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Author
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Topic: The scope you use for coyotes
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Kokopelli
SENIOR DISCOUNT & Dispenser of Sage Advice
Member # 633
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posted February 09, 2018 11:49 AM
"It's amazing what you can do when you have confidence in your equipment."
Now, there's a nugget that should be carved into stone !!
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And lo, the Light of the Trump shown upon the Darkness and the Darkness could not comprehend it.
Posts: 7580 | From: Under a wandering star | Registered: Apr 2005
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Eddie
Knows what it's all about
Member # 4324
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posted February 09, 2018 08:32 PM
Well look what the dogs drug in, good to see you back Tom. Sight just got a little better with another Okie.
Posts: 275 | From: Oklahoma | Registered: Feb 2013
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DAA
Utah/Promoted WESTERN REGIONAL Hunt Director
Member # 11
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posted February 10, 2018 06:29 AM
No doubt! Good to see you Tom.
- DAA
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"Oh yeah, they're gonna talk to you, and talk to you, and talk to you about individual freedom, but they see a free individual, it's gonna scare 'em." -- George Hanson, Easy Rider, 1969.
Rocky Mountain Varmint Hunter
Posts: 2676 | From: Salt Lake City, UT | Registered: Jan 2003
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TOM64
Knows what it's all about
Member # 561
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posted February 10, 2018 11:17 AM
Thanks guys
Posts: 2283 | From: okieland | Registered: Feb 2005
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted February 10, 2018 12:11 PM
Yeah, even "He who shall not be named" misses you!
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31461 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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TOM64
Knows what it's all about
Member # 561
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posted February 10, 2018 02:20 PM
I bet he does...
Posts: 2283 | From: okieland | Registered: Feb 2005
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted February 10, 2018 05:48 PM
Well, it seems like he does. And, he follows this Board, he has already responded to your last comment saying he doesn't hold a grudge. I don't know what is meant by that and if you don't either, that's fine. He did mention something about turning you on to Super Sniper scopes. Myself, I've never heard of them until this thread. I'm a rather firm believer in that you get what you pay for, especially in optics. It's not always the optical quality, the durability and craftsmanship are very important to me. Especially with this talk about Leupold. That's actually disturbing.
At one time, even though I highly value Kahles scopes, I was told that service begins somewhere back east and of unknown duration. Of course, that was probably 20 years ago and I've lately heard that many European manufacturers have adequate repair facilities this side of the Atlantic nowadays.
Anyway, Valentine's Day is approaching and I know he would appreciate a card.
Glad to help.
Good hunting. El Bee
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31461 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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TOM64
Knows what it's all about
Member # 561
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posted February 10, 2018 07:51 PM
I can't recall any grudges, if you'll remember I voted to keep him around for the entertainment.
Unless he goes by BigStick and lives in Alaska, I don't remember him ever mentioning super chickens. Larry (BigStick) got my attention when he started taking 22's out past 300 yards. 75 MOA rails and fixed super chickens will get you out there.
This was only 2 years or so ago that I bought my first one, maybe 3 years. Me and Cuzz strung up steel plates out to 800 yards and that got me interested in twisting turrets but also pointed out several issues with my Leupold scopes.
If he who shall not be named talked up the super chickens, I totally missed it and may very well have.
All I do know is I'm very happy with them.
Posts: 2283 | From: okieland | Registered: Feb 2005
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Kokopelli
SENIOR DISCOUNT & Dispenser of Sage Advice
Member # 633
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posted February 11, 2018 06:51 AM
Ok...............He Who Shall Not Be Named has been standing in the corner for a long time.
How about we let him back in on probation and give him, say, a limit of 50 characters a month ??
Loyalty should count for something.
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And lo, the Light of the Trump shown upon the Darkness and the Darkness could not comprehend it.
Posts: 7580 | From: Under a wandering star | Registered: Apr 2005
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted February 11, 2018 07:06 AM
It's okay by me. I was reluctant to withdraw his posting privileges in the first place. It was group vigilanteism that strung him up. As a caution, I could always take away his vowels. That worked wonders with Nistetter.
Good hunting. El Bee
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31461 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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Lone Howl
Free Trial Platinum Member & part-time language police
Member # 29
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posted February 11, 2018 08:29 AM
Let's take a vote..
