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Author
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Topic: Suppressed rig bench racing
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DAA
Utah/Promoted WESTERN REGIONAL Hunt Director
Member # 11
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posted June 18, 2015 10:51 AM
I have a couple Savages.
They even have halfway decent triggers! ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
They don't have decent stocks though. Or scopes appropriate for predator calling.
And although they are both setup with single shot followers now, neither one really fed worth a crap when they were repeaters.
Nothing against Savage. They shoot and shoot well. But, they do have some rough edges, that some of my nicer actions don't, that leave me preferring to use something a little bit nicer for a main squeeze on stand.
Probably one of my Nesika's for this, if not one of them, then a fully blueprinted 700.
- DAA
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"Oh yeah, they're gonna talk to you, and talk to you, and talk to you about individual freedom, but they see a free individual, it's gonna scare 'em." -- George Hanson, Easy Rider, 1969.
Rocky Mountain Varmint Hunter
Posts: 2676 | From: Salt Lake City, UT | Registered: Jan 2003
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DAA
Utah/Promoted WESTERN REGIONAL Hunt Director
Member # 11
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posted June 18, 2015 10:55 AM
BTW... Just a Savage note... The first pre-chambered and threaded aftermarket barrels I remember coming out for the Savage were from Sharp Shooter Supply. Fred Moreo, the guy making them (using Douglas blanks, at that time), contacted me and shipped me a couple of his barrels to field test and report back to him on.
One of them was a chromo .22BR that I used the absolute piss out of and is still shooting under .5 MOA consistently.
I really do not have any problem with Savage.
- DAA
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"Oh yeah, they're gonna talk to you, and talk to you, and talk to you about individual freedom, but they see a free individual, it's gonna scare 'em." -- George Hanson, Easy Rider, 1969.
Rocky Mountain Varmint Hunter
Posts: 2676 | From: Salt Lake City, UT | Registered: Jan 2003
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TOM64
Knows what it's all about
Member # 561
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posted June 18, 2015 12:41 PM
All this talk has given me the suppressor bug again.
I couldn't see what a 223 can at sub sonic speeds would offer that my 22 LR can doesn't but twice the bullet weight. Now after hearing reports of more doubles and even quads killed, I'm thinking super sonic ammo at a reduced volume with no real idea where the sound is coming from just might be worth it.
We are currently trying to set up a play date with our dealer. I'd like to demo a few before I buy. I will report what I find out if we can make it happen.
I'm thinking strictly a 223 can if I do it again.
Posts: 2283 | From: okieland | Registered: Feb 2005
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Fur_n_Dirt
So. Ariz. Zone Tech. Expert
Member # 4467
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posted June 18, 2015 02:39 PM
Even though I don't own one (yet), I think a 22LR can firing subsonic is ABSOLUTELY amazing. Everyone should own it..
I shot a coyote last year using a sub-sonic 223 hollow point round. Simply amazing! So quiet, you only hear the trigger. But, just not suitable enough. Kills them like high power airgun and I'm tired of chasing dead coyotes in the desert.
I don't know anyone that bought a suppressor and said its ok or not for me. Everyone that I talk to end up buying more..
I have two right now. No regrets until my wife finds out the $$ I have spent.
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--- It's all simple if you know what you are doing ---
Posts: 437 | From: Tucson | Registered: Sep 2013
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DAA
Utah/Promoted WESTERN REGIONAL Hunt Director
Member # 11
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posted June 19, 2015 04:35 AM
Keep us posted Tom.
I'm in Moab right now. Talked to my buddy last night. His is a Silencerco.I had not realized that they are local to me. Their shop is only a few minutes from my work. Will definitely give them a visit.
- DAA
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"Oh yeah, they're gonna talk to you, and talk to you, and talk to you about individual freedom, but they see a free individual, it's gonna scare 'em." -- George Hanson, Easy Rider, 1969.
Rocky Mountain Varmint Hunter
Posts: 2676 | From: Salt Lake City, UT | Registered: Jan 2003
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted June 19, 2015 07:15 AM
quote:
I'm thinking strictly a 223 can if I do it again. (Tom)
Hey, can you explain the above statement and reasoning? Why a can suitable only for a 223? It seems like a more robust muffler, like one designed to contain exhaust gasses from a 308, would surely be enough to do the same for a 223, and you would have versatility, to boot. Is it the size and the expense, or what?
