only lasting two fireings, but then again it is junky old hornady brass.

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A friend will help you move. A good friend will help you move a body.

Posts: 1025 | From: on a water tower | Registered: Jul 2006  |  IP: Logged
CrossJ
SECOND PLACE: PAUL RYAN Look-a-like contest
Member # 884

Icon 1 posted July 25, 2018 02:57 PM      Profile for CrossJ   Email CrossJ         Edit/Delete Post 
Eddie, the rifle is a desert tech. They do look like a storm trooper weapon. I actually had a deal where I was building 10 rnd mags for DT by cannibalizing 2 mags and tig welding them back together to make a 10 rounder. The company caught on and made my services obsolete

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A friend will help you move. A good friend will help you move a body.

Posts: 1025 | From: on a water tower | Registered: Jul 2006  |  IP: Logged
Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2

Icon 1 posted July 25, 2018 04:16 PM      Profile for Leonard   Author's Homepage   Email Leonard         Edit/Delete Post 
Geordie, you Tig weld? Maybe I have something you can use? Send me your mailing address.

Good hunting. El Bee

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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!

Posts: 31336 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003  |  IP: Logged
R.Shaw
Peanut Butter Man, da da da da DAH!
Member # 73

Icon 1 posted July 25, 2018 05:06 PM      Profile for R.Shaw           Edit/Delete Post 
Best I could get with a 75 gr. Berger from a 26 inch barrel was 3420. Talking 22-250 AI. Pretty sure Kelly gets over 3500 in the cm with the same bullet.

When you compare the trajectory of a 55 running 3980 to a 75 running 3400, they are basically the same out to about 400. After that, it is all 75 including foot pounds. Accuracy was fantastic, but I could not make myself like it. A shade less than 4000 was always in the back of my mind, so I sent it down the road.

Posts: 542 | From: Nebraska | Registered: Jan 2003  |  IP: Logged
Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2

Icon 1 posted July 25, 2018 05:55 PM      Profile for Leonard   Author's Homepage   Email Leonard         Edit/Delete Post 
not doubting anything, Randy. But, as far as I'm concerned, what does it have to do with the price of tea in China?

If we are talking about hunting coyotes, I think most people would agree that a 400 yard shot is a rare situation and as you said, a 55 grain bullet is capable of killing a coyote under normal conditions. What some exotic cartridge can do with a 75 grain bullet at a half a mile is a different situation and I don't even want to legitimize it as calling and hunting coyotes.

That being said, there are other cartridges that can do that job, 6mm, 6.5, 7mm, 30 caliber and who knows what else? So I don't care if a 22CM can launch an 80 grain bullet at 3,000, or allegedly at 3,500fps; oh yeah and @ 800 yards. Maybe it's possible, but big fucking deal! It has nothing to do with my particular coyote hunting, and I know a little bit about this stuff.

I don't know how many ways to say this but let's get down to earth. We already have dozens of very capable cartridges suitable for hunting coyotes very effectively. If there is a new kid on the block, that's swell. But let's not start talking like it has some miraculous ability we never had before. Get real.

I hate to be the wet blanket but we haven't been dying for a new cartridge that will kill a coyote better than what's already out there. I understand and appreciate performance. We are drowning in excellent coyote cartridges! Rejoice!

Now, what else can we argue about?

Good hunting. El Bee

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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!

Posts: 31336 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003  |  IP: Logged
CrossJ
SECOND PLACE: PAUL RYAN Look-a-like contest
Member # 884

Icon 1 posted July 25, 2018 05:59 PM      Profile for CrossJ   Email CrossJ         Edit/Delete Post 
So......differences of approx 100fps? The point not mentioned in this very unscientific comparison is that there are too many variables. Barrels, powders etc. The closest one could come to a true comparison would be barrels cut from the same blank tested with same lot powder and same lot bullets. Example....I had a 6x47 that ran 105s 120fps faster at break in than the previous barrel cut with same reamer. Powder lots were the same. So what conclusions can be drawn from that data?

Anyway, the 22CM,IMO, is a chambering that has merit. Is it a miracle worker, doubtful. I might would even consider it if I didnt have dies, brass etc for 22-250AI......or I was retired and rich like KJ and had time for projects.

Maintain

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A friend will help you move. A good friend will help you move a body.

Posts: 1025 | From: on a water tower | Registered: Jul 2006  |  IP: Logged


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