NO
now I'm locking this thread!
Mark
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When tyranny becomes law, rebellion becomes duty.
Posts: 2083 | From: Texas | Registered: Jan 2003
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Aaron Rhoades
Knows what it's all about
Member # 4234
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posted February 11, 2018 09:38 AM
Leonard, on the Kahles scopes, I bought a older unused helia c 3.5-10x50 a while back and while it is a nice clear scope, the first time I cleaned the lenses, they scratched badly. I continued using it, then had it sitting on a shelf for a while, then finally decided to see about getting it fixed. I called the number, which it turns out is Swarovski, in Rhode Island I believe. They said send it in, I sent it, they got it, they call, said they’ll have to ship it to Austria to fix and it’ll be $400. I said $400? It’s not worth that to me, I’ll buy another scope for that price and the glass won’t scratch, if I wanted a throwaway scope I would’ve bought a vortex. He says he check with higher ups, they apparently authorized to repair for $200, so I did it. Took several months but I got it back and the lense coatings are much better on this one. I still don’t like the scope though. It doesn’t have a parallax adjustment and anything close I have a hard time with.
Posts: 155 | From: Washington | Registered: Oct 2012
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Lone Howl
Free Trial Platinum Member & part-time language police
Member # 29
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posted February 11, 2018 09:55 AM
We are a Swaro dealer thru work and I just dropped 10G's on glass for some of our customers. I noticed they had Kahles in the order book and the rep told me that they handle that now, or own them or whatever?
But yeah, these euro optic people have places setup for distrubuting glass here in the states, but repairs go to the factorys in Europe. And it aint cheap! Buddy sent 12x50 binos in for refurbish..like 800 bucks later they were done...geez.
Mark
[ February 11, 2018, 09:59 AM: Message edited by: Lone Howl ]
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When tyranny becomes law, rebellion becomes duty.
Posts: 2083 | From: Texas | Registered: Jan 2003
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TOM64
Knows what it's all about
Member # 561
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posted February 11, 2018 11:51 AM
I was under the impression my Swaro binocs we're covered with a lifetime warranty, are they not?
Posts: 2283 | From: okieland | Registered: Feb 2005
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Lone Howl
Free Trial Platinum Member & part-time language police
Member # 29
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posted February 11, 2018 12:02 PM
A "refurbish" is gonna cost you. Also, its a limited lifetime guarantee.
If a breakage occurs with the optical system, they warrant it for 10 years. Anything else you send em in and they determine whether or not it is warranty- able..due to materials/craftsmanship or abuse. Thats in a nutshell.
Mark
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When tyranny becomes law, rebellion becomes duty.
Posts: 2083 | From: Texas | Registered: Jan 2003
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted February 11, 2018 05:35 PM
The Kahles I have is a 3X12X56, considered the last word in night scopes, excepting starlight, I guess? Anyway, it's easily the equal of a Swarovoski or a Zeiss. By far the best night scope I own. In fact, that's what it is made for and the market is hunting at night from those wood stands you see in Europe overlooking open fields at the edge of a forest. I guess it's a lot like Texas in that there is a lot of wilderness and forest between towns.
I have thought of sending it in for cleaning but not for $800, since I don't really think it needs it anyway. I've never had a problem with scratches on the lenses but you have to be real careful what you use to clean them, I would never use any type of paper even if they say that they are for cleaning lenses.
Good hunting. El Bee
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31461 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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Wiley E
Knows what it's all about
Member # 108
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posted February 11, 2018 06:34 PM
I have a fixed power Leupold in 8x and 7.5x. Shot the 8x on my .22.250 for many years. Duplex cross hairs on those scope.
I also have a Leupold Vari-x III in 6.5-20x x 40mm with target turrets and varmint reticle.
I shoot a Zeiss Conquest 6.5-20x x 50mm on my .243. Absolutely love the glass quality.
With my latest rifle, a custom .22/6mm, I spent an enormous time researching scopes. First I thought I was going to get a Kahles (too big for coyotes) then thought Athlon Cronus (still too big and possible tracking concerns). I have finally settled on one of two scopes.
