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Author Topic: Decoy dogs and their misuse
Lone Howl
Free Trial Platinum Member & part-time language police
Member # 29

Icon 1 posted May 02, 2017 07:18 AM      Profile for Lone Howl   Email Lone Howl         Edit/Delete Post 
IDK...I have noticed over the years that the best, and most, information comes out during a dustup on this here board : )
Mark

[ May 02, 2017, 07:18 AM: Message edited by: Lone Howl ]

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When tyranny becomes law, rebellion becomes duty.

Posts: 2083 | From: Texas | Registered: Jan 2003  |  IP: Logged
Wiley E
Knows what it's all about
Member # 108

Icon 1 posted May 04, 2017 05:40 PM      Profile for Wiley E   Email Wiley E         Edit/Delete Post 
3T: "Red fox don't den near coyotes, I assume everyone knows that. There's lots of places in this country where coyotes don't live. So with a staggering prey base the fox population is up."

So if red fox won't den near coyotes and there is lots of places where coyotes don't live, how can there be a "coyote explosion". Your arguments contradict themselves.

Much like previous arguments (paraphrasing) .... "Ahh gee, Scott is charging the board for too many hours (but less hours than me) which are very expensive (but less expensive than me) yet I think he should be here on weekends and Mondays"

I should charge less hours but be here more so that I can charge more hours??? Ahhhhh...ok?

Or how about this (paraphrasing) ..... "One guy can cover the south half of the county just fine" ... "when Scott was gone in Oct (which was a mutually beneficial decision with the board) K had to cover his area when he had his own work to do"

So which way is it? Can one guy cover the south half by himself or not?? I guess it depends on whether you are focused on livestock losses or coyote numbers huh?

When you throw shit against the wall to see what will stick without thinking it through well enough, you end up contradicting other arguments. Try to keep that in mind next time.

3T: "You can't possibly convince me that coyote populations did anything but explode while you were here."

If the coyote population exploded (implying a year-round increase in coyote numbers), why were livestock losses so low?? You can't explain that can you? Oh....let me guess...."garbage in garbage out.....livestock producers can't count" yada yada.

If you want to make a case for a "COYOTE EXPLOSION" in Southern Campbell County, you need to go back into the ANNUAL aerial hunting records (not your typical one flight to fit your bias bullshit) and see what the change was in coyotes killed per hour.

While your at it, might compare it to Northern Campbell County where the real "EXPLOSION" is, which has nothing to do with you one way or another just as any change in coyote population in the South doesn't have a damn thing to do with any efforts on my part.

Why didn't you find this "EXPLOSION" when you were in the back seat of the helicopter??? Hmmmm??? You told him right where to go. You can't explain it can you? Your dog just won't hunt will it?

Your trouble is that you think you can just spew bullshit without ever getting challenged on it. Not with me, not anymore.

3T: "I had numerous ranchers, land managers, etc. tell me how the populations were trending".

There is going to be a hell of a lot more credibility with taking annual aerial hunting hours and breaking those hours down to coyotes killed per hour in a given area than what "so and so said".

As far as Land Managers, there is always going to be plenty of coyotes in Alpha due to the timber, due to P ranch to the east (no access), and B ranch to the North (no access FOR ME TO DO GROUND WORK), so you pick off what you can with snares in C creek between 300 elk using the same trails until the cows get turned in. Excuses? FACTS!

Even at that, the timber is 6 miles from the sheep and still I kept T's lamb losses at their lowest levels WITH MY SUB PAR PERFORMANCE.

Funny how the facts just won't support the agenda.

3T: "If you want to keep hammering it out I can get specific and show exactly proof of those numbers. I saw the last few aerial flights there and the numbers firsthand. "

BRING IT!!!!

Like the aerial hunt in late Feb / early March where we had 9 guys spotting and we pushed the timbered coyotes out into the open. That hunt was more of a reflection on aerial hunting efficiency than a "POPULATION EXPLOSION".