All I am asking is for your reasoning, not questioning it. Ok, maybe it sounds like I am, but I thought I was "getting" this stuff, and now; don't know?
Good hunting. El Bee
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31465 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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Kelly Jackson
SECOND PLACE/GARTH BROOKS LOOK-A-LIKE CONTEST
Member # 977
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posted June 19, 2015 07:47 AM
those savages are cool......turned a 204AI into a 6.5 SAUM the other day on my lunch hour.
Cal/Brent/TR - I know yall hate to type as much as me, but can you give your thoughts on why a can helps you kill more coyotes on stand?
I have hunted with guys running cans and have seen missed coyotes check, then again I seen them check when missed without a can.
Seen the 2nd coyote leave when one was shot with a can.
I like the concept for sure both for whats left of my hearing, but also for my dogs.
Stay after them
Kelly
Posts: 997 | From: Comanche OK | Registered: Oct 2006
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted June 19, 2015 08:00 AM
Now, there's a question just begging for an answer!
I have read the stuff about multiples. But, I have seen them come in on a string, when shooting a 25'06Ackley.
So, do you mean ? more often? or what?
Good hunting. El Bee
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31465 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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TRnCO
FUTURE HALL OF FAMER
Member # 690
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posted June 19, 2015 08:26 AM
quote:
Hey, can you explain the above statement and reasoning? Why a can suitable only for a 223? It seems like a more robust muffler, like one designed to contain exhaust gasses from a 308, would surely be enough to do the same for a 223, and you would have versatility, to boot. Is it the size and the expense, or what?
For me, yes and yes, PLUS I rarely shoot any calibers larger than .22, and the weight savings is another factor.
Yes Kelly, we've all seen multiples killed without a can, BUT I sincerely believe it happens more often, for me, now that I have the can for the simple reason that more often than not the quieter rifle report simply doesn't spook them as badly as a normal centerfire. And that goes for coyotes that are on the scene at the shot and those that haven't gotten to the call yet. I believe this is probably true more so where coyotes are shot at from many sources, such as from the rancher feeding cattle, drive by's, etc. If a coyote has never been exposed to gun shots, it may very well not spook nearly as bad as one that has been there done that, hell it might not spook at all.
I filmed a kid shoot and miss a single coyote about a dozen times and the coyote never ran away. That was with an unsuppressed AR. The kid finally killed the coyote with I think the 13th shot. After words, I wish we would've let the coyote go, and breed, to have more dumb coyotes. I forget which Verminator video the footage is on, but it's the darndest thing ya ever did see. And the shots were all less than 150 yards. After each shot the coyote would flinch or jump a little and look to the sky as if to think it was thunder. Not hardly normal behavior.
IF for no other reason, I still highly suggest getting a suppressor if for no other reason but to make shooting more enjoyable. If you think it might help kill a coyote or two more, then so be it. BUT dang, why not make shooting more enjoyable since it's something we all enjoy so much to start with.
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Is it hunting season yet? I hate summer!
Posts: 996 | From: Elizabeth, CO | Registered: Aug 2005
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted June 19, 2015 09:14 AM
Partial answer: because I can't get past the feeling of being fucked for way more money than seems reasonable and by the bureaucratic regulations involved, and the time element, etc etc.
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31465 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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jimanaz
2nd Place RICHARD FARNSWORTH LOOK-A-LIKE CONTEST
Member # 3689
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posted June 19, 2015 04:58 PM
^^ I can't find the like button, but yeah, what he said.
My ears are fucked. You young'uns, maybe. Like KJ, I worry about shooting over the top of my dog, but not bad enough to spend that kind of dough.
Posts: 940 | From: AZ | Registered: Oct 2010
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TOM64
Knows what it's all about
Member # 561
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posted June 19, 2015 09:18 PM
Leonard, I am not ever gonna spend the money for real night vision, a 300 BO and a can to go after pigs. I just ain't that interested in spending that kinda money when I can build a trap for a couple of hundred bucks.
My 243 AI was priced and supposedly sold last week (that's where the suppressor money comes from) the rest of my guns are Kimber Montana's with pencil barrels in 22 and 20 caliber. So that leaves my 223 AR's with barrels heavy enough to support a suppressor and only a lighter one at that. I hate heavy guns and don't see myself building one for a suppressor, hunting anything bigger than coyotes or building a chunk rifle to shoot my steel range as flat as I can.