My first choice, if money was no object would be a NightForce ATACR - C544 4-14x50 in 2nd FP with MOAR reticle and 34mm tube.
My second choice, and the scope I will probably get will be a NightForce SHV - C522 4-14x56 in 2nd FP with MOAR reticle and 30 mm tube.
My research priorities were #1 mechanical reliability, #2 optical quality, #3 a fine reticle that could give me references for quick ranging on coyotes moving away and measurable hold over references as well as windage hash marks that are measurable to use as leads on running coyotes.
I absolutely love the NF MOAR reticle.
Only concern with the NF SHV C522 is whether the clicks will be as reliable as they are on the NF ATACR C544. The difference in price is $1100 for the NF SHV C522 and $2328 for the NF ATACR C544.
Going with second focal plane because the ranging ability is true on full power (14x) and 1/2 values on 1/2 power (7x). This way I won't be covering coyotes with thick crosshairs at long range and can find crosshairs at close range under lower light.
For any of you looking to do some research on scopes, there is an excellent scope review at Precision Rifle Blog - Tactical Scope Review and Test Results.
The parameters of this scope review and test were set up by the tactical shooting community and the test results reflected those parameters. This removed any possible bias and gave priority to those features which were of the most importance to the majority of shooters. Highest emphasis was placed on mechanical reliability followed by optical quality. Excellent study for anyone looking at buying a tactical scope. It is a little outdated by now with newer scopes coming out continually but still a good reference.
I tried to find a balance between the high end tactical scope features and the hunting scope features I am used to and the above scopes are where my search finally ended, MAYBE.
~SH~
[ February 11, 2018, 06:35 PM: Message edited by: Wiley E ]
Posts: 853 | From: Kadoka, S.D | Registered: Feb 2003
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted February 11, 2018 07:58 PM
I have a couple US Optics scopes, one is 5X25X56 illuminated with a 35mm tube, it's a beast. Just a pair of those rings cost over $500, very rugged. I really don't remember how much the scope cost right now but it was well north of $2,000?
Anyway, I think tactical and hunting are a little different. Yes, ruggedness is important, but I would place the optical quality first. I'm exMilitary but that stuff is serious and hunting is, (umm) sporting, recreational.
I really think the sniper crowd has a totally different mission and some equipment has crossover application, but not all. Now, being about to mount night vision in front of a scope like this opens some possibilities, but I'm not that interested for the cost of it. Not for coyotes.
I'm not familiar with the Nightforce models talked about? I've looked at and through some of their scopes, but I don't get it? They impress me as like a highly polished, expensive Weaver.
Another thing, daytime coyote hunting really actually doesn't require extremely high dollar glass. If it wasn't such an expensive reticle, the one I'd like to play around with is the Horus Vision. Fuck all those clicks...but then the problem is clutter. Out of the question for night hunting, but I could see some application for South Dakota type conditions, flat and way out yonder.
Good hunting. El Bee
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31461 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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Paul Melching
Radical Operator Forum "You won't get past the front gate"
Member # 885
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posted February 12, 2018 03:10 AM
I have a couple US Optics scopes, one is 5X25X56 illuminated with a 35mm tube, it's a beast. Just a pair of those rings cost over $500, very rugged. I really don't remember how much the scope cost right now but it was well north of $2,000?
Closer to 3k
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Those who value security over liberty soon will have neither !
Posts: 4188 | From: The forest ! north of the dez. | Registered: Jul 2006
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TOM64
Knows what it's all about
Member # 561
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posted February 12, 2018 08:45 PM
Scott have you looked at the Bushnell LRHS scopes? They are being discontinued for a new version but there are some deals out there right now. They have a solid rep for tracking and holding zero.
A guy on another forum has tested the NF SHV line and they held up for his crew. His list of proven scopes are
Failures or issues with these scopes are extremely rare-
1). Nightforce NXS/ATACR/BEAST
2). Bushnell LRHS, HDMR/DMR, ERS, XRS
3). SWFA SS 6x, 10x, 1-6x, 3-9x, 5-20x
4). S&B fixed 10x PM
5). Hensoldts
6). Older Leupold fixed power Mark 4's/Ultra's
He goes by Formidilosus on 24hourcampfire and is well regarded.