This is so typical of your bullshit. You will argue it both ways. If I don't kill many coyotes you will use those numbers as poor performance. If we kill a lot of coyotes, it's an "EXPLOSION" of coyotes due to poor performance.

Typical cynical critical contradicting cutthroat antics.

Precisely why I surveyed livestock producers for their losses. I wasn't afraid of accountability or transparency knowing full well that those same numbers could be used to cut my own throat.

Let me help you out again. I checked 20 females that averaged 7 pups. Do the math. Yes there was a lot of immigration that occurred. With reproduction at those levels there will be an influx from any areas where they are not controlled. Short term seasonal populations in a given area does not an EXPLOSION make.

Bottom line, did I keep them out of the sheep. That is the only thing that matters to me, sure as hell not what you think from your critical throne of judgement in "no sheep easy street".

3T: "I personally don't think this is the place to keep this going, but if you insist we can"

This is the perfect place because words mean things and here everyone can see how well you back your criticisms and what's just gas.

3T: "We can get into all the other phases of coyote control, like shooting percentages, calling, M44's, ground crewing, locating for the plane, tracking cripples for the plane, (and including finding dens of wet bitches the plane shot) and on and on.... but again this isn't the place, and I'm not sure that's really what you would want aired out here."

Of course, do the innuendo. Create the Illusion.

Go ahead, back your play. Make the best argument you can for a Sub par performance on my part in the face of three years of less than 2.6% lamb losses. Let's show the world just how petty you really are.

3T: "I just try to do my job to the best of my ability."

You are very good at what you do WHEN IT COMES TO COYOTES. You have the best job for the best pay in the best area. So why would you resort to such cutthroat antics that did nothing but make you look bad? You don't have to answer that. You already did.

Somehow you think you should be judge and jury for the South when you should be thankful for what you have.

3T: "So with that I'd prefer not to continue this discussion on an open forum, but if you want to continue to poke the bull..."

Of course, a letter filled with baseless allegations sent to a few selected board members is more your style.

I kept it very professional and respectful, until I read that. Now the gloves are off. I wrote a response and tore your allegations to pieces but I didn't send it because I didn't want to put the board in a worse position than you had already placed them in.

Now it's all on the table. You can try to defend a defenseless position and dig yourself deeper or you can learn from it.

~SH~

[ May 04, 2017, 05:45 PM: Message edited by: Wiley E ]

Posts: 853 | From: Kadoka, S.D | Registered: Feb 2003  |  IP: Logged
Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2

Icon 1 posted May 04, 2017 09:52 PM      Profile for Leonard   Author's Homepage   Email Leonard         Edit/Delete Post 
This situation is unbelievably sad. On the one hand, as a friend, I hate to see you guys going at it hammer and tong.

But, I'm reading all this stuff and it's extremely interesting. A lot of us guys, being recreational hunters, we never consider some of the work involved in a job where you have to justify what you do and what you have done, for the sake of the bureaucracy and the bosses, as well as the troops in the field.

Most of us never think of coyote hunting as a 9 to 5 job and it is very illuminating, about things we never consider.

So, as far as, "is this the place" to discuss these things, I can assure both of you, without a dog in this fight, that I think the whole thing is fascinating, like watching a train wreck. It's entertaining and informative, and as far as I am concerned you men can beat each other to a pulp (in a gentlemanly manor) and maybe ko ko can provide the popcorn?

Good hunting. El Bee

PS
Remember people, take notes; all this stuff will be on the test!

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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!

Posts: 31315 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003  |  IP: Logged
Kokopelli
SENIOR DISCOUNT & Dispenser of Sage Advice
Member # 633

Icon 1 posted May 04, 2017 10:31 PM      Profile for Kokopelli   Author's Homepage           Edit/Delete Post 
These guys are on a level way beyond my simple 'find sign......find coyote' concept.

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And lo, the Light of the Trump shown upon the Darkness and the Darkness could not comprehend it.

Posts: 7507 | From: Under a wandering star | Registered: Apr 2005  |  IP: Logged


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