So less money, less weight and real world uses that I will see.
Another reason I'm thinking suppressor is a couple of weeks ago, a friend came home from a barrel racing to find a coyote trying to kill her dogs. I went out there the next evening and found out she lives on 5 acres with neighbors on 3 sides of her and a 50 acre hay field behind her with a house across that I might add. Anyway as I sat there wondering what the neighbors are going to say when I start shooting so close, I thought a can would've been nice. Turns out I called a coyote to 15 yards, lost him in the tall grass, passed up shots due to houses and equipment behind him then got one fleeting shot at 250 yards unsupported off my knee... I'll take a shotgun when I go after them again.
Posts: 2283 | From: okieland | Registered: Feb 2005
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TOM64
Knows what it's all about
Member # 561
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posted June 19, 2015 09:27 PM
I also had a conversation at dinner tonight with a friend who doesn't hunt but wants to try coyotes. One of his questions was will they come in after you've shot another one? I came up with several instances where shots didn't matter even on deer.
But I still have to wonder if a suppressor will make a difference.
Posts: 2283 | From: okieland | Registered: Feb 2005
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3 Toes
El Guapo
Member # 1327
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posted June 20, 2015 03:35 AM
Another quick note among the reasons for suppression. It removes a bunch of recoil. We all know that even some of the lighter calibers recoil. When you get to the 6mm, 25, and 6.5 caliber especially. Sometimes the recoil is enough to lose your sight picture and with coyotes I hate that. I want to see them crumple. Anyway, I'm also convinced that low recoil and low noise makes shooting much easier. Better groups on paper and better hits on coyotes.
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Violence may not be the best option....
But it is still an option.
Posts: 1034 | From: out yonder | Registered: Apr 2007
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted June 20, 2015 07:17 AM
That's first mention of recoil reduction? Unless I just missed it?
My recoil reduction for night hunting has always been heavy. My 25'06Ackley doesn't get used all that much, long shots, weighs 21 pounds. But recoil is quite manageable. I have a 200 yard group out in the shop, all 3 rounds touching, very symmetrical. I wouldn't want to lug it around though?
Good hunting. El Bee
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31465 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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3 Toes
El Guapo
Member # 1327
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posted June 20, 2015 03:19 PM
It may be the first mention, but they do work like a muzzle break. Probably better than most breaks, without the added noise.
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Violence may not be the best option....
But it is still an option.
Posts: 1034 | From: out yonder | Registered: Apr 2007
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Brent Parker
Knows what it's all about
Member # 4354
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posted June 20, 2015 03:55 PM
Kelly,
I noticed in the open desert were there is nothing for the shot noise to bounce off of it seems pretty quiet. I think the sound of the shot is changed/distorted enough that the coyotes dont really recognise it. The first stand I spent with a suppressor I killed a double. They came in as singles, the first one I shot at 50 yards and it was staring at the dog, the second one was 150 to 175 yards away and coming when I shot the first one. It stopped and looked around and then came on in As it kept coming. I killed it at roughly 100 yards.I wouldn't consider that normal behavior in my area. The thing that really surprised me was my dog knows when the shot goes off there should be something to chew on, those first couple she didn't even look. She didn't recognize that sound as a shot. It was enough to convince me right there.
I have mentioned it before but I shot more doubles the first year with a suppressor than I did the previous 8 yrs. I don't believe my stand selection or my calling style changed that much and our population was at the bottom of the cycle.
It helps with your hearing sure but my hearing is poor already, but I do know your DOGS will approve. That was the one thing I saw with Lilly and Mickey both tended to bring coyote back and stand just off to the side of you out front. I saw both of them shake their heads after a shot more than once. I never saw it again after going to a suppressor.
Brent
Posts: 172 | From: 2 miles east of Vic | Registered: Mar 2013
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Kelly Jackson
SECOND PLACE/GARTH BROOKS LOOK-A-LIKE CONTEST
Member # 977
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posted June 22, 2015 06:29 AM
I've took the breaks off a couple of rifles and screwed a can on, the recoil reduction seems 20% better than the breaks. A big plus for sure.