Leonard I remembered the one who shall not be named used Kenton knobs on his scopes, not anything about the super chickens but my cousin has been using them on his older varixIII scopes without any issues. Maybe that will make him smile.
Posts: 2283 | From: okieland | Registered: Feb 2005
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Brent Parker
Knows what it's all about
Member # 4354
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posted February 13, 2018 06:42 AM
For my fur rifle I am currently running a Tikka T3X in .223 I am running a Swaro Z3 4-12x50. Great scope good glass BRH reticle. Will probably sell it off after season and go to a Nightforce SHV 4-14x50 F1. I prefer to have illumination since I night hunt as well and like to have the option to dial if I need it. For my spring time rifle I use a S&B 3-20x50 Ultra short. There are no compromise in my opinion on this scope and does everything I need. If I had to Pick just one it would be my S&B and make it work for everything. As far as I'm concerned lifes to short to look thru shitty glass. Ran a Leupold Mark 6 for a while. Went back twice for tracking issues.
Posts: 172 | From: 2 miles east of Vic | Registered: Mar 2013
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Wiley E
Knows what it's all about
Member # 108
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posted February 14, 2018 05:47 AM
No Tom, I am not Familiar with the Bushnell models but I will have to check them out. I am assuming most of these scope brands are improving their quality control.
~SH~
Posts: 853 | From: Kadoka, S.D | Registered: Feb 2003
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted February 14, 2018 06:58 AM
I don't know that the durability of a scope is essential? First of all, I always have another rifle with me in case of problems. And, I don't hunt the back side of the moon, so I'm not worried much about mailing a scope I happened to break in half just picking it up. For me, actual failures are rare, I have sent in a scope for some type of attention maybe 3 or 4 times in all these years?
And Scott, I don't know anybody else who owns a Leupold straight 7.5X? Mine has been on a lot of different rifles. I love that scope!
Here's a question I don't recall being asked, here or anywhere? Tell us the scopes you have on the shelf, how long and why? I don't mean some POS you never will mount and use, but scopes you might have on "stand by" and you have no intention of throwing away. Thinking about it, maybe there's a good reason why it hasn't been asked, other than curiosity? Hardly useful information. And, maybe I should start thinning the herd? You know, who wants a polished scope anymore?
Good hunting. El Bee
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31461 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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TOM64
Knows what it's all about
Member # 561
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posted February 14, 2018 10:20 AM
I don't have any scopes on the shelf.
But scope failure can mean a missed shot at the trophy of a lifetime or worse, a cripple.
I'm done with wondering if it's the conditions or if my scope got bumped like I did with my Leupolds. I'd go confirm zero and my group would be off just a little, never thought it could be my scope drifting till I tried the super chickens and once zeroed, they stay zeroed. I've yet had to make any zero adjustments even after twisting the knobs.
The extra weight and bulk pay off in confidence.
Posts: 2283 | From: okieland | Registered: Feb 2005
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DAA
Utah/Promoted WESTERN REGIONAL Hunt Director
Member # 11
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posted February 14, 2018 01:05 PM
I don't trust the clicks on my garden variety Leupolds. But, have to say, I've not had one that hasn't been diddled with just shift zero on it's own.
My main squeeze, I check zero once every year or two. It hasn't needed an adjustment since the first day at the range when it got zeroed fifteen years ago. Ditto my other regular use Leopold's. If I set them and forget them, I don't need to worry, they just don't move on their own. Hasn't happened to me anyway, yet.
Not a fanboy, belive me. But, mine, if not diddled with, never move.
Diddle with them though, and all bets are off...
Scopes are such snakes though. It's just good policy not to ever trust any of them. One scope on my buddies fixture, had a really insidious issue. As the magnification is changed up and down, the elevation gradually moves down (POI would then go up). No clicks involved. Just simply changing magnification back and forth, causes it to gradually shift elevation.
It's one of the ones that has been mentioned as desirable in this thread...
- DAA
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"Oh yeah, they're gonna talk to you, and talk to you, and talk to you about individual freedom, but they see a free individual, it's gonna scare 'em." -- George Hanson, Easy Rider, 1969.
Rocky Mountain Varmint Hunter
Posts: 2676 | From: Salt Lake City, UT | Registered: Jan 2003
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