Posts: 997 | From: Comanche OK | Registered: Oct 2006
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DanS
Scorched Earth (AZ Sector)
Member # 316
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posted June 23, 2015 07:06 AM
Good grief, you guys aren't helping. Brent keeps getting on my ass to get a can. I keep resisting, but I think I am over the edge now.
Fred, funny thing is Brent keeps telling me to cut my 6x45 barrel down to about 18" and screw on a can for coyotes. Been using the 55 NBT's but am going to try the 58 Hornady VMAX's. Both shoot very very well. I generally don't shoot past a couple hundred yards anyway. 300+ is very rare for me. I could probably find a 22-250AI or my 223 AI version to work fine too.
[ June 23, 2015, 07:08 AM: Message edited by: DanS ]
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futuaris nisi irrisus ridebis
Saepe Expertus, Semper Fidelis, Fratres Aeterni:
Often Tested, Always Faithful. Brothers Forever!
Posts: 1465 | From: flyover country | Registered: Feb 2004
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Fur_n_Dirt
So. Ariz. Zone Tech. Expert
Member # 4467
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posted June 23, 2015 07:35 AM
I don't shoot vmax's out of a can.. Vendors typically state that if you shoot anything besides FMJ's it voids warranty.
Well, that doesn't cut it for coyotes.. I've tried to find data on which bullets are OK and which ones to stay away from.
The last thing you want to do is spend almost $1500 bucks and have a bullet fragment or nick inside the can..
So, I've been using high quality hollow points (sierra for me) and no issues using the GEMTEK at peak velocities.
Not sure I have enough balls to use a fragment bullet like a Vmax..
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--- It's all simple if you know what you are doing ---
Posts: 437 | From: Tucson | Registered: Sep 2013
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted June 23, 2015 09:37 AM
Then you might want to try the Nosler 55 gr. Ballistic Tip.Everyone I talk to says they are of a beefier construction, although I'm not sure if that means empirically, (terminally) or the bullet actually has a heavier jacket?
Good hunting. El Bee
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31465 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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Krustyklimber
prefers the bunny hugger pronunciation: ky o tee
Member # 72
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posted June 23, 2015 11:37 AM
Just thinking out loud here; but if one just can't live with a rifle that's six inches longer, and also can't live with cutting off six inches of barrel... why not split the difference?
Can you go with a barrel that's three inches shorter and a rifle that's three inches longer?
Leonard,
Thanks for talkin' me down, I got all caught up in it and dang near considered a suppressed .22Hornet for the semi-urban farmland hunting environment back east. ![[Wink]](wink.gif)
Krusty
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Think about how stupid the average person is, then realize that half of them are stupider than that!
Posts: 1912 | From: Deep in the Blue Ridge Mountains of Virginia | Registered: Jan 2003
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knockemdown
Our staff photo editing Guru, par excellence
Member # 3588
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posted June 24, 2015 03:05 AM
Dan, if my AO were 'can friendly', I'da had one for years & would prolly still own that 16" 6x45 I had.
Funny thing is, our night hunting regs are fairly tolerant (as long as you hunt on foot). It'd sure be nice to have a suppressed centerfire for calling some farms after dark without waking the farmer's wife up with a "BOOM!" @ 2am...
Just sayin', if its legal, GET ONE!!!
Posts: 2202 | From: behind fascist lines | Registered: Mar 2010
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted June 24, 2015 04:37 AM
"It's just Heat Lightning, go back to sleep!"
On second thought, do they know what heat lightning is, in Nu Yawk?
So far, their Keystone cops can't seem to find a couple escapees?
I hear they are providing peanut butter traps for all those cabins in the woods?
Imagine, borrowing all those power tools in the middle of the night and waking up nobody? Sounds like the whole friggin' town works at the jail?
Good hunting. El Bee
(just kidding, Fred. You are our favorite Nu Yawker. Next to Cuomo.)
[ June 24, 2015, 04:38 AM: Message edited by: Leonard ]
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31465 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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Brent Parker
Knows what it's all about
Member # 4354
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posted June 24, 2015 05:33 AM
DanS,
Since I am such a good friend, send that 6x45 to me I'll get it cut for you and shoot a few more coyotes with it till you get your can! That way all load work and testing will be done for you!! I think that 6x45 with a 16-18" barrel and a can would make a dandy little calling rifle and pretty quiet as well. AH the trouble I'll go thru for you buddy..
Posts: 172 | From: 2 miles east of Vic | Registered: Mar 2013
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